A Brief History of Alterac Valley

90 Human Warlock
6775
I am convinced Blizzard has no respect for the PvPing masses. To state things like "it would be easier to start from scratch" is just treating us like fools. Reverting to vanilla AV would be as simple as copy/paste. The code is already there. A few slight tweaks to remove it from the random lists and away we go.
FFS even just upping the reinforcements would be a step in the right direction and that could not possibly be simpler to implement. But no. It is like somebody had a bad experience in old AV and now shy away from anything to do with it no matter how much we plead.

TB and WG were pathetic compared to current AV let alone the REAL AV. Blizz developers must be out of their minds to think otherwise. Just basic participation stats show the truth of how "good" TB and WG were. Both BGs are deserted permanently now.

There is absolutely no good reason for blizz to keep refusing our requests for bringing back the old AV as a standalone BG separate from the random Q. For them to keep ignoring us shows their contempt and disdain for PvPers and I for one am getting sick of it.

BRING BACK THE OLD AV!!!!!!
90 Human Death Knight
9290
I have played off and on since vanilla. And like so many have said before me, vanilla AV was my favorite experience in WoW. Slaying dragons is fun, arenaing is fun, heck even the other bgs are fun. But the truly epic battle feel you got from the old AVs are like none other. Trying to get your flight masters and wolf riders up at the same time, so you can make a push to Vann. Or trying to figure out who was trying to kite Lok'holar the Ice Lord to vann before he grew to full size.
Vanilla AV wasnt just a battle ground, it was a warzone. you didnt feel like you were stuck in a bg and what you did really had no effect. (come on, how does running a flag in wsg solve anything) When AV was done, you knew who owned the valley. there was no doubt who the winners were.

The people that enjoy the PvE aspect of WoW have short little 5 mans, and epic raids. Why can the PvPers not have our short little arenas/BGs and our Epic AV?
85 Worgen Warrior
2580
I played a few AV's today and well 90% of them was zergs just five was turtles or well a force turtle.
8 Undead Mage
0
He also stated in another thread that it would be easier to re-do AV from scratch than to try to revert the changes.
We haven't stopped talking about it. Part of the problem is Battlegrounds are incredibly scripted, to the point they're actually worked on quite a bit by our encounter design team. We need to keep working on new ways of developing Battlegrounds to improve their design.

But, to your point, it's doubtful AV 1.0 will be resurrected, and there's only so much tweaking we can do to try and improve the current one -- we'd be working on very old framework with AV. At this point, it'd probably be easier and produce better results if we started from scratch.
Lets look at AV:

1. Graveyards stay the same. Unless you count adding the troll boss back. I find it hard to believe they don't have any version control and they can't just pull that back up. Even if they can't, how hard can it be? Put a boss on the hill and make him kill people that come near. Seems pretty basic.

2. Bunkers would have their NPC guards restored. That can't be a huge scripting job.

3. Mines added to the field of strife. Make one, copy-paste.

4. Assuming they restore the two passes that were closed, there were NPCs there.

What else have they changed? They removed a load of wandering NPCs. But I still can't imagine that it is that hard for them - based off of all of the thousands of NPCs they have scattered around the world - to put a guy in and have him path back and forth. These weren't much more complex (if at all) than the dwarves + owls that wander up and down the road.

The wing commanders are all still in. They still will return, and will still take flight. The wolf riders and ram riders (though I haven't seen the ram riders in a year, I have seen the wolf riders) are still in. Both Ivus and Lok are in still and behaving as normal. The druids and shaman are still in and functional.

I can't imagine that so much scripting was really lost. There were some patrols, and the troll boss. Everything else is still there.
85 Human Mage
0
10/30/2011 07:15 PMPosted by Phemoir
I can't imagine that so much scripting was really lost. There were some patrols, and the troll boss. Everything else is still there.


Even if there are a few things missing, it doesn't have to be exact. The point is to bring back the spirit of the thing.

_________________________________________________________________________
"A Treatise on Bluetip Threshers"
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3424907465
"A 'Brief' History of AV"
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2952885503
90 Human Paladin
10420
Old AV was amazing. I spent much time there back in the day as well, and still enjoy viewing some old screenshots I took of it. It was really awesome to see Ivus AND Lokholar up at the same time in the field of strife, causing mass chaos.

As things have been stated multiple times, returning old AV with a separate queue wouldn't be all that much work, and would give WoW a huge battle which it currently does not have.
90 Night Elf Druid
16180
10/30/2011 07:15 PMPosted by Phemoir
I can't imagine that so much scripting was really lost. There were some patrols, and the troll boss. Everything else is still there.


