Resto Druid PvP, the serious thread.

85 Night Elf Druid
7700
Resto Druids need to some serious help in competitive arena right now. Mainly 3's is what I'm talking about, 3 lifeblooms is out healed by a totem a shaman lays down. Our survivability is garbage, tree form isn't as great as people think it is, Natures Swiftness is on a 3minute cooldown for druids as opposed to a Shamans 2minute cooldown.

Now to the constructive part of the post, I'll go in order of how I stated them.

3 Lifeblooms (The HoT part of the heal) is outhealed by a Healing Stream Totem that a Shaman can passively keep down. I don't know personally myself but I've heard that lifebloom heals for roughly an extra 500ish since Wrath, even though we have had our health increased by 5 or 6 times.

Our survivability isn't good, if we get swapped to in arenas we're done, of course we have partners for some support but I can survive much better on my Vicious geared Paladin than on my almost full ruthless geared Resto Druid. We have Barkskin but 20% is useless, we have Tree Form but honestly that just makes us die faster.

Onto Tree Form, as I stated above, makes us die faster if we're being focused. When we're in Tree Form we're stuck in Tree Form. We have 2 choices, we can shape out of tree form and waste our major 3 minute healing cooldown, or we can sit in Tree Form and tank all the damage we are taking but that either just ends up us dying or running out of mana from spamming Regrowth.

Nature's Swiftness for Druids is a 3 minute CD, Shamans is 2 minutes. To be honest this makes no sense to me, the only difference is ours give 50% bonus to our next nature spell. I know all the classes are meant to be different, but considering they have the same name, same effect, I don't know why Druids get the short end of the stick.

Some suggestions I've read from other threads / thought of to help Resto Druids in arena without effecting PvE (I know Resto Druid are good in PvE so that's why I'm avoiding anything that might make Resto too overpowered for PvE).

The most common suggestion I've heard of, make Tree of Life a buff, and not just a shapeshift. You should be able to pop Tree of Life and go into Travel Form and back to Tree if you need to heal. What it is now to me is like a Paladin popping wings and using Hand of Freedom and Hand of Freedom removing the Wings. I know they're completely different, but you get the idea.

Give Druids an Aura Mastery / Inner Focus type of thing. There are certain points (75% of the time) where all our hots on a target isn't enough to heal them through all the damage they may be taking, there's some point where we need to some sort of protection to get our casts off, you could say Tree Form helps with that, but every other healers has their healing cd's and also a (excluding Shaman / Holy Priest but who rolls Holy Priest in arena) aura mastery type buff.

Redesign Perseverance (2nd tier talent in the Resto Tree), instead of a 6% spell reduction (when 3/3) give it a 3/6/10% damage reduction to everything. 3 Talent points for just 6% spell reduction right now is almost worthless especially with all the damge spell casters do, but that's a different thread; or even keep it 2/4/6% damage reduction but for all damage and not just spell.

Make our 4/4 peice set for PvP allow Lifebloom to be on 2 targest, I can't even count how many times I've had 3 lifeblooms on 1 target, then the enemy switches extremely fast so I need to start stacking lifeblooms on the new focus target before my lifebloom even gets to bloom on the 1st target (which ends up leaving them not at full health).

Increase Cyclone Range from 20 (25 with PvP Gloves) to a 30 (35 with PvP Gloves, or change the Glove effect) yd range. We're the only one with our spammable CC at such a small range. Granted it's undispellable, it's just too hard to get off when we need to get so close to our enemies making ourselves very vulnerable.

Put something in like Outbreak for Death Knights, but for Druids to apply all hots (excluding Regrowth and Wild Growth) to the target, this would effect PvE slightly but I think if it was on a decent cooldown (Something like 1 minute, maybe 45 seconds) it wouldn't effect it to bad. Then again I don't play Resto in PvE so I can't really say much.

This last one isn't as game-breaking as the other suggestions might be, but give us some sort of pushback immunity to certain spells (Cyclone for sure, possibly Roots & Hibernate?) someone in our talent tree.

