Raid Finder Loot Rules Update

85 Troll Death Knight
6350
So, the question then becomes, what about DK and Bear tanks, who compete directly with Hunters, Cats, Warriors, Rets, and DPS Dk's for our tanking weapons?
85 Night Elf Druid
3815
a bonus to rolls is a bad idea, we really need an actual offspec button.

You really have to look to what's going to give the least chance of abuse. While this idea prioirtizes the current role over an offspec, it almost completely cuts out the chance of offspec. OFc, for something that has a weekly lock on loot, you want to prioritize the gear to the people actually filling that role, but what happens to the dps that steps up to tank to replace a terrible tank that the group just had to kick, or a dps and tank / healer who have to trade roles because one of them is having problems?

We at least need a way the group can let someone work around how rolls work... Maybe let the group let the heroic raid geared tank be able to roll on dps gear while he's tanking the instance for the group. Maybe even something as stupid as letting the group vote on if someone can roll need on an offspec piece... just, something. Maybe even do it from the begining "(Tank) queued as both tank and dps, do you want to let his dps spec count as his main role too" Yes / No.

You do need a way to restrict rolls to prioritize to the actual role the person is filling, but at the same time, you can't punish people who are willing to fill another role.
100 Blood Elf Mage
9430
Glad to see this kind of system bleeding out into the game. One of my intensely long TLDR suggestions way back when. :)

*There will probably be an iLvl slot check on your gear before the bonus is granted, to avoid abuse.
Edited by Opheron on 10/7/2011 10:28 AM PDT
90 Night Elf Druid
8200
"Hell its about time"
10/07/2011 10:25 AMPosted by Onisu
So, the question then becomes, what about DK and Bear tanks, who compete directly with Hunters, Cats, Warriors, Rets, and DPS Dk's for our tanking weapons?

As was discussed, there are items that share rolls. Are you asking that there be DK and Bear specific weapons?
Edited by Noctemtenchi on 10/7/2011 10:28 AM PDT
100 Blood Elf Paladin
17005
Will there be a limit to how many pieces a person can get per raid?

ie: Two tanks roll on a tanking piece for a boss, Tank 1 wins.
On the next boss another tanking piece drops, will Tank 1 have an equal chance at that as well?

Alternatively, this could cause an issue with people getting pieces, then leaving the raid because they figure they won't get anymore pieces.

Quandaries like these are reasons I don't envy the devs ._.
100 Orc Warrior
9145
GJ blizz, glad to hear this system will be in place. Personally if I am tanking, I just want tank gear. I don't want DPS gear and I won't take it from DPS. Likewise, I don't want DPS or healers taking my Tank gear from me; it is what I came for. You want Tank gear? then come as the tank.

What's nice is that this system effectively allows for me - a tank - to Need DPS gear and if no DPS want the gear, then I'll get a shot at it above the people who Greed rolled it to vendor it.

edit: and imo some of you are not giving blizz enough credit. For instance: of course blizz will consider things like people wanting to be able to change their role mid-run while not letting it get abused by last-second sneaky changes. Of course blizz will consider someone might queue as multiple roles (probably only matters which role they were selected by LFR for the run). Try to use some common sense plz.

As time goes on I'm sure we'll see more details fleshed out. It will be interesting to see how caster gear is split between heals and dps, and for random item cases like feral druid tank weapons.
Edited by Jaguarr on 10/7/2011 10:32 AM PDT
85 Troll Druid
7880
How are items flagged as Tanking? (I assume Parry/Dodge on the item)

Also, will this carry over to Healer/DPS loot disputes? (Mages or Warlocks rolling "Need" on Spirit-itemization in particular)
85 Goblin Rogue
9170
10/07/2011 10:25 AMPosted by Onisu
So, the question then becomes, what about DK and Bear tanks, who compete directly with Hunters, Cats, Warriors, Rets, and DPS Dk's for our tanking weapons?


Theres no way to give priority to tanks on that without it just being autolooted to the tank. Its just as much the dps's as the tank's in those cases. So one would have to say no one gets +100.
Edited by Gankage on 10/7/2011 10:29 AM PDT
85 Human Paladin
7590
Quandaries like these are reasons I don't envy the devs ._.

