"I already have a job."

90 Blood Elf Paladin
10580
The problem isnt about having to achieve minor goals for the bigger ones, the problem is being forced to perform a simple task once a day over and over and over again to advance the content along. its a fun tax, its a content throttle, its a hassle. Killing 20 spiders in tol barad got old the 3rd time i did it. Having to do it another 50 to get to a 'goal' that has no bearing towards the game as a whole is just asinine. There is no sense of accomplishment. The spiders arent ever going to NOT be there because of my heroic arachno-slayerery.
At least with the IQD, you unlocked further quest and expanded the factions control of the area. it FELT like my effort was accomplishing something. a year from now the Horde will still be asking me to kill spiders 20 yards from TB base camp.


Exactly. IQD at least had the illusion that your contribution meant something.
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100 Night Elf Death Knight
14790
I have a job...... I play WoW to have fun.... Everything is optional.... What kind of game do you play where you dont have to put time or effort into it to make progress?


lol.
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31 Night Elf Hunter
230
I have a job...... I play WoW to have fun.... Everything is optional.... What kind of game do you play where you dont have to put time or effort into it to make progress?


lol.


Wrath brought on this attitude and now we see it full blown with complaints about dailies and the addition of LFR. People don't want to put any effort or even practice basic social skills. They say it's just a game and means nothing in real life. Sadly, that's the kind of behavior that ends up rearing its head in real life. However, none of them will listen. They'll just retort back and make more excuses.
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You don't have to do them, there's a lot you don't have to do in this game. I am just saying he can't expect to make money if he doesn't want to do anything.
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90 Tauren Paladin
11200
I have a job...... I play WoW to have fun.... Everything is optional.... What kind of game do you play where you dont have to put time or effort into it to make progress?


lol.


Wrath brought on this attitude and now we see it full blown with complaints about dailies and the addition of LFR. People don't want to put any effort or even practice basic social skills. They say it's just a game and means nothing in real life. Sadly, that's the kind of behavior that ends up rearing its head in real life. However, none of them will listen. They'll just retort back and make more excuses.


Putting some effort in, is OK.

Making us do the same thing for 3-4 weeks in a row and get nothing out of it except for a little gold?

That starts getting boring.

That stretch between opening the Firelands Portal and getting your first Vendor unlocked is long and atrocious.

First you have to get 125 seals to get the Druids of the Flame or the Shadow Wardens.
Then you must get ANOTHER 125 seals for whichever one you didn't get the first time.
Then you need 150 seals for your first vendor.

That's 400 seals.

125 of those are gotten at a rate of 14 per day. That's 9 days.
Then another 250 at what was that, again, 26 seals per day? That's 10 days.

So it takes 19 days of daily grinding before you see a single reward.

That's a bit much, especially when some of those quests are annoying (Catch the Birds, or my personal favorite, Wisps and Worms on the same day as some idiot loves grabbing a worm right near your wisp to kill it with the worm's fire breath).
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85 Gnome Priest
3085
Do you need to put effort in to have fun with most games? NO. And this is a game.

And wtf is wrong with some of you? effort is meant to be skill, fun, enjoyable. Effort is now /played?

Thats not effort, thats sitting in front of the computer longer than someone else. Why is that praise worthy? Where is the skill? Why is that the thing that is rewarded in this game? Because its the basis of the genre. /played = subbed.

But it doesnt have to be this way. That is what people are talking about. If you want to earn something, get a damn job, you actually get paid to do mindless crap. Here I am paying, and for what? 95% of the game is a grind based chore that doesnt have 'fun' as the main theme.
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100 Night Elf Druid
18650
Einstein is attributed to saying the following:

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.


Daily quests haven't changed since the Isle of Quel'Danas. Kill a set number of mobs, loot some stuff, use other stuff in a certain place, and collect gold/currency/rep.

The insanity bit comes in to play if you expect to have fun one of these days at some point.

Daily quests keep getting shiny little upgrades, a story-line here or a quest node / zone there. But the simple truth is they are a great way to avoid what WoW is meant to be:

A way for players to use their own intellect to make the game fun for them.

Once I discovered the mind control cap, I leveled engineering. Once I saw noggenfogger, I went and did the quests and ran around in bear form looking like a skeleton. I ran lower level dungeons to see which I could solo, and at level 40 I was soloing WC, popping out of bear form 2-3 times to use health potions.

All of those things have one thing in common: They were nerfed. Significantly.

In their place, players can now spend an engaging hour or two wasting their time.

