World of Warcraft™

Some good news lately, we're in the top 10 most progressed realms in the US for 25-man raiding. http://www.wowprogress.com/realms/rank/us/rating.tier13_25

While the credit mostly goes to Midwinter, I would also like to remind everyone how rewarding 25-man raiding can be despite the difficulties in organizing the guild.

The grass is often greener with how easy realm transfers are, but I would encourage people to stick around, try to fix our awful economy, and make Ysera a good home.

So whether you are in Midwinter, Natural Order, aboard the Late Night Pain Train, Havoc, Continuum, Executive Order, Queen Anne's Revenge, or any other guild pushing through Dragon Soul on 25-man, I would like to thank you for hanging in there and making Ysera a great realm to be on!

Regards, keep truckin'

Akraen
GM of Natural Order
http://naturalorderguild.com

Not to be a downer, but the unfortunate truth is that spine and madness are so heavily weighted that we're just going to be slipping more and more in rank as the higher pop servers' 2nd line of guilds start getting them too.

Trying to drum up some confidence! I'd rather people come here than leave here.

dont be a debbie downer ganzar gosh

One good guild, doesn't mean Ysera is well off.

You talk like the only content that matters is 25 man.
Having come from a 25 man progression guild years ago, I much prefer the smaller 10 mans.
This server has quite a few 10 man guilds worth bragging about.

Playing WoW for the last 7 years means I have seen what I needed to see to come to my opinions about the game. I have no feelings of nostalgia about the old 40 man raids. Ysera is doing just fine. If people want to be in a top progressing guild and raid 30 to 40 hours a week to be #1 in the world, they'll go somewhere else and do that.

Don't try to bill our server as a place to come for hard-core progression. That's not the type of player anyone should want to transfer in. You're asking me why? Simple. Those sorts of players transfer in to the server, get what they came for, and then transfer off the server. Recruit players who want to experience the game with people they can enjoy playing with.

But then again.... I'm just a grumpy old school gamer chick pushing 40.

Sorry, this is your server?

Try to be proud of others as they also sustain you.

You talk like the only content that matters is 25 man.
Having come from a 25 man progression guild years ago, I much prefer the smaller 10 mans.
This server has quite a few 10 man guilds worth bragging about.

Playing WoW for the last 7 years means I have seen what I needed to see to come to my opinions about the game. I have no feelings of nostalgia about the old 40 man raids. Ysera is doing just fine. If people want to be in a top progressing guild and raid 30 to 40 hours a week to be #1 in the world, they'll go somewhere else and do that.

Don't try to bill our server as a place to come for hard-core progression. That's not the type of player anyone should want to transfer in. You're asking me why? Simple. Those sorts of players transfer in to the server, get what they came for, and then transfer off the server. Recruit players who want to experience the game with people they can enjoy playing with.

But then again.... I'm just a grumpy old school gamer chick pushing 40.

You should avoid public speaking. I won't speak on how easy it is to skate along in undertuned 10 mans.. *cough* but organizing and maintaining a 25 man raid is much more difficult.

I said nothing about difficulty. My point in fact had nothing to do with comparing 10 vs 25 epeen values. If you want difficult, try leaving your room to go socialize in public with complete strangers. And do it without offending them. I doubt the majority of players play WoW for the difficulty level.

My point was that guilds should be more focused on attracting players of honest character, not characters of apocryphal players. It has been my experience that most (but not all) players solely interested in progression raids without any interest in their fellow players don't stick around after progression is done.

And being proud of who is sustaining me? Try clicking on my guild tag, just to the left of this post near my character portrait. Those are the only people who really count toward "sustaining" my raiding. I can't raid current content alone, obviously. I raid because it's fun. The people are fun. The content is fun. And that is ALL that counts to me.

People should come to Ysera because Ysera is a good server to play on.
It's as simple as that.

Get the hell over yourself. Read my original post. I said nothing about 10 man. Nothing negative, nothing positive.

I was patting the backs of EVERY 25-man raiding guild and you act as though I am starting that debate. Your laughable little guild isn't even on my radar.

This is why I pat 25-man guilds on the back for continuing to truck along:

Shannox 25 man while current: 4781 25-man guilds world-wide.

Lord Marrowgar 25 man while current: 59,356 25-man guilds world-wide.


Which gives us 1.3 million 25 man raiders that didn't kill the 1st boss in the latest content.
It's a 92% drop in 25 man raiding kills since Wrath. It's massive.

Then, 4212 Morchok 25 man kills as of today.