Anyways, some of these might be a little overpowered, but in the current state we're in we need a buff. Just my thoughts, sorry for the wall of text. >_<
Edited by Darthtinker on 9/3/2011 4:03 AM PDT
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86 Tauren Druid
9255
Very valid points. I think pvp druids need another defensive cd. tbh Barkskin is pretty dam good and it should be rotated with trinket and ns and !@#$ but there is so much downtime where you have nothing and are helpless without good peels which is tough sometimes with something like a dk with his 100224 ways to get out of cc. I think the only way for pvp restos to get buffed without %^-*ing up pve is to give them another defensive, like you said maybe and aura-mastery type thing. There are many time where casting is not an option and spamming instants and kiting is your only hope. An aura-mastery would have to make teams blow things like stuns and grips to stop it, instead of them having it up for the opportune time.
I would love to see a druid buff so any comp could be more viable with a resto druid than any other healer. which is not the case atm. so lol
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85 Night Elf Druid
7700
Very valid points. I think pvp druids need another defensive cd. tbh Barkskin is pretty dam good and it should be rotated with trinket and ns and !@#$ but there is so much downtime where you have nothing and are helpless without good peels which is tough sometimes with something like a dk with his 100224 ways to get out of cc. I think the only way for pvp restos to get buffed without %^-*ing up pve is to give them another defensive, like you said maybe and aura-mastery type thing. There are many time where casting is not an option and spamming instants and kiting is your only hope. An aura-mastery would have to make teams blow things like stuns and grips to stop it, instead of them having it up for the opportune time.
I would love to see a druid buff so any comp could be more viable with a resto druid than any other healer. which is not the case atm. so lol

I think a move that we could put on other people (ex. pain suppresion, hand of sacrifice, etc) would help us.
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85 Night Elf Druid
7700
09/03/2011 05:16 PMPosted by Vesthis
I'm not going to lie, I did not read your post. But some specs are not going to be good all the time, and resto is no exception. For a large majority of PVP, resto druids have been powerful, or at least acceptable. You're not good now, deal with it, you're doing okay anyway, and on the cusp of glad range. You will be buffed in time, but you can't expect to be the #2 or #1 healer. Someone has to be the worst. At least we have feral to back up on.


So because Resto has been good before we have to be bad now? We are BY FAR the worst healer in PvP, and saying we have feral to back up on is dumb, I'm not going to be like 95% of the other Druids who went feral. My point is, when Resto Druids get replaced by a Resto Shaman just because of their class, something is wrong.

Also, we've been bad all through s9 and probably going to be through all of s10, who knows when we'll be buffed?
Edited by Darthtinker on 9/3/2011 5:38 PM PDT
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85 Night Elf Druid
7700
09/03/2011 06:58 PMPosted by Vesthis


So because Resto has been good before we have to be bad now? We are BY FAR the worst healer in PvP, and saying we have feral to back up on is dumb, I'm not going to be like 95% of the other Druids who went feral. My point is, when Resto Druids get replaced by a Resto Shaman just because of their class, something is wrong.

Also, we've been bad all through s9 and probably going to be through all of s10, who knows when we'll be buffed?


Yes, that's what I'm saying. Someone has to be the worst spec, why not us?


That's a stupid argument, anyways, if you want to say that, why should it be us who is the worst spec?
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85 Night Elf Druid
7700


That's a stupid argument, anyways, if you want to say that, why should it be us who is the worst spec?




Someone has to be at some point, at some points resto druids have been very powerful, now they're not. It's your turn, deal with it.


Now we take turns to be the worst class / spec combination? Lol. That's just stupid.
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85 Night Elf Druid
5440


That's a stupid argument, anyways, if you want to say that, why should it be us who is the worst spec?




Someone has to be at some point, at some points resto druids have been very powerful, now they're not. It's your turn, deal with it.


I usually just read through buff resto druid posts and dont comment but your arguments made me go all the way through logging on. This makes no sense considering we all know blizzard does not go in and test pvp. If nobody is complaining then their going to assume that everything is fine. Resto Druids are in a bad spot, when you say that the healing aspect of resto druids is bad at the moment, yes, thats true. But its not the end of it, because if you took all the healers and let someone put out the same pressure on all healers just standing there and taking it resto druids would die the fastest. For example, not only do priests have more armor than druids (which makes wearing leather not mean a damn thing over cloth) but they also have a passive talent that reduces ALL DAMAGE TAKEN BY 20% when their getting beat on. That is all.
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87 Night Elf Druid
5870
What druids REALLY need is more spammable, reliable burst healing that doesn't take a huuuge amount of mana. I'll list all the classes flash heals here:

Flash Heal: 6272 to 7288 base healing, 28% base mana
Flash of Light: 6907 to 7749 base healing, 31% base mana
Healing Surge: 4484 to 5122 base healing, 27% base mana
Regrowth: 3383 to 3775 and another 1083*1 over 6 sec, totaling 4466-4858 base healing, 35% mana cost.