This isn't a quandary, there will be no "restriction" on how much gear a player can get from a single run.
90 Night Elf Druid
15975
10/07/2011 10:22 AMPosted by Rchardinabox
Make up your minds.


They did. Twice. They can do that, you know: change their minds about something, when faced with logic and reason. This is a bad thing how?
85 Dwarf Warrior
9805

Although the new feature presented here sounds nice and I would like to see it.. the one here is what I know ALOT of people have wanted for a very long time. It just seems so ridiculous to have class specific loot or especially TIER TOKENS drop for a class that doesn't even exist in the group. Would rather have gear drop that could POSSIBLY be used by a class, and if not we can DE it then or whatever.

Would seem like a relatively simple system to adjust the loot table based on classes currently in the raid group.


Run one raid and you're fully geared. No need to run the instance again. That's a problem. No sense of accomplishment accomponying the gear, either.
85 Undead Rogue
10520
Please keep in mind that, at least for now, this system will only look at class role, and not player spec.


What do you mean by that?
85 Troll Druid
7880
Will there be a limit to how many pieces a person can get per raid?

ie: Two tanks roll on a tanking piece for a boss, Tank 1 wins.
On the next boss another tanking piece drops, will Tank 1 have an equal chance at that as well?

Alternatively, this could cause an issue with people getting pieces, then leaving the raid because they figure they won't get anymore pieces.

Quandaries like these are reasons I don't envy the devs ._.

You have no limit on loot if you haven't killed the boss that week.
85 Goblin Rogue
11905
a bonus to rolls is a bad idea, we really need an actual offspec button.

You really have to look to what's going to give the least chance of abuse. While this idea prioirtizes the current role over an offspec, it almost completely cuts out the chance of offspec. OFc, for something that has a weekly lock on loot, you want to prioritize the gear to the people actually filling that role, but what happens to the dps that steps up to tank to replace a terrible tank that the group just had to kick, or a dps and tank / healer who have to trade roles because one of them is having problems?

We at least need a way the group can let someone work around how rolls work... Maybe let the group let the heroic raid geared tank be able to roll on dps gear while he's tanking the instance for the group. Maybe even something as stupid as letting the group vote on if someone can roll need on an offspec piece... just, something. Maybe even do it from the begining "(Tank) queued as both tank and dps, do you want to let his dps spec count as his main role too" Yes / No.

You do need a way to restrict rolls to prioritize to the actual role the person is filling, but at the same time, you can't punish people who are willing to fill another role.


An offspec button will do the exact same thing as this system.

You would have to force it so a person can only select MS or OS need (in the same manner that in this system you get the bonus or you don't) otherwise no one would ever select the offspec button, why would they as it would guarantee that they wouldn't win the item?

And if you're forcing the inability to select mainspec how does it help people filling multiple roles in any way that this system does not?
85 Undead Priest
1900
This system has a flaw for shadow priests. The gear that may be flagged for healers, the cloth with + spirit, is most of the time the best dps gear for shadow priests, but we won't have a chance at it at all if it drops if its flagged for healing.. There has to be a better way on this. There are probably a few more loopholes, but ya.. this is the main one! its pretty serious flaw.
100 Troll Rogue
16625
I agree with this.

10/07/2011 09:56 AMPosted by Aarschott
If you want to be the DPS and get the bonus roll for DPS gear, then don't select tank when you queue. Just select dps only.


Yes your queue time will probably be longer. Welcome to the dps club.
85 Tauren Warrior
4070
This system would work far better if it looked at the spec you were in when the boss was engaged. I say this because of fights like Cho'gal, Magmaw, Lord Rylolith, Majordomo, Baleroc. All these fights require or at least benefit from people changing specs to suit the fight. I gear both Tank and DPS since many fights are single tank fights. Since LFR is a 25m raid then you you guarantee that a third tank wont turn into a third wheel except for a few fights?

Unless you can guarantee that all fights will be optimal with the exact number of dps/healer/tanks I can see issues, particularly with skill levels and lack or coordination that is reminiscent of a LFD group.

On a side note, please , please, please, do not count pvp gear into item levels for LFR.
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