VP Changes to 4.3 PTR

85 Troll Shaman
10315
So Conquest rewards from BGs get increased so we can "play how we want", yet VP from raids gets decreased so we have to...not play how we want? I'm confused.
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86 Blood Elf Paladin
0
The point is; that people full clearing 25m Dragon Soul should not have to step back and clear dungeons to get valor points.

It makes no sense when compared to their previous posts talking about how they want a sense of progression.

Regulars -> Heroics -> Raid
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85 Orc Rogue
6110
I don't like this at all actually. Some people like myself don't get lucky to get pieced that drop, if they ever do. Specially when my main is an eleshaman who only shares gear with resto shammies. So the gear in mention rarely drops because only two types of characters need it. I rely on crafting, purchasing or valor points to stay competitive. Very rarely do I actually get any gear from drops.
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90 Night Elf Warrior
6125
I assume that means you'll be upping the loot that bosses drop right? Instead of 2 pieces in 10 man, we should expect 3-5 per boss?
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85 Tauren Shaman
4175
umm high is there anyway you guys at blizz can allow for current expac tier gears to drop from bosses only, but for any and all previous expac gear to be purchasable from vendors viz JP? INcluding canilla and BC tier gear
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85 Human Paladin
6780

Why do people who don't raid need raiding gear?


This argument is so played out. The reason non-raiders need raiding gear is beacuse it's the ONLY (Key word = ONLY) PvE form of character progression in this game.

They don't NEED it the way a raider would, but they want a goal, they want something to work towards, they want their character to become stronger.

That said... I have my druid, that's for raiding, I mess around pretty casually on this pally. I actually want to start catching its gear up. I'm working on leveling my mage again. And I have a DK I'm working on. This push into focusing on raiding. And focusing on killing the bosses and farming gear... I hate it. My main reason, I don't want to do the same raid 4x every week to try to gear all my alts. One time through is enough, let me gear this pally, or the mage, without having to put up with the same fights AGAIN.

It's time to get over this gear obsession and being so worried about what everyone else has. I've never seen a community so focused on gear as this one. Honestly, so what, some random non-raider has the same level of gear as you... the guy farming heroic clears in a full heroic tier set still thinks you're bad.

There's also the issue that people are leveling right now. Blizz, you're about to put out your 4th expansion, do you really not grasp that this community almost completely demands outgearing content? How many BoT raids with a 359 ilevel min do you have to see in trade chat until something clicks? There needs to be an alternative to the SAME level of gear... forget "welfare epics" forget the people whining that someone has the same ilevel of gear as them.... start focusing on the guy who isn't gonna make it to 85 until about 6 months after 4.3.

Start actually addressing the flaws in your loot and gear and min ilevel system, THEN you can can worry about stuff like slowing down how fast you get VP to spend. But right now, there's bigger problems that this is only going to make worse.
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85 Human Death Knight
10160
I run a 25 man raiding guild, and I have to say that the idea that 10 man guilds will now get the same amount of valor points as us in a raid really is really discouraging.

We have to recruit harder than we *ever* have before, just to keep our roster afloat. We face increasing competition from 10s for multiple reasons, and we are getting less and less as a reward for our efforts.

Is anything going to be done to keep 25 mans viable?
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85 Human Paladin
9005
On 10 man RNG is pretty horrid.

    We have 11 baleroc kills and have never seen the tank helm.

    The holy pally helm we saw once off those 11 kills.

    15 Beth kills and one tank trink has dropped.

    15 Beth kills and one healing shield has dropped.

    18 Shannox (12 reg, 6 heroic) the random enchant leather shoulders dropped once.


I went from my engineering helm (359) at the start of magmaw all the way through t11 and now 5 rag kills later I am wearing a crappy tier helm with poor tank stats because the valiona tank helm and the baleroc tank helm are so rare. Two full tiers cleared and am wearing a helm that is at best 3rd BiS pre heroic.

Having all token gear drop off bosses is a nightmare for us raid leaders, helm and shoulders were bad enough, never mind the 384 trinks off rag to fight over. Keeping everyone happy in t13 may just be impossible in 10 man.

Giving VP options for every slot is one solution (spreading tokens around better would make more sense), but making us run dungeons to cap VP is just going against that principle.
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I wouldn't bring it up, but since Blizz did, LFR will be the last area that I, as a good raider, will -ever- look to gain valor points or gear.


