Please bring back whoever designed Ulduar

90 Human Rogue
15220
Ulduar was very enjoyable.

DS I can fall alseep it cause the fights are so repetative spine..madness...etc

Not too mention how fast people get burnt out on it with LFR + LFR on alts, then normal on mains etc.

-Wham
33 Blood Elf Paladin
190
As that semi troll pages back was ranting on and on about.. let's look at the numbers. Highest subscriptions ever during wrath model. Bring back separate lock outs for ten and twenty five mans, keeping a better reward for twenty five mans. You can raid twenty five with the guild and pug or casually raid tens with friends on weekends (if you are the kind of player that wants to invest that much time.) Casuals can still raid only ten man. Keep the 25 man loot a higher ilvl to keep incentive.

I'd prefer the LFR be done away with completely but we know that won't ever happen. There was something to be said about exploring a new raid dungeon for the first time and really having that feeling of accomplishment as you finally progressed onto the next area, say the keepers, or general v, etc. Blasting through the raid on LFR diminishes the epic feeling in your guild raids and reduces the staying power of the current content. (Watching videos on youtube =/= truly stepping into the content)

LFD is fine for the 5 mans, but the raids shouldn't be reduced to the world of quecraft. Server community is non existent. Everyone lives inside of their ten man bubble. Without the social/community aspect, the game does begin to feel like a job.

Bring back more Ulduar raids!! I'd prefer 14 unique bosses with encounter specific HM triggers, rather than 7-8 bosses with a difficulty switch before you enter. How this is even an argument truly boggles my mind.

The idea of a carrot is important. This new rushed model of WoW may look better initially, or more people might blast through content, but subscriptions are dropping fast, and people are getting bored. Carrots keep the playerbase interested. Sarth HM and Yogg HM are good carrots. Blasting through DS on LFR and then on normal and then again on HM...well, there is no carrot there. Not anywhere. Especially when the loot all looks exactly the same.

TL DR: Seperate 25 man and 10 man lockouts. Preferably better reward in the 25 man.
Remove LFR, keep LFD. When is community > instant gratification???
Ulduar style raids with encounter specific HM triggers. Sarth style raids
Stop rushing content and immediately blasting everyone to the same ilvl.
Put a sense of progression into the game again. This is an MMO, not CoD.
85 Night Elf Druid
5100
Pushing a big red button for Mimiron was very cool, and again is fondly remembered. We have created something like 40 raid bosses since the creation of those encounters however, and we cant help but think that it would start to feel really gimmicky and forced if every raid encounter had its difficulty set by pushing a button, (or not killing adds, or changing the order you kill the bosses, or the other mechanics we used in Ulduar). We think Mimiron would feel less special if there were six more bosses in the game with big red buttons, and we’re just not sure the design space is there to have a near infinite variety of means by which players launch a heroic mode in game.


And how we currently convert to HMs is better how? Are there no other ways to activate a Hard Mode then killing adds, or boss kill order, or [insert Ulduar boss mechanic]? Surely you can come up with something new and exciting, as Ulduar was when it was fresh. There is a world of possibilities. Variety is the spice of life, not the Regular/Heroic Mode toggle we now have...
90 Draenei Shaman
11955
I Raided Ulduar and they did nerf it at one point but it was still a very nice place and even at 85 its still a fun place to raid
86 Troll Druid
5885
"This is a MMO, not CoD"

Best. Comment. Ever.
100 Human Mage
17600
01/26/2012 12:11 PMPosted by Kaivax
Nonetheless, because there are so many requests for those style mechanics, we are considering doing a few bosses with optional modes (in the same way Mimiron, Freya or Sartharion had them) in Mists of Pandaria.


Woot! I loved how different the fight became for some of those fights when you changed the order or did a medium mode vs easy or hard mode. Too many of today's heroic modes are extra damage with maybe one mechanic added and they are binary - normal or maximum difficulty heroic. I loved having medium modes to work your way up to hard.

Also, as one of the guilds who didn't have time to clear Ulduar in the amount of time we had to raid each week I'd like to suggest doing more parallel pathing like Nax had with the four wings and the end boss wing. Having too many mandatory bosses leads to using the lockout extension which as you mentioned shorts you on loot, but we are willing to do that to get those final kills. However, it would be nicer if we had a way of skipping entry bosses we've farmed the most and need nothing off of.

I wasn't as big a fan of the three places in vastly different areas because you wind up having three hard end bosses to try and tackle and you have three places to travel between which in the case of wind bag - didn't feel worth the time spent getting there for just two bosses and junk loot. I also just like the larger places better because they usually feel more vast and impressive as long as they are not empty grey/blue catwalks like ICC :P
30 Tauren Warrior
0
The idea of a carrot is important. This new rushed model of WoW may look better initially, or more people might blast through content, but subscriptions are dropping fast, and people are getting bored. Carrots keep the playerbase interested. Sarth HM and Yogg HM are good carrots. Blasting through DS on LFR and then on normal and then again on HM...well, there is no carrot there. Not anywhere. Especially when the loot all looks exactly the same.


Agree completely with this. When we're able to rush through the content in a week people get bored much more quickly than they should and drops in subs begin. In future raids Blizz should have bosses that are only in Normals and Heroics and NOT in LFR to keep incentive for running those places aside from getting gear that's a few ilvls more.
90 Human Death Knight
0
01/26/2012 12:28 PMPosted by Syrella
We waited 8 months for Firelands to come out with 7 bosses but we only waited 5 for Ulduar to come out with 14. I'm not sure how more raid bosses means longer wait time.


