World of Warcraft™

I'm Guild Master of Blitted on Venture CO.
I totally disagree with Blizzard about changes in 4.3 for guild masters.I do understand that many guilds have they GM's away for long time and something must be done. Many guild configurations are impossible to change w/o GM and officers can't do anything about that. Blizzard created new rule - change GM after 30 days. Who ever first claim the title is a King. This is basic solution created by low IQ ... who ever it was to decide it.
There is a lot of situations in this world, when person can stop playing game for more than 30 days: one of them can be accident, which put person in hospital for few months... and there is no way you can give a notice ahead.
The way I see this option: GM has to have option for back up:
1. Name someone in guild to take your place after 30 days, person you trust, being able to get GM rank back by default.
2. Option to disband guild if you are more than ## days offline
3. Freeze guild for 1-2-3 months , if GM offline.

There also must be link between inactive GM, but subscribed and inactive/unsubscribed.

I would like other GM's to post here and tell they point of view on this problem.
Im sure Blizzard will make some changes towards us.

Thank you everyone.
Shagrl - "Blitted" - VentureCo

The whole idea was stupid. I lost my lvl 25 guild that I worked on for months and they will not even give it back to me. If there going to do this atleast let the old guild master get his rank back to guild master. I like the idea if the GM is not on at all but they need to make it so the old GM can get it back. Accidents do happen and blizzard can't get that thought there thick skull.

I agree with you 100%!

I so agree with ya but your in the wrong forum to get sympathy, I've noticed that on this forum...you'll get well your a bad gm if your gone for an extended leave. Sadly to many people don't understand!

The policy to replace a Guild Leader that has been missing for over 30 days, has been in place since, the advent of Guild Banks, back before BC. The only thing that changed is the automation of the replacement procedure, instead of by a member submitting a support ticket.

It was widely publicized on the patch note, the PTR Forum, as well as several other forums on the web site since mid September, in advance of it taking place at the end of November.

There are several Articles on the B-Net support sites that All Guild leaders should be aware of, and read, from time to time. There is everything from, Guild Bank Permissions, and Preventing Guild Bank Theft, to Guild Master Realm Transfer/Faction Change Procedure. While some are new,, or have changed, the Missing Guild leader replacement policy(Guild Dethrone FAQ, as it is now known as) has been a posted there for years.

It is not Blizzard's fault you did not avail yourself of the Guild/Guild Leader support articles when you started your guild. Nor is it their fault you haven't as Guild Leader kept up with the patch notes, and forums. If you had you would have know about the replacement policy, and the changes to automate the system.

12/28/2011 02:57 PMPosted by Shagrl

. Name someone in guild to take your place after 30 days, person you trust, being able to get GM rank back by default.

Guild rank>>>what everyone should do.

The way I see this option: GM has to have option for back up:
1. Name someone in guild to take your place after 30 days, person you trust, being able to get GM rank back by default.
2. Option to disband guild if you are more than ## days offline
3. Freeze guild for 1-2-3 months , if GM offline.

4. Promoted a trusted and active person(s) to 2nd in rank to take over if the GM is gone for a month.

Option 4 is a good idea even if a GM is not planning to be gone a month.

12/28/2011 02:57 PMPosted by Shagrl

Blizzard created new rule - change GM after 30 days. Who ever first claim the title is a King. This is basic solution created by low IQ ... who ever it was to decide it.

This is completely misguided and incorrect.

Blizzard put the tool in place because before the tool, all that was required was for the Guild Leader to be gone 30 days, and someone to put in a ticket. Anyone to put in a ticket. This has been in place for as long as I can remember, and I've been playing for 6+ years. While some GMs actually did try to give the guild to someone in a rank that would make sense for it, in a lot of cases whoever was the first to put the ticket in was given guild leader. That was what was before the tool, and it wasn't ideal, for the reasons you point out.

The tool, however, automates it. And puts in very specific rules.

First, you can't do anything until the guild leader's character has not been active until 30 days pass. Once that happens, the tool automatically looks for the first rank that has active players in them. This should be rank 1: your officer rank. Your officers (who should be promoted to that rank because they should be able to run the guild, and thus would be "next in command") would then have the option to take control of the guild. If they are active, and don't do anything.... then nothing at all happens.

