Topic The pains of small guilds on a small server.
Based on the WoW server census sites, SWC is a Med pop server.
I have a hard time agreeing with this these days.
My first toon on SWC was born between Kara and the ZA patch.
The raiding scene on this server has never been cutting edge, but it has always had a competitive edge. There has always been strong 25 man guilds here… Pantheon, Honor Bound, and Paradigm… followed by guilds like CV, Velocity, CBC, and Final Boss.
Raiding was once heavy on both sides, but now the boards show Alliance favored.
Recently, with ToR and the general “meh” feeling many have for WoW’s direction/current state… I see mid-to-small size older guilds starting to slow down or fracture.
It amazes me even more to see so many new little guilds try and start up under the current climate.
Being in a lvl 25 guild is a blessing and a curse. It’s hard to recruit when you are not 25, yet it’s hard to leave a guild once it hits 25 (and you reach exalted).
The price tag of $25 per toon to transfer off doesn’t help either.
The point I am getting at, trying to start over on SWC is getting harder to do.
All recruiting guilds are picking from the same small and shrinking player base, while waiting for the next older guild to fizzle. Raiding is not dead here, but it’s getting unhealthy. Remember, this realm is an RP server. That isn’t super attractive to a big time PVE player.
(don’t get me started on how I got tricked into being here)
Over the last week or so, I have been sending mails out to people trying to start up some sort of guild merger, mega guild, or even just a general partnership. I will send more to anohter bunch of players this weekend. The idea has been met with a lot of “sounds great, I will talk to the officers”, or no reply at all.
For the Alliance side, Lucid Dreams, Pantheon, and CV are holding strong and moving along.
Everyone else is doing their best to move along. I know it has to get old when you need to call a raid because 1 or 2 of the regulars can’t make it, you can’t find a geared enough sub/alt, or the pugs you got are spirit gemming mages.
It’s not all bad.
You can get lucky enough to ask a friend in another guild to help, or at the last minute someone logs on as you are getting ready to call it.
The thing is, it shouldn’t be this hard.
I am going to make a baby-step attempt to take the pain out of missing 1 person.
Over the weekend I will make a new channel, similar to what did work during ICC, "Puglife", add hope it not only takes the sting out of missing a player, but also provides an easier way to screen and recruit.
I will update this thread later with the name.
Also, I am open to chat with any other GMs or players in the same boat.
The server has plenty of good raiders, but they are spread out far too thin right now.
Unless ToR implodes, Bliz mergers SWC, or the beta for Pandas blows everyone away… this server is going to get slower and slower.
Edited by Freznar on 1/20/12 3:29 PM (PST)
Careful with mergers. Paradigm tried to merge with another guild when it was dying, and it just made people even more unhappy and accelerated the eventual death. Really gotta make sure you have the right fit of people before going through with it.
ahh the good o'l days. Back in the peak of wrath were the server was filled with people. Until they shifted there markets to Asia, specifically china. Why do you think they released pandas. The US market has gone down significantly with gaming. thats why there realizing pandas.
I believe, all US servers will continue to shrink. Wow had its peak with the end of Wrath. That is something that wont happen again. The question is how quickly will wow deflate.
Edited by Nefthulhu on 1/21/12 12:02 PM (PST)
I think this is a great point, and a valid one. The people that want to raid, and could do well, are really spread out over many, many, many tiny guilds that can put together 7-8 people for a raid, then need to pug 2-3 spots which is a complete crap shoot.
We can decide to work together and really experience the end game content, enjoying the satisfaction that goes along with clearing regular then heroic content. The alternative is we can keep things quid pro quo, so to speak, and have over half the server population still struggle to the point of frustration with being able to put together half functioning raids.
I think this is a great attempt at trying to pull the server together a bit by Manny. I dont think many of people would spearhead something like this. Whereas he might be a terrible Blood tank :) ... he's a good dude.
People dont want to make mergers because
a)They are too risky and
b)All the effort they put in leveling their guild will be for nothing.
It is really true that a lot of good players are too spread around small guilds, bhut it only their desition to keep like this, or try merging/joining a bigger guild =/
This is an interesting idea Manny.
It can be difficult for smaller guilds on our server and if this offers some of the smaller guilds a chance to keep raiding with less headache from bad puggies, I'm all for it.
However, I wouldn't be surprised if you get a fair amount of negative response as well. It can be difficult to acknowledge that your guild is struggling and has a need for QUALITY bodies...
That said, I tend to agree that many will balk at the idea of a mergers, but if we can create a community of guild and raid leads who can communicate and possibly help each other keeping our raids moving forward, then that is something I will happily accept on our little RP server.
Lord knows when I look at my roster and I see only melee dps when we're trying to learn Warmaster Blackhorn, I'd LOVE the possibility of finding quality ranged dps without necessarily having to 'pillage' from other guilds' rosters, heh.
I look forward to seeing how /thelist grows and I hope your efforts are reasonably well received.
Edited by Akumamanny on 1/23/12 7:39 AM (PST)
When I jumped on this weekend it was a pleasant surprise to see chatter going on in /thelist.
Not sure what raids or even 5 mans came out of it, but I was part of a Bhold that used the channel.
This week I hope that either myself or another Symbiosis officer will be using this to set up raids later in the week (Thursday on).
I think I will be checking it tonight for a healer (maybe a tank too) for just Deathwing (Madness). That would be around 915/930 server.
If you have not cleared Madness yet, and know the fight, please look for me (or check the channel) tonight.
I always wondered what happened to Natural order. I stopped playing for a year and came back and the guild disappeared. With my playing experience I only knew of two great guild leaders of raids, Akrean was one of them and obviously the guild I am now. Always treated everyone good and never made you feel inferior.
Aw shucks, thanks Kyouu!
We're on Ysera now. Servers are slowly fizzling everywhere, with people spread out in 10-man guilds.
I'm trying to re-motivate people everywhere to care about 25-man raiding again. Whether it requires server transfers, consolidations, my guild, or everyone's guilds-- I hate to see the activity I've enjoyed for over 500 days /played be snuffed out by a change in the player base.
Edited by Hecel on 2/20/12 6:10 PM (PST)
It wouldn't be so bad if your average 25 man raiding guild on the SwC didn't ask you to raid 3-4 days a week until nearly midnight each day. You guys are proposefully choosing a small pool of players because of those hours. How you guys aren't aware of this is totally beyond me.
For example, on Illdian, I raid with a 25 man guild that raids one night a week. Boom, we're done with we even some attempts at heroic progression. 25 man guilds are fun! But your hours are silly.
For what it's worth however. I plan on going back to SwC to help out. I miss the server. However, it's going to be with a lesser known guild with friendlier hours. :)