Topic
Playing a Hunter in PvP is not fun
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Edited by Audaces on 7/27/11 7:56 AM (PDT)
If I can even ignore the discourse that has taken place over the forums for the last.. several years, I really feel like the game as a whole is finally in a place where we can be honest and objective about what's going on with my class in PvP.
I have been spending time lately, trying to work out things with a sponsorship for playing this game competitively, leading a guild that only PvPs and more and more it's just so obvious that everyone with any serious experience in high-end PvP understands that my class in particular is useless. I watch videos from Burning Crusade, like.. arena videos. The players from that era are much, much worse than your average player today. Back then you could expect a Gladiator to have keybinds, a basic understanding of a damage rotation and that's about it. Nowadays just to compete you need a focus frame, full focus functionality of all your off-target abilities and a general idea of clutch things you might need to perform if you want to be successful. Players are getting better and as this happens, Hunter is getting worse. I really don't feel I need to dignify that whole 1% business with a response, but whatever. I'll compile a list. Hunter is too weak when trained. By a lot. I have no protection against DoTs, no incentive for melee not to train me(unlike every other ranged damage dealer) and no way to regenerate my resource while being attacked by the opposing team in 3v3. Let's look at it this way: my armor grants me 13% more physical damage reduction than a Mage. Outside of that, every spell a Mage has is more effective than every spell a Hunter has. Blink doesn't require combat, has a lower cooldown, breaks roots/stuns and is easier to use. Disengage is literally worse on every level. Casting speed slows hurt Hunters way, way too much. Arcane Slow increases my Steady Shot cast time by 60%. Mages actually do play Arcane in rated battlegrounds. So, basically, an instant cast ability with no cooldown that is applied when the Mage attacks me totally negates my character. It can't be dispelled because it has no cooldown. Not only that, but things like Frost Fever and Infected Wounds last too long, and totally ruin my ability to deal damage. I can't even trinket out of them if I want to. This is totally too powerful. CC is far, far too limited. Scatter Shot being a requisite for Freezing Trap is awkward and entirely too counterable. Our itemization is.. ridiculous. We require spell penetration, 5% hit(instead of 4% like every other ranged damage dealer), a weapon chain and then we still have huge amounts of like, Haste and Mastery on our gear. Worst itemization by far. Hunter has no meta-games, at all. No use fakecasting against a Hunter, no incentive not to attack him, no incentive not to leave him totally open. No niche, no mana burn, no dispel protection, no offensive dispel prowess - nothing. -- Hunter is the least represented class in the arena and rated battlegrounds and is the second most popular class played actively at level 85. I really do think it's time for a fix. |
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This is an awesome, well thought out thread that I wholeheartedly agree with. Therefore I assume it will be trolled and summarily deleted : /
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I wish your guild name was an appropriate response here, but it's not :(
I don't PvP on my hunter for many of the reasons you mention. My own short list would be: 1. It's overly complicated (i.e. requires too many abilities). 2. Melee wrecks me, DoT classes wreck me. 3. I don't have enough burst, even with a full focus bar, to kill anything. The end result being it's just not an enjoyable experience. |
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1 Hunter got a legitimate R1 last season. 1. I am telling you flat out that no team with a Hunter on it can queue everyday and maintain a Gladiator level rating. It is simply impossible vs cleaves of both casters and melee.
Hunter fits into absolutely no tournament viable comps. |
85 Undead Warlock
3190
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I support most of this.
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People say this, and yet they give no reason why. Here is why representation DOES matter. People, as a group, always choose the path of least resistance. The Hunter class is plagued by all of the things mentioned by the OP, thus making them one of the most difficult classes to play in PvP for a good player, and borderline impossible for an average or new player. When people start flocking to a certain class, such as a mage for example, and abandoning hunters, it shows that there is an imbalance. Namely, hunters are too difficult and mages are too easy. |
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Edited by Audaces on 7/27/11 9:55 AM (PDT)
That lot about how Hunter is just so hard to play, but really really good is fallacious. My personal theory is, when good players run into a Hunter above 2700, the Hunter has to be on top of his game so their entire impression of Hunters is they are good in the hands of a good player, whereas a 2700 Mage or Warlock can still be lacking on very many of his meta-games and still usually come out on top due to comp, or whatever.