In other words, the tool allows for your #1 already: Put the people you'd name to take over the guild in rank 1, and tell them to be active.

Keep in mind, active is determined by character. If you're playing an alt and haven't logged onto your GL toon in 30 days, too bad, so sad. Log in more. It takes less than five minutes once a month.

Your options 2 and 3 are worse for the guild. Why would anyone want a guild to simply disband just because a Guild Leader couldn't be bothered to log in (or wasn't able to log in)? That helps no one. And for #3, it's exactly the same... instead of being disbanded, you're stuck in a guild in limbo, which is precisely why people started putting in tickets in the first place that caused this to be put in place.

Again, the simplest way to keep your guild leader toon as guild leader: log in. The next simplest way: give someone else Guild Leader if you're going to be absent for an extended period. Third simplest way: promote good officers to rank 1, and make sure they're active in case you go inactive, and make sure they know to grab it before someone else does if you go inactive.

And through all of them, the simplest of all: make sure you communicate with your officers, so that they know what to do, even if you are incapacitated and unable to tell them specifically. It's easy enough: if you don't hear from me in X number of days (less than 30), then when the tool shows up I'd like X, Y or Z to take it until I get back to keep it safe.

You are very poorly mis-informed:

Blizzard created new rule - change GM after 30 days.

The rule was 'new' 6 years ago. It was automated in 4.3 which I personally disagree with. But its not a new rule. Its the way its always been. Just now a button pops up alerting people 'its time' as opposed to people having to get off their lazy butts and actively trying to do something about it.

Who ever first claim the title is a King.

Nope. Not true at all. After 30 days of complete inactivity from the GM, everybody in Rank1 gets access to the button. Only people in rank 1. If nobody in rank 1 meets that criteria then people in rank 2. And so on and so forth down the line. Within a given rank the person who hit the button will get lead. But it is not 'first person is king.' There are some checks and balances.

This is basic solution created by low IQ ... who ever it was to decide it.

Opinion and name calling and not really needed nor called for in a discussion.

There is a lot of situations in this world, when person can stop playing game for more than 30 days: one of them can be accident, which put person in hospital for few months... and there is no way you can give a notice ahead.

Think about your red herring for a moment. Please really think about the reality of it. I'll tell you right now, I'm an insurance agent. Before that I was in claims. I've spent 13 years in the industry. I've handled thousands of claims and have had my hands in tens of thousands of claims. The % of accidents that put people in the hospital for months (or honestly even beyond 2 weeks) is so low its not worth making a rule to protect against. And blizzard should not be expected to come up with a rule that covers every single corner case or exceptional circumstance that could arise. That is an unreasonable demand to put on them.




[/quote] The way I see this option: GM has to have option for back up:
1. Name someone in guild to take your place after 30 days, person you trust, being able to get GM rank back by default.[/quote]

This is a great idea. And can be done. Put 1 person and only 1 person at rank 1. Then put the rest of your officers at rank 2 and give rank 2 access to /o chat. Blizzard has already provided the tools to accomplish just this.

2. Option to disband guild if you are more than ## days offline

Yes, its an option. But that flies in the face of the guild perks and guild leveling system. Because 1 person is going to stop playing everybody loses out. That is your proposal. Think hard on that one and then think about how blizzard would view 1 person who stopped playing (and possibly stopped paying a monthly fee) losing out on something vs 1-500 people who are still paying customers losing out.

3. Freeze guild for 1-2-3 months , if GM offline.

Again, see my response to idea #2. Its an impractical business model and quite frankly, extremely selfish of a GM to think he should be able to stop playing and participating in a guild for an extended period and have all his members stuck in limbo.

There also must be link between inactive GM, but subscribed and inactive/unsubscribed.

This is something I could get behind. I'm not sure exactly where to go with it or what it could mean, but its a starting point.

I would like other GM's to post here and tell they point of view on this problem.
Im sure Blizzard will make some changes towards us.