Tankspot.com did a really good piece on Ulduar and why that raid was distinct in quality compared to other tiers. When WotLK released, the major raid was Naxx, which had already been released from Vanilla. This gave them not 5 months to work on the content but something much more than that. It was definitely a case of working longer on the raid that resulted in more and better content.

The other thing that I think contributes to Ulduar being looked back on favorably is that it wasn't overplayed by the majority of the playerbase. There was more content with less time and frankly I think its one of the few raids that people didn't play until they were completely sick of it.

Finally Morhaime has hinted that budgeting for WoW development has been decreased in their financial meetings. The obvious downscale in the amount of endgame PvE content in Cataclysm could reflect that. 4.0 was great. 4.1 had nothing new for raiding. 4.2 had 1/2 of Ulduar. We had no ToC. 4.3 had 3/4 of ICC. There was less raid content in comparison to WotLK.
Edited by Lucius on 1/27/2012 5:35 AM PST
85 Night Elf Rogue
9225
01/26/2012 12:11 PMPosted by Kaivax
Here's the thing -- Ulduar is an example of a raid where lots of players got to enjoy the first few bosses, and very few players ever saw the last few. Yogg Saron and Algalon were among the least-killed bosses ever, and not because they were exceedingly difficult. Rather, clearing the dungeon all the way to Yogg took up a big chunk of a raiding week (and you only had an hour to kill Algalon), and the ability to extend raid lockouts came later in 3.2.0 (but extending raid lockouts means getting less loot overall).

I'd respectfully disagree that the length of the raid is relevant to the fact that people enjoyed the atmosphere of the instance significantly more than subsequent raid tier content. There was just something... IMPRESSIVE about that place that I just simply haven't felt anywhere else since.

The reference to raid length is pertinent in and of itself, and I may well have highly appreciated an LFR version of Ulduar at the time since I didn't join a raiding guild until Trial of the Crusader, but I completely believe you can have a sensational raid instance with as few or as many bosses as you want. What's important is the environment. Ulduar had it, and then it just... evaporated somewhere. Imho.

I'm comfortable with the 7-8 boss limit that's been in place for T12/T13, although I wish we could separate normal and heroic lockouts while we're at it. It'd be nice to just spend the free time at the end of the raid week on hardmode progression instead of troubling over how much time we can give to it while still allowing enough time for the regular clear / hoping people show up for the rest of the week to boot.

That way you get 7-8 bosses, with a maximum of 14-16 IF you can handle them.
Edited by Verelyse on 1/27/2012 5:39 AM PST
90 Pandaren Mage
10420
01/26/2012 12:28 PMPosted by Syrella
We waited 8 months for Firelands to come out with 7 bosses but we only waited 5 for Ulduar to come out with 14. I'm not sure how more raid bosses means longer wait time.
More like 7.5 months
85 Tauren Druid
6790
Love this post
85 Orc Rogue
5655
01/25/2012 04:12 PMPosted by Nithalak
Wasn't this the raid everyone hated on for the entirety of Wrath?
wat
100 Night Elf Rogue
23435
01/26/2012 12:11 PMPosted by Kaivax
Pushing a big red button for Mimiron was very cool, and again is fondly remembered. We have created something like 40 raid bosses since the creation of those encounters however, and we cant help but think that it would start to feel really gimmicky and forced if every raid encounter had its difficulty set by pushing a button, (or not killing adds, or changing the order you kill the bosses, or the other mechanics we used in Ulduar).


I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that I don't believe players are asking devs for another 6 red buttons. My belief is that the creative minds that who brought us all this wonderful content can easily come up with new and innovative ways to trigger hardmodes that are much more interesting than a "toggle".

People aren't asking for 6 more red buttons. People are asking for you to go back to the incredible creativity that existed in Ulduar. Interesting ways of triggering hard modes ... creative bosses ... a large and impressive instance design ... multiple loot tiers ... special bosses with limited access ... and much more.

Especially with the extended raid lock, it makes more sense to design instances LIKE ulduar today as opposed to the small dungeon-style quick raids like we have currently.
90 Undead Death Knight
15280
F Ulduar and F extending raid lockouts. Huge raid instances and the need to lock a raid ID is exactly what I DON'T want from raiding. My guild simply would never see late-game content without coming to the same raid ID two weeks in a row and extending a raid lockout deprives them of chances at loot from early bosses. I love how Ulduar looks and all the lore wrapped around it but it was extremely long. Even now when we're going back to it to get people their Proto's or finish off old achievements we still spend a long time in there and most of our guild is people who have kids to take care of, jobs to get up early for, and/or spouses that either don't play or don't like the game entirely.
85 Tauren Paladin
4940
Even if it did take a year to make ulduar , we are still in the cata exp , if they started to make a epic raid like ulduar (not exactly like ulduar) it would be done by mid to end of mop.
90 Tauren Druid
14530
Ulduar was one of the most epic raids in all of WoW. The fights were interesting and the zone looked terrific. It would be great if Blizz could start making raids like that again. Overall the WOTLK raids were far superior to the Cata raids.
This topic has reached its post limit. You may no longer post or reply to posts for this topic.

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]