Smouldering Essences

85 Goblin Mage
13720
It's more like, 10mans will get 1 Legendary, 25's will get between 2 and 3. The old numbers that let heroic 25s already complete 1-2 staves was a major problem to Blizzard and so they nerfed it for the future. That's a bummer to everyone who didn't get to wallow in the good-times, and a blunder on Blizzard's end to not have noticed sooner. It's not however some sinister plot against all that's holy. If you want to complain about comparative staff completion, consider the rates going forward, as that's pretty clearly where they aimed their sights conceding that they really couldn't do anything about drops already received.

The change is sensible, far later than such a change should have occurred and there are some consequences to that delay. It does not represent a vindictive attack on 10's no matter how victimized you may feel.


I don't think anyone is seriously saying its a specific attack on 10s intentionally but the end result is that's exactly how it works out. A 25 man guild starting their first legendary today would get 2-3 staffs but the fact is that FL has been out for a couple months and most 25 man raiding guilds have already completed 1 staff at the very least. High end guilds are about to complete their 3rd (or have already done so) and many 25 mans have 2 already. So you will have most 25 man raiding guilds ending up with at least 4-5 while 10 mans will only get 1. That's a far cry from the ratio Blizzard said they wanted.

I'm angry at Blizzard for a few reasons regarding this change. First - I'm amazed that they could not somehow foresee the rates at which 25 man guilds would obtain the staffs. There's a bit of RNG to the gathering portions but its not a huge difference and if you looked at the average numbers of each item that would be obtained you can clearly see how we got here. Someone had to make the decision as to how many of each item would drop for each type (10/25/normal/heroic). And then likely that had to be approved or vetted by at least a few other people. So how does that simple math escape notice?

Once you get past the initial development phase and onto live realms it was again too long before we reached this point. Obviously data is gathered from all aspects of the game so its a lot to sort through but I would have to think that something pertaining to a legendary would be tracked fairly closely. So either that data wasn't monitored well, which is a big problem, or it was and their reaction was way too slow. Either way it is an issue.

Finally, there is no reason that this change had to be implemented all at once. If this was their end goal as to the drop rates (and this change does ensure a pretty good ratio between 10 and 25 going forward) then they could have implemented it in 25 man at this time while waiting a set amount of time to allow the leading 10 mans to have the same relative drop rate as the leading 25 mans experienced, and then made this change in about 6 weeks as 10 mans would be completing their first staff. This would allow 10 mans to get about 2 staffs, depending on progression, as 25 mans would get 5, again depending on their progression and acquisition rate. That keeps things to the ratio they promised and ensures that 10 mans wouldn't have to wait until this tier is completely trivialized to actually obtain their first staff.
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100 Human Paladin
8015
09/07/2011 05:51 PMPosted by Firestyle
Actually 6/7H 25-man guilds (the top ones at least) are about to get their third staff.


So this is basically a nerf to 10 man raiding guilds.
Pretty much. While it does limit 25H guilds as well, it is pathetically obvious how this change completely gimps 10H guilds. I simply don't understand how they can possibly equate 10H to 25N.
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85 Goblin Rogue
6160
09/08/2011 06:49 AMPosted by Stalam
I would love if we could get an actual Blue response to this issue for 10 man guilds.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123245166?page=4#63
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123246109?page=3#46
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85 Goblin Shaman
TG
6090
They should buff 10m H siphon rate to be on par with 25m normal at least so that my guild can have 3 people siphoning at the same time. 1 in the main clear, 1 in the 25m alt run after that and 1 in the 10m alt progression group I run. With 7 bosses only this tier it is surprisingly how fast you can clear the instance (can do 7/7H clear + 7/7N in 1 night). So yeah I support all the 10ms QQing about this change.
Edited by Jinto on 9/8/2011 7:39 AM PDT
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100 Human Paladin
8015
09/08/2011 07:28 AMPosted by Shibs
I would love if we could get an actual Blue response to this issue for 10 man guilds.

<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123245166?page=4#63">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123245166?page=4#63</a>
<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123246109?page=3#46">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123246109?page=3#46</a>
Neither of those responses gives adequate reasoning or even a specific response as to the reason behind the enormous disparity between 10 and 25. In fact, what Daxx offers stinks of a canned response.
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87 Blood Elf Priest
12610
09/08/2011 09:28 AMPosted by Dynati

<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123245166?page=4#63">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123245166?page=4#63</a>
<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123246109?page=3#46">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3123246109?page=3#46</a>
Neither of those responses gives adequate reasoning or even a specific response as to the reason behind the enormous disparity between 10 and 25. In fact, what Daxx offers stinks of a canned response.

Can you read? He spells it out. The legendary was about to be incredibly common, so they adjusted drop rates. They cut heroic bonuses to the same rate as normal. They admit that such a change should have happened sooner.

What more can you want from a response? They said why, and are aware that they made a mistake initially and another one in waiting so long to correct it. I wish blue posts were always so informative.
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90 Goblin Priest
8855
Just wanted to express my distaste for the change in the drop rates I will not have the staff for at least 3months now and we clear every week. Total bummer the new content will likely be out before I get mine. Please fix this.
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87 Blood Elf Priest
12610
09/08/2011 10:51 AMPosted by Theblyte
Just wanted to express my distaste for the change in the drop rates I will not have the staff for at least 3months now and we clear every week. Total bummer the new content will likely be out before I get mine. Please fix this.

You're only killing Heroic Shannox, the essence change amounts to 1 extra boss/week for you roughly.
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85 Tauren Druid
6925
I thought the worst possible way to make a rare item was to reward the item at the end of an unbelievably tedious quest that nearly every class can accept. Now I realize the worst way to make an item rare is to reward the item at the end of an unbelievably tedious quest that nearly every class can accept, and then arbitrarily make the quest chain more tedious when people who are actually progressing are less than halfway through said quest chain.

Seriously who thinks of this garbage? Why can't we just have a semi-tedious quest chain from a semi-rare drop? Or maybe just a rare drop? Or maybe a guaranteed drop from heroic Alysrazor or Staghelm, the two most loreful bosses in this tier, that starts a tedious but doable quest chain. Its just horrible design to have every mage/lock/priest/druid/shaman in your raid be on a quest they literally can't complete . . . and then go back and make the quest more un-completable.
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85 Human Death Knight
11740
Can you read? He spells it out. The legendary was about to be incredibly common, so they adjusted drop rates. They cut heroic bonuses to the same rate as normal. They admit that such a change should have happened sooner.


Because there's more to the problem. There were too many legendaries from 25mans. 10mans weren't the problem but got hit hard anyway.

That's what people want a comment on.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
16840
Don't necro threads. Reported.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
14475
^ you complain when people necro and also complain when they start a new thread on something that's already got hundreds of threads .. can't win
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