Thank you everyone.
Shagrl - "Blitted" - VentureCo

I am a GM. I helped found a guild as a charter member and officer and gladly watched another person be GM. One day that GM did not get her way and her response was to disband the guild. So about 90% of us formed a new guild. Again I was an officer, charting member and raid leader. I built that guild. Probably 75-85% of its members were recruited by me during raids and came to us for raiding. I watched that GM decide she was tired of raiding, therefore, by extension she didn't want a raiding guild. I eventually felt no choice but to leave a guild I built from the ground up and start fresh. Now Im the gm. I get to run things my way and not worry about. But I will never do my guildies, friends and raiders what was done to me in the past. Either by actively changing things or letting it all slip away by inactivity. If I disappear for more than a month and somebody takes my guild I will only be disappointed if they take it and change it. But at that point, I've been gone for a month. People who depend on me to run things, organize things, keep things active alive and running....they've been left out int he cold. They need an option to replace me and maintain the guild they helped build up

If you can help me to know where to post, I'd appreciate it.

The policy to replace a Guild Leader that has been missing for over 30 days, has been in place since, the advent of Guild Banks, back before BC. The only thing that changed is the automation of the replacement procedure, instead of by a member submitting a support ticket.

It was widely publicized on the patch note, the PTR Forum, as well as several other forums on the web site since mid September, in advance of it taking place at the end of November.

There are several Articles on the B-Net support sites that All Guild leaders should be aware of, and read, from time to time. There is everything from, Guild Bank Permissions, and Preventing Guild Bank Theft, to Guild Master Realm Transfer/Faction Change Procedure. While some are new,, or have changed, the Missing Guild leader replacement policy(Guild Dethrone FAQ, as it is now known as) has been a posted there for years.

It is not Blizzard's fault you did not avail yourself of the Guild/Guild Leader support articles when you started your guild. Nor is it their fault you haven't as Guild Leader kept up with the patch notes, and forums. If you had you would have know about the replacement policy, and the changes to automate the system.

Thanks for the info, my question is: what if GM disappears by accident and come back in few months? then what? Why kick out from guild, why not to demote to officer? Why other inactive can stay in guild for years?

12/29/2011 12:55 PMPosted by Mazzardor

. Name someone in guild to take your place after 30 days, person you trust, being able to get GM rank back by default.

Guild rank>>>what everyone should do.

Yes thats what i figured out.
My next rank is officer, person i trust and who started guild with me 3 years ago.

The way I see this option: GM has to have option for back up:
1. Name someone in guild to take your place after 30 days, person you trust, being able to get GM rank back by default.
2. Option to disband guild if you are more than ## days offline
3. Freeze guild for 1-2-3 months , if GM offline.

4. Promoted a trusted and active person(s) to 2nd in rank to take over if the GM is gone for a month.

Option 4 is a good idea even if a GM is not planning to be gone a month.

And that system is already in place automatically as well.

Create the 2nd highest rank having 1 person in it, your dedicated replacement should anything happen to you. Done problem solved. And quite frankly i dont think anyone that cant even bother to log in for over a month should have much to complain about when they lose ownership of a guild. guilds are for the guildmembers that those that are still playing the game can do basic and important things even when a so called GM goes missing for months is more important than having a GM think he owns a guild at all cost.

Another question:
Log in on the phone using WOW app - does that count?
I can use AH, bids, chat, schedule...

4. Promoted a trusted and active person(s) to 2nd in rank to take over if the GM is gone for a month.

Option 4 is a good idea even if a GM is not planning to be gone a month.

And that system is already in place automatically as well.

Create the 2nd highest rank having 1 person in it, your dedicated replacement should anything happen to you. Done problem solved. And quite frankly i dont think anyone that cant even bother to log in for over a month should have much to complain about when they lose ownership of a guild. guilds are for the guildmembers that those that are still playing the game can do basic and important things even when a so called GM goes missing for months is more important than having a GM think he owns a guild at all cost.

Thank you.
Looks like my options #2&3 are bad, that's why there are options to put away.
With 4th I agree.
Thanks everyone for the comments. I will restructure rank system for GM back up.

P.S.
Few years ago, when I transferred GM rank from one toon to another, I asked my friend (officer rank) to be a GM, then I relog to another toon and he gave GM rank to my another toon.

Thanks for the info, my question is: what if GM disappears by accident and come back in few months? then what? Why kick out from guild, why not to demote to officer? Why other inactive can stay in guild for years?

