Tier 11 Valor Point Hotfix

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95 Draenei Death Knight
6060
As a guild leader I have to say thank you Blizz. I had one officer in my guild running the Zandalari dungeons 21 times a week across 3 of his alts to keep them competitive for our guild's 5 raid teams.

Our guild has only downed 1 boss in the Firelands, and it is only one of our raid teams. This left the only options for our raiders to have to run ZA/ZG ad nauseum. (My guild is the kind of guild this change helps the most, and there are a great many guild's like this).

I'm glad to have this as another option for our guild's raiders to save them from burnout from having to somewhere dig up another 10+ hours from their personal lives to spam farm these things, especially across multiple toons.

And as a guild leader who has limited time due to many work hours, and much of the rest of it spent with my guild, thank you very much.
90 Undead Mage
4930
Still, the point is you will allow people who have never set foot in Firelands to overgear the content, when the fights are tuned for people in T 11 gear, in particular the early bosses.


Overgear the content with a few valor items? Come on now.

No matter what anyone wants to think about ilvl or what a few set pieces can offer, people aren't going to equip some valor boots and suddenly start rolling over bosses.


the T12 Body, Legs and Gloves will. Don't pretend that being 3/5 Tier from running 5 mans and the nerfed last tier means nothing. Especially for tanks and healers.

A FL tank (just starting FL normal progression) that has 3/5 T12 will have FAR less challenge as a raid tank than one wearing Zuls and T11 gear.
Edited by Gariss on 7/19/2011 2:17 AM PDT
85 Blood Elf Priest
10125
Thank you! The endless ZA/ZG grind was getting really stale. It's nice to know we now have more options.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
10345
A FL tank (just starting FL normal progression) that has 3/5 T12 will have FAR less challenge as a raid tank than one wearing Zuls and T11 gear.


A tank in zg and t11 gear will still be wearing 3/5 t12. You do know vp comes from zg and za right?
90 Undead Mage
4930
07/19/2011 02:23 AMPosted by Hippolaitus
A FL tank (just starting FL normal progression) that has 3/5 T12 will have FAR less challenge as a raid tank than one wearing Zuls and T11 gear.


A tank in zg and t11 gear will still be wearing 3/5 t12. You do know vp comes from zg and za right?
What if the tank in question refuses to buy the T12 on principle because he still wants the fights to be a challenge and not a faceroll?
Edited by Gariss on 7/19/2011 2:26 AM PDT
85 Goblin Hunter
5605
How about give Justice Points for WotlK raids? Maybe just for the last boss say 35JP?
85 Draenei Paladin
7410


Overgear the content with a few valor items? Come on now.

No matter what anyone wants to think about ilvl or what a few set pieces can offer, people aren't going to equip some valor boots and suddenly start rolling over bosses.



bashiok , have i ever told you i love you?
I generally make it a point to never comment on forum topics like this.

That being said, I'm going to.

I've been on both sides of this issue, so I can see where both those for and against it stand. I've been the toon in full tier or near it (not this toon, obviously) getting annoyed at the more 'casuals' who wanted to be able to access the same gear I had, as fast as I had it, without putting the same amount of mind numbing effort into it raid after raid. It was annoying and I hated it. I understand that.

Now, due to several factors, this toon didn't get to progress through the cata expansion at the same rate as everyone else did. He wasn't on the cutting edge of raiding. And as such, half on my current guildies are ready for Firelands. Want nothing to do with the old raids. Understandably. Which leaves the people in the middle there kinda... screwed. We don't get the ability to go for t11 sets because those raids no longer offer an incentive to the people past that point. But it'd be nice to have that stuff in order to DO the FL content. So... I can see where the people for the change stand too. Awarding SOME VP would give incentive for people who Need the gear from older cata raids to progress on, the ability to actually find raids doing them. (Or a decent lure for guildies to not have to rollface troll heroics...)

Not all of the people behind on content and gear are there because they are bad, there are a lot of factors that make that happen. (Life issues, raid ready available players on your server, getting people to show UP to raids..) Some just got behind somehow, and now can't catch up. It happens.

That being said, I agree with what others have suggested. That, if valors are to be awarded for the older cata content and the troll heroics, it should be in small enough numbers that there is a significant space of time between the serious, dedicated raiders getting shinies, and the rest of us.
85 Troll Warrior
1910
07/19/2011 02:26 AMPosted by Gariss


A tank in zg and t11 gear will still be wearing 3/5 t12. You do know vp comes from zg and za right?
What if the tank in question refuses to buy the T12 on principle because he still wants the fights to be a challenge and not a faceroll?
Speaking as a tank, no. We don't purposefully gimp ourselves "on principle." We get better gear so that everyone else can stay alive easier. I assure you neither DPS nor healers gimp themselves because gear is easily obtainable.
80 Tauren Druid
2115
Why the resistance about this change?

It's not like people couldn't already max out valor just running heroics. This just allows guilds to get a little extra valor while running some older content, and save a few hours having to run heroics.
85 Tauren Paladin
BUR
6350
Thank god for raids giving points again, I couldn't bring myself to run anymore #*!!ty 5 mans on my alts. I've cleared t11 content in blues once, I'm sure I can do the nerfed versions again.
100 Night Elf Druid
7665
Thank you very much for this. My casual raid guild is still trying to gear people in T11 and this will help alot. We can now work on helping people learn raid mechanics in T11 raids and get a few valor in the process rather than running useless outdated heroics over and over.

<3
100 Draenei Hunter
16075
Thanks, maybe it'll be easier to get groups together for them :D
85 Human Paladin
6640
Good change. ZA/ZG awarding 140 VP and a Cataclysm Raid awarding JP? That was freaking me out.

Even if they are nerfed, group up with other 9 person still is way more difficult than simply run a Zandalari heroic.
85 Draenei Shaman
6170
The simple truth was that for many players it was a better expense of time to run heroics until valor capped than to pursue T11 raids. There are only a handful of slots that can't be equipped by justice and valor epics at this point (shoulders, helms, weapons, off-hands). Smiths can take care of weapons at this point better than T11 can. Running T11 raids at the cost of not having time to valor cap for the week is for most players a net loss (378 wands, necks, bracers, chests, gloves, pants, necks, rings, relics are a better reward than lower level gear from T11).

Sure, there's a point where players could run out of things to purchase with valor, but we won't see that for a couple months, and by then players might still be better off just going into Firelands with a zandalari head/shoulders and new blacksmithed 365 weapons than spending any time in T11. This change makes that transition more gradual.
85 Human Mage
9800
07/18/2011 07:28 PMPosted by Drkorq
Thanks for less ZA/ZG
90 Troll Hunter
11815
Any retroactive VP awarding going to be going on for those of us who have been clearing BOT/BWD/T4W since 4.2? Probably not feasable, but if they gave the PVPers compensation for that whole fiasco....would be nice of em to do us PVE'ers a similar good turn....
85 Human Paladin
1360
TYVM BLIZZ makes ya feel good to know that you guys really are listening :)
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