Pandas. Thoughts?

90 Troll Warrior
[quote="34241167282"]Also, pass on MoP. Unless I see something spectacular to change my mind but I'm pretty sure Blizzard has blown their load.


Buuuut, in all seriousness, I agree.
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
Awww it doesn't seem that bad. I love the Imperial China theme and for the fact they're focusing more on the war if anything. The dungeons look REALLY nice and the Monk class is defentely something I'm looking forward to. The talent changes I could do without but hey with everything else I'm willing to over look it.
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85 Goblin Mage
You all give new meaning to the terms "QQ" and "Sad Panda".
Edited by Arida on 10/27/2011 7:48 AM PDT
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85 Dwarf Hunter
Alex Ziebart of WoW Insider really summed up my feelings nicely in yesterday's "Queue:"

"Play Pandaria. If you have fun, keep playing it. If you don't have fun, don't play it. Don't quit in a huff over one little thing. If you're quitting because of what you saw at BlizzCon, you probably haven't been having fun with the game for a long time and need to take a break, anyway. In that situation, there's very little Blizzard could actually do to excite you."

Happy gaming,

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100 Gnome Rogue
A recent blue post on the whole Panda thing...

I will direct you to recall the Warcraft RPG (pen and paper) manuals released in 2003. While much of it hasn't been canon for quite some time, the Pandaren occupy a greater amount of pages and space within the manuals to establish their lore and story than pretty much every other creature on Azeroth. To give it some context, they occupy the same number of pages as Trolls in the Monster Manual, and share the same amount space in the Alliance and Horde Compendium with Orcs or Humans, and just like them ... you guessed it... Pandaren were a playable race.

(there's also an awesome sketch Metzen did of a Pandaren, Dwarf, Furbolg, and Gnome hanging out all friendly-like)

As I said a lot of this was pre-World of Warcraft, and by whatever stroke of fate, Trolls and Forsaken became playable races and Pandaren, Naga, and Furbolgs did not. Some other mix could have just as easily been true, and no one would have questioned it. Worgen didn't even exist back then, of course, they were a new creation for World of Warcraft.

It would simply be inaccurate to state that Pandaren were a throw away. Our intent, going back to Warcraft III, when the vast majority of the world lore and story was established for the franchise, was always to have a deep and rich history for a race known as the Pandaren.
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85 Dwarf Rogue
I honestly have no issues with a panda race. It has been in the background (though not canon) for a long time and they're no sillier than space-goats and werewolves (which were never canon before introduction).

My disappointment with MoP is the lack of anything resembling something new. The monk class is just the reinvention of the Rogue which was already copied by the Druid (agility leather, energy, and combo points) except that combo points stick to the player and not the target. Granted you can heal and tank with that system so at least that's something kinda different. (And if you thought the rogue population was low now...)

Pokemon certainly isn't new and frankly I'm surprised that Blizzard isn't trying to shoe-horn the trading card game into WoW proper like so many other MMOs.

The talent trees are being re-done (again) and while that's slightly interesting:
We want players to be able to change their talent build independently of their specialization, and without visiting a class trainer. This new system is designed to provide players with hundreds of distinct and meaningful options for tailoring their character’s gameplay to their specific desires and situation.

That seems to indicate that after you make the choice of say the Assassination spec, the actual choices you make can be changed at any time at will. So if I was a Paladin, I could dual spec Protection and Holy and change my talent choices anytime out of combat. That's 2/3 of all current specs completely covered there.

Unfortunately, just like talents now, the new talent system presents a false choice. Even non-DPS talents have different values even if they are technically the same. Let's say one tier of choices offer a damage reduction talent, let's say 10% physical, 10% magic or a 5%/5% split. If you're a melee DPS who raids you always pick 10% magic reduction; hell, minus casters in PvP and some raid tanks, everyone would pick that. Now go look at the talent trees they've presented; they aren't nearly as equal as the example I gave. Yes, there are some tough choices, but "tough" doesn't mean that one isn't better than the other.

Then there's the Annual Pass which is a different issue. If you've been paying attention to the subscription numbers you're familiar with their rise and fall after expansions (and to a lesser extent patches). History tells us that as a game gets older its gains at each surge are smaller and the subsequent drop-offs accelerate; you can see this with WoW over the last two expansions. What the Annual pass indicates is that they expect a very rapid drop-off. The Annual Pass charges at the monthly rate; those who pay in longer periods (like me) will actually pay more over that years time without counting the cost of D3. Also note that other game companies do the same thing by bundling games they feel they can't sell any longer with a new title they know will sell; this is just a subscription bundle with the new title.