If the gm disappears for a few months and somebody hits the button, guild leadership transfers and the guild can continue functioning. AFAIK the guild leader is not kicked from the guild. He is simply removed from guild leaders. The new gm can remove him.

As for the second part of the question: Any given non-GM member can be removed at any time by the gm. This solves any problems the gm or guild has with the member. Nobody can remove the GM, hence the need for the transfer of leadership.

People staying in a guild for years inactive is allowed by the gm, nothing more.

The idea that one should have to log in ever to retain control of a guild they created and built is unacceptable. If there are memebers who feel they want a guild with a more active GM they have the right to leave but under no circumstances should Blizzard be facilitating the theft of a guild and the pillaging of a guild bank by another memeber of a guild created by someone who say has a life, a wife , a job, or kids and simply isnt able to log in as often as Blizzard feels they should. Its not as though we are not paying customers; this is the height of poor customer service. I am not only a paying customer but a stockholder and I am appalled that anyone at Blizzard was so foolish and incomptetent as to think this was a sound policy automated or not. A guild is the creation of the guild master and subject to those rules and policies which that GM provides and should not be interefred with by Blizzard unless something really inappropriate is going on. I had my guild, Praetorian Guard on The Forgotten Coast, stolen from me and the bank drained with the help of this idiotic policy enacted by Blizzard. I set this guild up for myself and a few friends who actually have lives and jobs outside of WoW and now not only has Blizzard destroyed it, they refuse to rectify their obvious error. This policy must be changed. Some guy I dont even actually know has been "elected" GM and cleaned out all the items and gold my real life friends and I amassed. Its simple if you dont like the GM, the guild, the frequency the GM logs in it should be left to the individual player to leave the guild not up to Blizzard to remove the GM and put someone else in charge.

12/31/2011 01:09 PMPosted by Polyphemos

Some guy I dont even actually know has been "elected" GM and cleaned out all the items and gold my real life friends and I

First: Someone need to have invited the "stranger" into the guild.

Second: Then the "stranger" had to have worked their way up the guild ranks, to be in a good procession to take over the guild. As the higher their rank the better the chance.

Third: Then the Guild Leader needed to have disappeared for 30 days. If the "stranger" clairvoyant enough to know that far in advance which Guild to join as the GL is going to disappear;They could be making a killing in the stock market.

Fourth: All members of a higher rank needed to have disappeared as well or other wise ineligible. He would also, would of had to log in and out constantly on the 31st day, to beat out any member of an equal rank.

If you leave you car abandoned on the side of the road for 30 days, don't expect it to be there when you return for it. Try accusing, in a public forum, the owner of the towing company, that is contracted to remove abandoned cars, of stealing your car.

You and your officers abandoned the guild. Again the policy to replace a Guild Leader that has been missing for over 30 days, has been in place since, the advent of Guild Banks, back before BC. It is not Blizzard's fault you did not know about, and did not take the needed precautions prevent this from happening.

I agree with you Polyphemos. People have real lives. Things like overtime at work and a death in the family can cause a person, such as my boyfriend, to not be able to log in for a month. We were lucky that a friend in real life became the Guild Master. Not everyone's life revolves around World of Warcraft.

It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree with the policy, it is highly unlikely Blizzard will get rid of it. The policy itself has worked well, for the most part, for years, with very few problems. Yes: From time to time there have been a very few, horror stories of the new GL Gkicking everyone and cleaning out the guild bank. But blizzard has stepped in and fix the damage done.

While I do have some real concerns about the automation of the procedure, so far there have very small percentage of horror stores caused by it. In fact must of the ones that have been posted since the patch, stem from before the change went into effect.

I have said in many a time in other threads on on this subject: Most of the horror stories of low level members taking over a Guild, kicking all the members, robbing the Guild Bank, and then selling the guild; Is because the officers trusted by the Guild leader, to run the guild in their absents, shirked their responsibilities, and disappear as well.

However unless there was some means for the officers to get in touch with the GL in case something came up; The responsibility still falls squarely in the GL's shoulders. Even a message posted on your guild website, would have sufficed. If they didn't I have no sympathy for the GL. As the officers would have had no way of letting him know, that something has come up, and they could not fulfill their obligations to the GL and the guild.