I didn't buy that answer at all. As I posted in response to that post at the time, we don't want a map reworked from fresh. We know they can hotfix quest requirements, health and damage - they just won't. A fundamental problem with the current implementation of Alterac Valley is that you look at the NPC's and they die. You shouldn't be able to three man bosses in 40 man battlegrounds and they shouldn't have health and damage less than bosses from expansions ago. (All the bosses currently have less health than raid bosses in Burning Crusade, 15 levels later)

A few new abilities to mobs (starfall for the Arch druid, anyone?), a significant increase to health and damage and a few more mobs added to protect bunkers and towers (such as the commanders, but maybe new NPC's to represent missing races), an increase to reinforcements to 1000 and making mines useful would sort out AV.
90 Goblin Mage
5565
The bosses need to be buffed big time. For quite a long time the horde needed 3 bunkers down and the alliance all 4 towers(usually) to be able to take out the generals. Then with improvements in gear the horde could do it with 2 and now we've reached the point where the alliance can as well. I miss the days where you fought tooth and nail for just one tower to keep the general alive. You can recap iceblood tower and tower point now and it's like it doesn't even matter.
85 Worgen Warrior
2580
Bump.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
8295
I never got the chance to experience the old AV but I hate the current incarnation of the battleground. I've heard amazing stories about AV battles from various people and I'm very interested in participating in a battleground that many people say was the highlight of their WoW carreer.

I've been craving a more war-zone like PvP experience for a long time now. Current battlegrounds just aren't all that emerisive(sp?) to me. An enormous war-zone like AV with hundreds of NPCs and players smashing against each other for control sounds like just the thing I need to have as much fun in PvP as I did when I was first getting into it.

/signed
1 Dwarf Warrior
0
I've been craving a more war-zone like PvP experience for a long time now. Current battlegrounds just aren't all that emerisive(sp?) to me. An enormous war-zone like AV with hundreds of NPCs and players smashing against each other for control sounds like just the thing I need to have as much fun in PvP as I did when I was first getting into it.

/signed


I'm sorry you missed it, because that is EXACTLY how old AV was.

Every current BG atm is just a quick little sideshow that is basically just get your honor and get out. Winning/losing doesn't really matter, if you lose its just oh well, queue again and be quick about it.

In old AV, you fought TOOTH AND NAIL for every last scrap of ground to the bitter end. I've never seen anything like it in any other MMO...such a wonder to behold during the glory days.

Blizzard...please bring this back....you have no idea how much my enthusiasm for the Dev team has plummeted ever since you removed this masterpiece.
Edited by Panicbeard on 11/1/2011 6:45 AM PDT
85 Worgen Warrior
2580
Blizzard...please bring this back....you have no idea how much my enthusiasm for the Dev team has plummeted ever since you removed this masterpiece.[/quote]

AV was a true masterpiece.
85 Human Mage
0
11/01/2011 07:13 PMPosted by Shamwowftw
OH MAN I CAN STILL REMEMBER COLLECTING BLOOD!


I try to pick up storm crystals now and then, but the zerg inevitably reaches Vanndar before I can make more than a few turnins.

It's disgusting, really, how Blizzard has sacrificed so many truly epic experiences in favour of making a few extra bucks.

_________________________________________________________________________
"A Treatise on Bluetip Threshers"
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3424907465
"A 'Brief' History of AV"
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2952885503
90 Gnome Mage
11350
Read the entire post which took about 20 mins, and agree with everything on it.
I only got to play the 2.3 and later AV (Because i dont remember any syndicate or trolls in AV)
But it was a heck of alot fun for me then, but now with the zergs its just no fun having the big elementals was awesome.
83 Blood Elf Death Knight
970
I'm fairly new to WOW and just started doing the BGs recently. The first time I queued up in AV and looked at the map I thought "Wow, this is really cool".

I followed the crowed into the first tower and jumped in on killing the boss. Upon exit there were a bunch of alliance pvp'ers there and another fight broke out. For some reason there wasn't a zerg and it was it was a giant melee that went on until the timer clicked down. It was fun, but the timer kind of killed it.

The next time I queued up I experienced the Zerg. I don't like it, but I understand the mechanics that make it the most practical way of winning and don't fight it. You either do it and win or don't do it and loose. It sucks because it has all the right elements for a really cool BG, but the timer makes it so that you couldn't win everything even if you wanted to.
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