I will never go back to normal raiding again.

85 Blood Elf Priest
9120
I've changed my feelings towards this too. I am a raider with 3 toons but I must say it's nice to go in with little pressure to see and try out new things, either specs or bosses.

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90 Blood Elf Paladin
10500
Agreeing with the OP.

If this had been around at the start of Cata, I think many of the Guilds that died horrible slow deaths to attrition of members would still be around. Those friends would still be together. But alas most of us gave into the pull to move to more active guilds where we could down some bosses and move through the content. Better late than never though.

Bravo Blizz
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90 Night Elf Druid
13815
Easy or not, I just want to reiterate how much fun it is to bring this char (my first and fav) to ANY sort of raid and not my hunter, because he's better geared and does better dps. Now, I can use my other alts in LFR such as my shammy, lock, etc that I've only brought into heroics or pvp. Hell, I may even give healing a whirl on my priest, that's been exclusively pvp since I made her. So much to do this patch, just as I was starting to get bored with WoW because my options were so limited.
Edited by Dremin on 12/8/2011 5:32 AM PST
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Should only award 359 loot. Kind of a joke really.
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85 Troll Shaman
3980
I enjoyed this. Even though I raid with my guild on normal modes and eventually, heroics, it is pretty refreshing being able to see some of the content, and help me gear up a bit from Dragon Soul.

My day was made yesterday when the axe from Deathwing dropped last night :D
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90 Tauren Hunter
15300
As a semi-hardcore raider I have come to loathe going into the raid finder as it is not my usual loving, organized guild mates downing content with me.

However, I understand not everybody has that lovely of a guild or some of the time that I do and I am happy to see some people are getting a lot of the enjoyment out of the raid finder. When you are a raider and expect to down the normal content within the first week you sometimes forget that some people struggle to get even to that point. Although I do feel the last half of the LFR content should have been pushed back another week or two and perhaps the difficulty should require some sort of coordination beyond what it is now, Blizzard has absolutely accomplished their goal of letting people see some of the content, and good for them :).

I will also enjoy a faster way to gear up raiding alts :X.
Edited by Sephisloth on 12/8/2011 5:38 AM PST
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90 Tauren Priest
ten
9525
I agree with everything the OP said. Thank you so much Blizz for LFR. It's nice being able to see content, while getting somewhat decent loot too! Keep up the good work.
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MVP
90 Worgen Warlock
10465
I just hope quality isn't sacrificed to make training-wheels mode.
http://www.nerfnow.com/comic/639

Mary and her grandson need epix and super-duper achievements like everybody else - I get it. But it saddens me to seriously feel like we'll never see Ulduars or ICC's in WoW's floundering lifetime again, with the added dev time needed for LFR.


The overall core design teams are still there working on the raids themselves. When the raid itself is finished it's just a matter of fine-tuning the encounters and balancing the numbers to adapt them to LFR/Normal/Heroic modes.

This detracts no time from the raid designing schedule. The raid gets designed from the bottom up, and then is fine-tuned after it's already finished.
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86 Troll Druid
0
Personally, I think LFR is way too dumbed down. It turns fighting Deathwing into a complete and utter joke.

I think it is ridiculous that many people downed Deathwing in LFR before GUILDS managed to do it in normal. No, this was not the case for my guild personally, but there were many guilds on my server that had not downed Deathwing in normal during the first week.

They shouldn't have released the final content in LFR for at least a couple more weeks. It completely takes all the excitement of downing someone who's supposed to be so powerful. To have derp pugs downing Deathwing like he's cake just completely defies Deathwing being such a hardcore dragon. Grats Blizz, you made end-game content playable for retards and in the process ripped the soul out of the game.

I know all you who don't have decent guilds and don't take this game seriously will disagree, but really think about it. Just imagine in your real life you work hard to achieve something all for others to simply get it handed to them. So what if we get better gear in normal and heroic? It doesn't matter considering you clearly don't need that gear to down Deathwing anyway. The only thing us hardcore raiders have now is the sense of achievement of downing the harder content. However, the RP of the game has been ripped to shreds IMO.



This is absolutely the attitude and language that, in this community, needs to go sit in the corner for a while. If you can't stand the thought of there being multiple difficulty tiers of content -- into which we pour a lot of our development efforts -- to make raiding feasible for more than 2% of players, hit Heroic mode, turn on vent, and repeatedly remind your friends how good you are. I have no doubt they care. :)


And the sarcasm feeds the trolls, accomplishes nothing, and is just unneeded. Carry on, missing the point he was making albeit not using "polite" grammar.

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For once Blizzard finally got something right. Now if they can do something about small guilds being unable to level or even better change guilds around so levels grant frivilous stuff instead of meaningful stuff
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90 Human Mage
7510
I understand that Blizzard needs to expand its paid subscriber base, or at least hang on to what they have and wring a little bit more money out of them in the form of paid pets and mounts but...

