4.3 Raid Finder Loot Rules

90 Blood Elf Paladin
13260
11/23/2011 07:29 PMPosted by Mate
It really only stops plate dps from getting plate tank gear over tanks, resto druids from getting cat/bear gear, holy pallies from getting tank/dps gear and resto shammies from getting enh gear.


Dont forget Mages and locks from +spirit gear and trinkets that need a heal cast to proc.

Healer trinkets will be restricted to healers, but it is not obvious whether Mages and Warlocks will be able to roll Need+ on gear with spirit. Blizzard says that they cannot detect spec, so there will be issues with Druids/Shamans rolling on gear for a spec they are not currently playing, but they haven't said if they can detect class. (the "(for elemental shaman, shadow priest, and moonkin)" makes me hopeful, but that could simply be justification for why dps will be getting Need+)

If they can detect class, a piece of spirit gear will have the following classifications: Healer, Shadow Priest. If a cloth healer or a shadow priest rolls need, they will get the +100 roll bonus and automatically win over any Warlocks or Mages rolling.

If they cannot detect class, a piece of spirit gear will have the following classifications: Healer, DPS. If a cloth healer or a shadow priest rolls need, they will get the +100 roll bonus, but since the DPS classification cannot take into account different classes, so will any Mages or Warlocks who roll.
10 Night Elf Druid
0
If you're in a raid as one of the below roles here is what you'll receive a roll bonus on:

Tank:
Agility Leather (for druids)



Can We please get a BLUE to clarify this please because Rogues are getting the short end of the stick, because as this reads if there is a Bear Tank and a Leather Agility item drops it defaults to the Bear just because he queued as a Tank, and the Rogue who can only DPS is left with nothing. Considering that the Bear could also use said items as DPS gear they should not get a bonus on the fact that they can use it for 2 different specs even though they queued as a tank, and since there is no real Leather Tanking Gear Bears you should develop a new set specifically for bear tanks with different bonus' to tanking Stats and let the Rogues and Cats fight it out for the Agility gear.
10 Night Elf Druid
0
bottom line is these new loot rules are only going to cause some classes to get more gear than others by giving them priorty even though the gear will be usable for their class and armor requirements leather items with agility of course will be some of the highest disputed gear due to ferals getting a higher priority over rogues since itll be classified as tank gear


But being Agility It should be Considered DPS, Hunters and Enhance Shaman also can only roll on Mail Agility Gear, but when/If an Agility Trinket drops Kitties Rogues Hunters and Enhancement Shaman get nothing while the Bear hoards all the loot. You have to consider only 1 Class uses Agility as a "Tank" stat, you have 2 Classes currently, soon to be 3 with Monks, that will be using leather agility gear as the Primary stat for them. You also have to consider that in a Raid the Tank is absolutely NOTHING with out a Healer and DPS so gearing only the tanks will get you nowhere if the DPS can't bring down what you are fighting. People and Blizz seem to forget that with out DPS you don't have any raids, no heroics, no dungeons. Im just saying that if you are going to primarily give the tank an Automatic Bonus when the DPs is putting just as much effort as the tank is in these fight. Also this scenario can and will apply to DK Tanks and Warrior DPS/Ret Pallies, again Tank Bias is not fair period
90 Blood Elf Paladin
8930
I must say a big "thank you" for assisting with clarifying the loot roll rules. Although, I do find it quite hilarious that from all the blue posters, Bashiok is the one listing these rules (hint 1: Bashiok has always been slightly negative to our suggestions regarding loot roll rules, and about Blizzrad's future stance on them)

Hint 2: I still love the guy, and I hope that when/if spec detection is possible, these rules become even better, since they actually can help players learn their class; there's nothing more annoying than mages running around in healing gear and the other way around...
Great! Now if this was applied to the dungeon finder all the way down to RFC, this would be even nicer.
90 Blood Elf Warrior
9195
Until/unless "Need" (or "Need+100" in this case) is blocked for Hunters, Rogues, Shamans (Shamen?) and Druids rolling for Strength items, and likewise until "Need"/"Need+100" is blocked for Warriors, DKs, and Paladins rolling for Agility items, this is still going to be a nightmare.

If a Frost DK can take a Rogue's Agi sword, or a hunter can take a Fury Warrior's Str axe, like what is currently on live, this loot system is still a failure. A step in a half-decent direction, but still a failure.

Each spec is designed to only care about one stat. Bash says the game can't identify your spec. That's fine. Some entire classes are designed to only care about one or two of the main three stats, yet in some cases they can currently roll need on an item that they should never, ever be using. Bad design. Needs fixed.