Every single other healer class gets more total healing for less mana, plus a fourth of Regrowths healing happens over 6 seconds, which is hardly burst healing.

More survivability is also in order. Always before, we had armor % built into tree form to compensate for lower armor with leather. We don't have that anymore.



That's a stupid argument, anyways, if you want to say that, why should it be us who is the worst spec?




Someone has to be at some point, at some points resto druids have been very powerful, now they're not. It's your turn, deal with it.


Yeah, I'm totally fine with us being the worst spec. What I'm NOT fine with is us being SIGNIFICANTLY the worst spec. Right now, there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to bring us when you could grab any other healing spec and do so much better.
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87 Night Elf Druid
5870
09/03/2011 08:38 PMPosted by Vesthis
I understand all of your arguments, but I simply choose to point you to season 3 and 4 holy (Well, all specs, but for the sake of being a healer, holy) paladins. They were absolutely ABYSSMAL. They were by far represented even less so than resto druids right now, you guys will get buffed. There's plenty of threads about this all over the wow, along with other sites, forums.


Yes, that's season 3 and 4. That's BC. Blizzard wasn't trying to balance then as much as now. It's also in the past, so we can't change it. What we CAN attempt to change is the future, so s11.

I could point out that dk's were overpowered at the start of wrath (like, RIDICULOUSLY overpowered), but that wouldn't be a good point to say that frost mages are OP.
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85 Undead Priest
2090
Resto druids are fine. Do they take a little more skill then said Rshamans? Yes


@Outbreak ability - "Would affect pve slightly" LOL. Watch vids of the 2200+ Rdruids. Learn something. If they can do it, why can't you? Or do you need blizzard to dumb your class down so 'people' like you can actually handle it?
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87 Night Elf Druid
5870
Resto druids are fine. Do they take a little more skill then said Rshamans? Yes


@Outbreak ability - "Would affect pve slightly" LOL. Watch vids of the 2200+ Rdruids. Learn something. If they can do it, why can't you? Or do you need blizzard to dumb your class down so 'people' like you can actually handle it?


How did you get to 1800 and still be THIS ignorant about the state of resto druids? When I see one in arena, I tell my partner it's a free win. It always is.

Resto's are NOT fine. They can NOT recover from well timed burst/CC, nor can they from hard switches.
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85 Undead Priest
2090
I got a little higher then 1800 ;/...2220 something I think then I stopped


What class can actually recover from Burst? I can't? Does that mean Priest need buffs?

When a class like Shadow Priest starts bursting I can't heal through it. I can use Inner focus and get their Silence but it opens me up to fears because I have to stay still and hardcast.

You're a feral druid. You're not even 2k? You can start posting about the state of classes when you get a noticeable rating.
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87 Night Elf Druid
5870
I got a little higher then 1800 ;/...2220 something I think then I stopped


What class can actually recover from Burst? I can't? Does that mean Priest need buffs?

When a class like Shadow Priest starts bursting I can't heal through it. I can use Inner focus and get their Silence but it opens me up to fears because I have to stay still and hardcast.

You're a feral druid. You're not even 2k? You can start posting about the state of classes when you get a noticeable rating.


Lol? You can recover from burst a LOT easier then resto's. PW:S, Flash heal spam. They are forced to regrowth spam, which heals for significantly less AND takes more mana.

And yes, I'm not 2k, because I am on a crappy server where there are very very very very few players of 2k+ caliber, and those that are aren't interested in taking up a feral who hasn't been to 2k yet. I do believe that I could get to 2k if I could find someone who also could.

If you don't trust me, how about you trust virtually every top rated resto in saying that resto's need buffs in pvp.
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