LFR is tuned way too low. To allow almost ANYONE to have such easy access to kill Deathwing in week two of the patch is not well thought out. So you've killed Deathwing in week two. Now what? Who wants to bother raiding for the next six months while we wait for the next expansion? I've seen the end, what do I have to work towards? More gear? Why? I don't need it. There's nothing left to achieve, really. (Ok, I haven't actually done part two yet but will likely do it on the weekend).

I'm not trying to be elitist, because I am far from elite. My guild never killed Ragnaros yet. We're more or less casual. But, had we killed Rag in week two of patch 4.2, I doubt we'd have kept at Firelands for months and months. We'd have gotten bored of the fact that there's no challenge left and that there's nothing left to see.

I think you're going to see a lot of people use LFR in the first few weeks, kill Deathwing, and then get bored with WoW.
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16 Goblin Rogue
8650
The more I read about this the more I see that the 'LFR attackers' (to group them up) have one point, and it's a good one although they fail to actually make it nearly every time:

The new raid is too easy on normal mode. It should be harder.

Heroic mode should require massive work for a raid today (maybe less in a few months).

It's all about the difficulty of the (now) three levels of raiding.

The complaints about casual players having access to raiding, even at such a simplified level, are more about the personality disorders of the poster than any objective reality. Those people need to look into themselves to work out why it's so important that they want something they deny to others. We can trivially dismiss these opinions, they're from a flawed, defective viewpoint.

It's all about the difficulty. Hardcore raiders wanted to be punished by Deathwing for a month or so on normal, and then for several months on heroic. They want to be killed again and again (no, I'm not going to talk about what that says about them, let's just focus on the challenge element) and suffer so that the final victory is all the sweeter.

LFR is easy. We all get that. It's there for those players who can't raid otherwise, for whatever reason. Its mere existence removes *nothing* from the normal raider's life. All the real complaints are about the difficulty of the normal and heroic raids.

In future raids, the message from the forums seems to be that we'd all like to see LFR maintain the current level of difficulty, and see the normal raids being a real step up. No player should be able to complete a normal raid in the first month. We would like to see raiders at the normal level slaughtered for minor timing issues, for stepping the wrong way, for failing to react quickly enough. That's the first month or so of raiding, after which gear and maybe nerfs will make it more accessible for the lesser skilled 95% of the normal raiders.

At the heroic level, I think the message we get is that every boss should be utterly lethal, that players must behave perfectly or be wiped out instantly. Even gearing up won't save them, until they're really overgearing the raid. Even then they need to be tight in their gameplay or be destroyed.

That seems to summarise the real feedback on LFR. It's too easy for real raiders, but so is the normal mode. Raiders want more challenge.

That said, the concept and execution of LFR in itself seems to be really successful. No-one has advanced an argument against it that can't be either dismissed trivially or is the difficulty one I presented earlier. That's a huge vote in favour of LFR from all posters, and no doubt Blizzard are gathering usage stats at the moment to show how successful it is.
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90 Goblin Mage
9400
Firelands now please!
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MVP
90 Worgen Warlock
10465
Mary and her grandson need epix and super-duper achievements like everybody else - I get it. But it saddens me to seriously feel like we'll never see Ulduars or ICC's in WoW's floundering lifetime again, with the added dev time needed for LFR.


What are you talking about? They were making a LFR version all along likely, they add one ability at a time and test it. Its just the beta version of the Raid with some numbers thats been tweaked....its nothing.


Who exactly are you responding to? You have me quoted as the owner of the quote, but the original quote you're referring to was by someone else that I had quoted.

ETA: Specifically post 898 on the previous page is who I was responding to.
Edited by Alona on 12/8/2011 5:47 AM PST
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90 Goblin Mage
0
Raid Finder is awesome!

Makes jumping into normal raids or looking for a normal raiding guild less spooky.
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90 Blood Elf Warlock
15690
This is absolutely the attitude and language that, in this community, needs to go sit in the corner for a while. If you can't stand the thought of there being multiple difficulty tiers of content -- into which we pour a lot of our development efforts -- to make raiding feasible for more than 2% of players, hit Heroic mode, turn on vent, and repeatedly remind your friends how good you are. I have no doubt they care. :)

Some people, like Vindicare, get it:


Zarhym, you're my Hero

I love the LFR, I would LOVE to have the time to raid on a guild schedule, but RL gets in the way, i can't tell my gf, my friends my family: nah, i can;t see you 3 times a week because we're killing imaginary dragons on a strict schedule

I know I could do it, i've been a reserve on a raid group on my guild for a while, but I simply cannot commit I guess "I don't take this game seriously" and I rather be a "derp pug of retards"
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90 Worgen Warrior
5795
I have never posted to the forums before but after reading this post I felt it necessary. I just wanted to let you know AWESOME post....
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