You say I don't have to complete the dailies? To heck with that, If I don't do every damn FL daily every day I can't have new recipes to make gold. I can't have certain flavor items that change my appearance, non combat pets, the like. Other dailies are for achievments and/or rep. As a completion-ist, I do want to get these perks. But I don't want to be tied down to 1-per day do this on OUR schedule not yours mechanics.

Fine, you want to tie these things to dailies? Allow me to do the quest 7 times in a week any time i darn well choose. Problem solved.
Edited by Kraizee on 12/21/2011 9:34 PM PST
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10 Blood Elf Priest
80
I don't see the big deal. At least you don't have to log in every day to get your freaking valors anymore.

I'm happy.
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35 Orc Rogue
5085
12/21/2011 03:37 PMPosted by Bashiok
Not to toot the Mists of Pandaria horn too hard, but I think our general zone design, daily, and scenario approach is pretty solid. Part of what makes dailies a bit tedious, aside from being tedious, is the rewards are desired but may not always quite fit the time investment.


If you have a zone and it has a grand total of 25 dailies that are possible (though only a maximum of 15-20 available each day) the problem that has been the "tedious" part of your daily design won't be solved by pretty lights and sparklies or even better rewards.

You really should invest more time and effort in to creating a larger pool of POSSIBLE dailies... fine, keep the 15-20 max per day, but the pool should be in the hundreds so you might not see the same daily in the week.

I don't mind dailies... the first 10-15 times i am doing it.. but once we're in the 25-50 times doing it, nothing you can do or say will make it less tedious...

Again, it really isn't the time cost to benefit ratio that people get frustrated by... it REALLY is that we see these same 15-20 daily quests EVERY DAY FOR A MONTH or longer...

INVEST IN MORE WRITERS! (I'm available :)
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
16800
You know, you don't have to do the dailies. I mean, if you want arcanum and shoulder enchants, I guess you do, but after that?

Just sayin'.
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90 Tauren Paladin
11200
If you have a zone and it has a grand total of 25 dailies that are possible (though only a maximum of 15-20 available each day) the problem that has been the "tedious" part of your daily design won't be solved by pretty lights and sparklies or even better rewards.

You really should invest more time and effort in to creating a larger pool of POSSIBLE dailies... fine, keep the 15-20 max per day, but the pool should be in the hundreds so you might not see the same daily in the week.


And for the LOVE OF GOD, PLEASE DON'T MAKE AN ACHIEVEMENT BASED ON DOING THEM ALL.

Praying to the RNG that it gives you THE daily you need for the achievement every time you walk up to the NPC is NOT FUN AT ALL.

Random Dailies? Fine. But don't make us do them all for an achievement unless there's some way to CHOOSE which daily you get, OR, force it to go through a predictable rotation.
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90 Tauren Paladin
11200
You know, you don't have to do the dailies. I mean, if you want arcanum and shoulder enchants, I guess you do, but after that?

Just sayin'.


Molten Front gives you 365 gear.

Said 365 gear comes very much in handy when trying to gear up to start doing Heroics. They are sure better than the 318-333 crap you got from doing quests, right?

Or what about weapons? Non-dailies, best you can get is 333 unless you plunk $$$$$$$$ down on crafted 365s. Even with Chaos Orbs being <50 gold an orb, you still see the stupid things going for 9k+ gold on the AH.
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85 Troll Mage
11370
I think there should be daily quests like Gnomebliteration in Uldum. Which is sadly a 1 time event for each character. That would have been a fun daily to do.
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magine the QQ once WoW dissapears into the void with floating pigs.

" OMG BLIZZ I DID PROFESSIONS FOR X AMOUNT OF TIME FOR X AMOUNT OF YEARS!!!"


buyers regret, something like that.


holy !@#$ i havent even thought of this...
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87 Human Mage
10425
I like the direction Blizzard took with the Firelands Dailies.

Unfortunately, by the time you have finished the grind and unlocked the gear, most of it was made redundant by gearing up through faster means being Valor and JP points.

imo, keep up the good work with daily quest design Blizzard but please consider this.

1) Make the gear from daily faction vendors available for purchase alot quicker so that it can be taken advantage of

2) Make the rewards more compelling for continuing to do said dailies. ie, cool mounts, higher tiers of gear etc

Gotta say though, the achievement mount you got from the Firelands dailies is really cool! For me personally, the time invested grinding these dailies for this was worth it :)
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1 Undead Priest
0
12/21/2011 04:25 PMPosted by Waraila
Which goes along with what Blizzard labeled as one of the leading reasons for the lost of subscriptions was due to content being consumed too fast. With the current direction Cata has been going, it continues to head towards a faster and faster consumption rate model.


Exactly... that was the point i was making...

/shrug.