I would hope that Blizzard is smart enough to address this before LFR goes live, but then there are people in here, testers, Druids saying they lost agi weapons to DKs and garbage like that.
90 Human Death Knight
12695
Alright, 3rd time posting this without a definite answer, so I might as well ask it here.

DPS: "Mostly everything that doesn’t have a tank stat on it"

What are "Tank stats?" Mastery, Parry, Dodge. But do you mean exclusive tank stats?

For example, let's say a Strength plate piece with Mastery and Expertise drops. For the way I play, Mastery is king and expertise, though not needed as heavily for tanks in 4.3, is still beneficial. Would this theoretical piece of gear share even rolls between melee dps and tanks, or would the new system favor DPS simply because there is no Dodge or Parry on this item? If the latter is true, I'd find that hard to swallow considering Mastery is the tankiest tank stat for...tanks...and avoidance is really just an afterthought for me.

Also, another theoretical drop: A two-handed strength weapon with Crit and Mastery. Are Blood DKs given even rolls with DPS on this item?
Edited by Arctous on 11/24/2011 1:49 AM PST
85 Undead Priest
7600

DPS:
Spirit gear shadow priest

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT
90 Troll Hunter
10145
11/23/2011 01:46 PMPosted by Sweaterlumpz
Pretty sure you meant "Dragon Soul" and not Demon Soul.

But they are one and the same :p
90 Worgen Death Knight
10090
Alright, 3rd time posting this without a definite answer, so I might as well ask it here.

DPS: "Mostly everything that doesn’t have a tank stat on it"

What are "Tank stats?" Mastery, Parry, Dodge. But do you mean exclusive tank stats?

For example, let's say a Strength plate piece with Mastery and Expertise drops. For the way I play, Mastery is king and expertise, though not needed as heavily for tanks in 4.3, is still beneficial. Would this theoretical piece of gear share even rolls between melee dps and tanks, or would the new system favor DPS simply because there is no Dodge or Parry on this item? If the latter is true, I'd find that hard to swallow considering Mastery is the tankiest tank stat for...tanks...and avoidance is really just an afterthought for me.

Also, another theoretical drop: A two-handed strength weapon with Crit and Mastery. Are Blood DKs given even rolls with DPS on this item?


I'll add to this. Best-in-Slot tank belt is currently the heroic Shannox belt. (Mastery/Expertise) If this were a Dragon Soul drop, would this be flagged for DPS, since it doesn't have tank-exclusive stats on it, or would it be flagged for both, since mastery is also a tank stat?
57 Gnome Warlock
765
11/24/2011 12:43 AMPosted by Hackur
Druids saying they lost agi weapons to DKs and garbage like that.


well thats whats going to happen if they dont rethink these loot rules druids will be losing weapons to DKs rogues will be losing armor to druids etc


The thing was, the only weapon Druids ever lost to a DK was the blue spear in Lost City that drops every single time I've gone in there, and it was pre-raid BiS for DKs at the time due to the mastery on it (had nothing to do with the agility). When 4.1 came out the 2h weapons in the trolls became BiS so that stopped ever being a worry.
85 Undead Warlock
2515
11/23/2011 01:46 PMPosted by Sweaterlumpz
Pretty sure you meant "Dragon Soul" and not Demon Soul.


Ive heard people using both. I think it's pretty obvious what they mean given the context of the conversation.
85 Draenei Paladin
4670
sounds good to me

my only concern with lfr is the communication among the members, the ability for each member to understand mechanics and take directions, and the fact that it is currently only available in 25 man mode.

i hope that lfr pugs prove successful the majority of the time.
85 Troll Priest
4155

DPS:

  • Spirit gear (for elemental shaman, shadow priest, and moonkin)



  • Lovely... now give us Healers a Hit to Spirit conversion like you gave the dps so we can use gear with hit on it.... Hmm? No? Then why in the world would you do something like this?
    Edited by Redneckmedic on 11/24/2011 7:18 AM PST
    90 Tauren Druid
    12670

    DPS:

  • Spirit gear (for elemental shaman, shadow priest, and moonkin)



  • Lovely... now give us Healers a Hit to Spirit conversion like you gave the dps so we can use gear with hit on it.... Hmm? No? Then why in the world would you do something like this?


    Because then dps that use spirit would ALWAYS lose to healers. How does someone gear up if they have zero chance to start with of winning the roll?
    And secondly, find me any caster leather or caster mail with hit on it. There is none.
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