No, while the Panderan are new and there will be new zones, I just don't see anything that says I'll be doing anything I've not done before on a dozen characters.
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100 Blood Elf Rogue
I played around with the Pandaren Monk while at Blizzcon.
Energy based class (Chi)
Melee class
able to use leather armor
Hand weapons or staves (Not sure about anything else, maybe 1 handed maces though)

I'm only going to assume that the Monk's primary stats are going to be Agi and Str, but it could be Agi and Stam too or Str/Stam.

But I agree with Tin. The Monk will be the biggest competition for us Rogues, not only due to the fact of us unable to spec out of anything other than DPS, but also for gear.

The only little bit I played was in the starting area and we were on 15 minute timers, so couldn't tell what kind of stats the gear would have for them. All I know is leather armor, fist and staves.

Right now though the biggest thing I'd be worried about is the talent changes they want to do. But so far there's been a VAST majority of people up in arms about it, and I'm sure that if Blizz keeps with the talent system they unveiled at Blizzcon, there's gonna be alot of people quitting.

To be honest, the little I read about the talent changes I did when I got home, as my first day at Blizzcon, I was getting stopped every 10-15 minutes for pictures of my costume. :D
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85 Draenei Mage
You should show us your costume then!
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85 Draenei Shaman
Given the critically rough launch of Death Knights I seriously hope Blizzard has learned from their mistake before(They claim to have.) The way the Monk is currently being presented introduces varying concerns though. A 5th tanking class is one thing, but we're also being handed whats essentially another Paladin. Here are some issues I can see happening -

1. Lets assume for a second that the raiding format of MoP will be extremely close if not identical to the way Cata's encounters function. One major goal in competitive high end raiding guilds is to reduce the amount of healers to a bare minimum in order to maximize DPS whenever possible. Monks introduce a healing medium entirely based around dealing damage in order to heal through their Statues. Assuming that the Monk can put out HPS as competitive in comparison to other healers, many high end guilds might chose to stack the monk to minmax dps. Of course this is all relative to what ends up making it to the retail build, more then likely i'm wrong. Hows that for logic?

2. Its a !@#$%^- 5th tank. DKs added a fourth. I can only assume its meant to encourage more people to que as tank in LFG/LFR but if thats the case its a poor reason to add a tank in. Too soon imo. The current four aren't exactly balanced in relation to each other either.

3. I believe Blizzard is well aware of potentially neutering melee classes (specifically rogues) with the introduction of yet another melee. I have a hard time seeing them allowing this to happen so I wouldn't give up on the game as a rogue just yet. However on the other side I hope they don't end up being another ret paladin. Those still exist?

As for the talent system, its awful. I'm honestly fine with the current talent trees if they would add in a few more options without going overboard like what happened with Wrath. I *Do* like the fact that they are trying to further distinguish specs from one another. Warlocks for instance: Destro is superficially similar to the Bright Mages of Warhammer Online just without the possibility of blowing yourself up when your burn power gets too high. Its neat, I hope to see distinguishable differences in spec like this for every class.
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89 Human Warlock
Pandas - China - Nixon - crook - Nordberg -shaman- heal-Oz-funny-Robin Williams - WoW - pandas.

yeah those are my thoughts.
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85 Human Paladin
However on the other side I hope they don't end up being another ret paladin. Those still exist?

We are like cockroaches. Blizzard tried everything to get rid of us, nerf us, and make people hate us.... but we are still around.
Edited by Turrican on 11/7/2011 11:44 AM PST
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85 Dwarf Rogue
11/07/2011 11:43 AMPosted by Turrican
We are like cockroaches. Blizzard tried everything to get rid of us, nerf us, and make people hate us.... but we are still around.

In vanilla, Rets were non-existent just like Blizzard wanted. Totally neutered and harmless. But at the time they had a loyal and ferocious (if misguided and slightly smelly) fanbase.

Then came the expansions and the idea that every class and spec should be worth something. That's when Blizzard hit upon their multi-step plan, make Ret playable but remove some power with every patch. And with that power loss they become fewer and fewer in number. Soon we're mention them alongside old trinkets and vestigial talents.

Every class has this sort of story. Anyone remember "World of Roguecraft"? The original? When a good rogue could don two white vendor daggers and kill anyone wearing any gear? Yeah, and now when was the last time that a rogue actually killed anyone without a support team?

/edit to pile on more sarcasm
Edited by Tinwhisker on 11/7/2011 12:56 PM PST
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85 Worgen Rogue
Hi. I'm a rogue.
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100 Blood Elf Rogue
youtube, blizzcon costume contest 2011 part 2, about 5 minutes in give or take.
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85 Worgen Druid
This upcoming expansion has everything for just about everyone, no one should complain. Literally what else could you ask for?

/love Piggy

Another game to keep my interest.
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100 Night Elf Priest
10/26/2011 10:06 PMPosted by Kojimon

Every time this thread gets bumped I scroll up to this post. It makes me laugh each and every time.

Amazing movie, btw.
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