Dunno what they can do about it now though, they've allowed the general population to win with the complaints of 'it takes too long' and 'it's too hard' to go back to those models...

People are too used to getting everything asap now... so I have no idea what they can realistically do to solve that... and to be honest I don't see challenge mode for dungeons or the senarios helping with this for mists.

What they COULD do to solve it is focus on making the game fun even at a poor level of progression.

"But it's the playerbase's fault for discriminating against people with bad gear!"

Nope, entirely Blizzard's fault. Blizzard can change this. Whether they will is another question entirely.
PvE: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3765088988?page=14#270
PvP: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3765088846

Very short summary: people focus on grinding gear as quickly as possible because only the most recently released content is 'relevant'. Only the most recently released content is relevant because of the gear reset model that became standardized at the end of TBC (and was foreshadowed during the end of vanilla and TBC patch 2.1). To shift the game away from "must grind dailies", JP/VP must go away and the devs would have to concentrate on making the game challenging, instead of making it easy so people can get "$100,000 per year in video game rewards from a repetitive, unfun task".
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90 Tauren Paladin
11200
I like the direction Blizzard took with the Firelands Dailies.

Unfortunately, by the time you have finished the grind and unlocked the gear, most of it was made redundant by gearing up through faster means being Valor and JP points.

imo, keep up the good work with daily quest design Blizzard but please consider this.

1) Make the gear from daily faction vendors available for purchase alot quicker so that it can be taken advantage of

2) Make the rewards more compelling for continuing to do said dailies. ie, cool mounts, higher tiers of gear etc

Gotta say though, the achievement mount you got from the Firelands dailies is really cool! For me personally, the time invested grinding these dailies for this was worth it :)


Well, 365s are still viable even to this day. Before 4.3, you bought 359s with Justice Points and if you were a plate tank, the boots you get from Firelands are better than the 359s, except for the Tier Bonus. But the thing is, you would NEVER get the 4pc bonus unless you raided and got the Shoulder or Head tokens. So you'd have to stick with the 2pc bonus, which would likely be the Body and Gloves, since you got a belt from Ricket (365 reforged DPS belt is better than a 318 or 333 trash quest item, or a PvP item). You got a tank wrist that was pretty nice (better than JP at the time). You got 2 trinkets (nowhere else to get these but Firelands Raid), a Relic (same), 2 Rings, and a Necklace.

Some of those items are still quite viable to this day, a tier later.

My only complaint is how long the grind is before you start seeing actual rewards from doing the dailies. IMO, like I said, reduce the Druids/Wardens to 75 seals and the vendors to 100 seals each.
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31 Night Elf Hunter
230


Wrath brought on this attitude and now we see it full blown with complaints about dailies and the addition of LFR. People don't want to put any effort or even practice basic social skills. They say it's just a game and means nothing in real life. Sadly, that's the kind of behavior that ends up rearing its head in real life. However, none of them will listen. They'll just retort back and make more excuses.


Putting some effort in, is OK.

Making us do the same thing for 3-4 weeks in a row and get nothing out of it except for a little gold?

That starts getting boring.

That stretch between opening the Firelands Portal and getting your first Vendor unlocked is long and atrocious.

First you have to get 125 seals to get the Druids of the Flame or the Shadow Wardens.
Then you must get ANOTHER 125 seals for whichever one you didn't get the first time.
Then you need 150 seals for your first vendor.

That's 400 seals.

125 of those are gotten at a rate of 14 per day. That's 9 days.
Then another 250 at what was that, again, 26 seals per day? That's 10 days.

So it takes 19 days of daily grinding before you see a single reward.

That's a bit much, especially when some of those quests are annoying (Catch the Birds, or my personal favorite, Wisps and Worms on the same day as some idiot loves grabbing a worm right near your wisp to kill it with the worm's fire breath).


OKAY, lets use one example.

My post was more to do with raiding than dailies.

The fun I miss of dailies was doing them with a group of friends. The bombing mission on Sunwell being one of my best examples. Get a group of friends and that was done in a matter of moments. Plus a raid boss taunted you!

And Wrath has perpetuated the attitude. You could grind heroics and soon be sitting pretty with gear. Never stepped foot in a raid but you were "raid ready".

And yes I've done much worse things for fun by your standards than any WoW set of dailies.
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90 Undead Warlock
8840
limit the dailies you do to x per day. no one is asking you to do all 25. happy now? the grind will be much longer, but you dont have to spend 2 hours on it. you can choose which dailies to do. :P if anything, more people actually want to raise the daily cap.

seriously, if the dailies bore you, try going for loremaster. tons of quests and stories out there, you get gold too.


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100 Undead Priest
11955
Just do something else.
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