- Lack of Communication
- Lack of Gearing properly (gems, reforges, enchants, basic gear progression)
- Lack of Awareness
- Lack of proper spec
- Players leaving after clearing the boss that has their loot.
- Lack of knowledge of the encounters
- Lack of class/spec knowledge to the encounter


Blizz talks about seeing bosses, and I can't help but think... see a boss? yeah that's possible... if they don't disband half way through clearing trash. I'm not sure the folks making these statements have spent any time running pugs of any kind. That sort of statement is for the hopeful, not the realistic.
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85 Blood Elf Hunter
2620
11/17/2011 09:43 AMPosted by Imthatguy
Why is Blizzard intent on driving away 25 man guilds? Trying to maintain a 25 man guild is one of the most stressful things most people have experienced in this, and quite possibly any other game. The rewards for doing so should be far greater than what they currently are.


Well, I'm so sorry that you feel the need to inflict stress on yourself to enjoy a game. The rest of us who have played the game for nearly 7 years and are now at points in their lives where they want to play this game and not have a 2nd job of Advanced Cat Herding couldn't care less.

And in fact, I think most 25-man raiders I've spoken with (in game and not on a comisseration-circle forum thread) really don't care about being on equal footing with the smaller-size counterparts. People who aren't deluded about what the real challenging raiding experience is -- which is what "but what about 25-mans!!" complainers claim to be concerned about -- move on to Hard mode boss encounters in due time. Hence, where the real rewards lie.
Edited by Picklepork on 11/17/2011 10:50 AM PST
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90 Night Elf Rogue
17060
The point is; that people full clearing 25m Dragon Soul should not have to step back and clear dungeons to get valor points.

It makes no sense when compared to their previous posts talking about how they want a sense of progression.

Regulars -> Heroics -> Raid


This.

And it's great that Blizzard wants new characters to be able to catch up without running every previous raid tier, but that's what Justice is for, isn't it? Wasn't that the whole point of going to two point tiers instead of Wrath's four?
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85 Undead Death Knight
1715
i'll be honest i dont think its going to go too well in the begining, i see how ppl treat each other with just a reg pug (non raid) this is just gunna make is worse. Dont get me wrong im not knocking the concept of being able to que for a raid, but come on.. those of you that give ANYONE grief just because they arent up to YOUR specs know how you are... get rdy for ALOT of rage and arguing
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90 Goblin Priest
10615
The point is; that people full clearing 25m Dragon Soul should not have to step back and clear dungeons to get valor points.

It makes no sense when compared to their previous posts talking about how they want a sense of progression.

Regulars -> Heroics -> Raid


This.

And it's great that Blizzard wants new characters to be able to catch up without running every previous raid tier, but that's what Justice is for, isn't it? Wasn't that the whole point of going to two point tiers instead of Wrath's four?


The whole point of Cataclysm appears to be taking every good idea Wrath had about reward systems and dismantling them, piece by piece.
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85 Goblin Priest
3580
In the 4.3 Battelground Conquest Reward topic from, let me see, some guy called Bashiok it says:

Our intent is to start acting even more on our Mists of Pandaria philosophies of encouraging players to approach the content they want to, how they want to, and be able to work toward meaningful player progression.


Now, let me get this straight. Me and many people don't like running 5mans. I personally got sick of running ZA/ZG because in order to cap I had to do it when my guild was killing only 2-3 bosses on FL. Now, as a raider, I want to get not only the BiS (given that I'm a healer priest, you know what that means: Spirit gear is in VP) but any upgrade available as soon as is possible for me, so I will do any instance that provide me with VP. With this change I have to, again do 5mans, which I stated I don't like; but with your change you aren't encourage me to kill raid bosses, but to do 5mans, and this is not the way I want to "approach the content I want, how I want"

If I get the boots drop from a boss I wil buy a neckle with VP if I get the weapon from a boss I will buy the ring with VP; I can't just wait until things drops if I have a medium to get gear I will use it; but I really dislike 5mans. And redoing FL is boring at this point.

So if you want me to gear exclusively from raids, or you want me to get my gear slower, I can understand that (not that I like or something, but I can understand), the issue is that this change don't accomplish that, this change give more 5mans per weeks.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8045
I think this is bull doodoo...
Did you ever think how long it takes to aquire 2 sets of gear for people like me, that not only tank, but DPS aswell for fights that require 1 tank only...
it takes forever and now it seems its gonna take even longer... bleh cata is a big failure... honestly i was happier with how wrath was... everything worked better... well up to the time where they merged raid lockouts and what not... not happy right now at all...
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85 Orc Warrior
0
So those who don't get the favor of RNG Gods will get effed this coming patch? Blizzard god save us all.
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