When people say it is, "difficult" to play a Hunter in PvP, it isn't like they mean it's hard to use the spells. They mean it's hard to use them to be as good as spells that are clearly better than the ones we have. Please explain how representation doesn't mean anything. Please explain how me and one other Hunter got Gladiator on my battlegroup(3rd most populated)last season, when 95 people total got it from 3v3. Please explain how one Hunter got R1 in the whole world(legitimately) in 3v3. I've played Warlock in tournaments. Hunter is not even close and is a joke currently in the arena, meaning an auto-win for almost any comp featuring a Restoration Shaman and a Warlock. Why doesn't representation mean anything? Reporting your post for trolling, by the way. You can't just say, "this doesn't mean anything, and I thought you were banned." I swear, I wish some of you people would actually have a conversation in real life.. you know, with educated people and say something like, "well 1% representation is a problem, but not when 1% of the representation is overpowered 100% of the time" You people truly do not understand statistics. |
You guys don't seem to understand Blizzard's logic. Think about how particularly unlikely your suggested scenario is. Warriors felt the same way (and still do, thanks to tunnel vision) about their ungodly amount of nerfs patch after patch after Cata. They're not going to fix your problems "right this instant", which is implied that you think should happen. They release patches at dates, not when hunters want to be buffed or warriors want to be less tunnel-visioned. |
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Edited by Audaces on 7/27/11 10:03 AM (PDT)
You guys don't seem to understand Blizzard's logic. Listen, buddy. We have literally been the lowest represented class in the arena for 10 seasons straight. Literally. Can you please not come into my thread and talk to me about stuff like this, that has nothing to do with my topic, when you're clearly ignorant as to the truth of the matter? It's insulting. It isn't constructive and it isn't why I made this thread. edit: the class just sucks to play comparatively. Look at what I got this expansion: Cobra Shot, a pet slot, Camouflage and Aspect of the Fox. I never use Cobra Shot. I always have a pet out, so that didn't change anything. I never use Camouflage. I have to use Aspect of the Fox because my class is completely dependent on me casting these weak little slowable attacks that crit for 7000 and hit for 3500 over and over so I had to be able to move while I spam them because I have to spam them to get my resource back, or I won't deal damage. Look at what everyone else got this expansion. I rest my case. Look at how outdated my traps are. Look at how outdated my aspects are. Blizzard hasn't honestly developed this class in almost two and a half years. It isn't fun to see stuff that is obviously just being ignored(like Roar of Recovery restoring 30 focus over 9 seconds, on a ridiculous cooldown.. come on) while every other class is asking for tweaks when they are, at worst case, middle of the pack in PvE and PvP. As of this morning, Elemental Shamans officially have more representation above 2600 than Hunters. That's just Elemental Shamans. You don't view that as a problem..? |
Can you please not come into my thread and talk to me about stuff like this, that has nothing to do with my topic, when you're clearly ignorant as to the truth of the matter? Wasn't talking to you, though. |
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PLEASE report the trolls, starting with Boomshacka.
Just report them, do not respond to them. Use your ability to eliminate their presence from this thread. This message needs to be heard. |
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Edited by Audaces on 7/27/11 10:10 AM (PDT)
Do you have any experience working with the Blizzard/World of Warcraft development team that would qualify you to say, "they aren't going to fix it this instant?" Do Warriors have anything to do with this? Are you truly saying that, of all the players of the ten classes above 2600, 1% of them being Hunters is fine? So.. that 1% is overpowered 100% of the time? Please attend college and go to a math class and say something along those lines and then explain that you are not joking. Better yet, please explain to me how the game is so finely balanced that Hunters having higher than 1% representation would be overpowered, when Restoration Shamans were almost at 15% last season. |
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PLEASE report the trolls, starting with Boomshacka. my bad, yo. I will not respond to anymore. |
Do you have any experience working with the Blizzard/World of Warcraft development team that would qualify you to say, "they aren't going to fix it this instant?" What, you think that they will? Patches take around a couple months to develop, depending on the stuff released. That's where I'm coming from. Are you truly saying that, of all the classes above 2600, 1% of them being Hunters is fine? Are you saying that that 1% of Hunters is overpowered 100% of the time? Please attend college and go to a math class and say something along those lines and then explain that you are not joking. Where in any of my posts have I said that hunters were in a perfect/"fine" place? Better yet, please explain to me how the game is so finely balanced that Hunters having higher than 1% representation would be overpowered, when Restoration Shamans were almost at 15% last season. I only said that they aren't going to fix it right now, mostly directed at the ludicrous number of hunter threads like this one. Do Warriors have anything to do with this? I'd say that in the sense that they're not all that fun to play when you take into consideration their tunnel vision (read: can only do damage well, little utility) and the fact that they get smashed by anything that charge-jumps them and on those notes are somewhat similar to hunters, yeah, what I said had some relevance. |
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Edited by Audaces on 7/27/11 10:18 AM (PDT)
You have 1/8 of the experience I have, and are much less skilled than I am at the game. Please respect that fact enough to allow my argument to take precedence. If you have issues with Warriors, please make your own thread.
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