# of 25m Guilds on First Bosses of Heroic Tier:
4698 Halfus 25 man Heroic.
to
4054 Shannox 25 man Heroic.
to
2111 Morchok 25 man Heroic.

# of 25m Guilds on Last Bosses of Heroic Tier:
685 Sinestra 25 man Heroic.
to
365 Ragnaros 25 man Heroic.
to
88 Deathwing 25 man Heroic.

You apparently need to work on your reading comprehension.
I was not referencing anything you posted beyond the fact that you LEFT OUT the 10 mans as though they don't count at all. Maybe in your little corner of the world 10m mans are a joke. But I bet the majority of your new recruits come from 10 man backgrounds.
Numbers mean nothing to me, nor to players like me. And I would tell you to ask Blizzard... Players like me are the majority now- We are the 98% (LOL!). We play because it is fun and kills time for ~12 hours a week verses your 30+ hours a week.
Proof: http://www.guildox.com/go/g.asp?w=N&ID=320
PROGRESSION RAIDERS ONLY MAKE UP 2% OF THE OVER-ALL WOW POPULATION.
The numbers, as you pointed out, are even more abysmal for H DS than they were for H FL. Chew on that math.
Grats on your being a member of the 1%
Tee hee. :)

Have a couple of good reads for you:
http://manaflask.com/en/article/1540/the-raiding-pinnacle-angered-10-man
http://manaflask.com/en/article/1554/the-raiding-pinnacle-angered-10-man-part-1



My statement three posts above stands firm and true:

People should come to Ysera because Ysera is a good server to play on.
It's as simple as that.

02/05/2012 03:26 PMPosted by Peako

You apparently need to work on your reading comprehension.

You should work on yours then.

You apparently need to work on your reading comprehension.
I was not referencing anything you posted beyond the fact that you LEFT OUT the 10 mans as though they don't count at all. Maybe in your little corner of the world 10m mans are a joke. But I bet the majority of your new recruits come from 10 man backgrounds.
Numbers mean nothing to me, nor to players like me. And I would tell you to ask Blizzard... Players like me are the majority now- We are the 98% (LOL!). We play because it is fun and kills time for ~12 hours a week verses your 30+ hours a week.
Proof: http://www.guildox.com/go/g.asp?w=N&ID=320
PROGRESSION RAIDERS ONLY MAKE UP 2% OF THE OVER-ALL WOW POPULATION.
The numbers, as you pointed out, are even more abysmal for H DS than they were for H FL. Chew on that math.
Grats on your being a member of the 1%
Tee hee. :)

Have a couple of good reads for you:
http://manaflask.com/en/article/1540/the-raiding-pinnacle-angered-10-man
http://manaflask.com/en/article/1554/the-raiding-pinnacle-angered-10-man-part-1



My statement three posts above stands firm and true:

People should come to Ysera because Ysera is a good server to play on.
It's as simple as that.

Akraen said it best.

"Your laughable little guild isn't even on my radar."

He was congratulating the guilds that matter here.. you are certainly not one of them.

Pretty sure I haven't been tooting my own horn. There are 10 guilds ahead of mine in strict 10 man progression after all! Oh geez! Oh Noes! We're all having more fun than you! :)

Stop with the childish insults and post something I can actually find interest in trolling.

WTB some intelligent debate without name calling.
I guess I'm just too darn old for this anymore.

I'm not sure you said anything anyone can debate, really. It's just a bunch of random assumptions about things you don't know about supported by the kind of bland "98%" rhetoric that dominates MMO forums etc.

The reason I'm not in a "casual" guild is because I like playing with good players. That's what is fun for me. I like competing with other hardcore progression guilds to kill bosses as fast as possible. That is what is fun for me. You raid 12 hours a week and you're "in the 98%"? So what, you're an average player? Grats. I'm glad you're having fun. What's your point again?

Oh right, it's that hardcore raiders are angry basement dwelling nerds who hurt the community, right? I'm the raid leader in a hardcore guild, and I'm nothing but friendly and curteous to people on this server, and I encourage my guild members to do the same. I've played here since early TBC and I've never thought about leaving until just recently because of how inactive Ysera has become. I field questions from people about boss fights, enhancement shaman stuff and other issues every day that I log on, and I go out of my way to help other guilds on Ysera in whatever way I can. We run pugs which kill Deathwing for random people on Ysera as well, and we stimulate the economy with huge spending at the start of every tier on consumables, gems, craftables etc. But feel free to keep generalising about what sort of players are "good" for the server. I wonder which guilds come up with the strats you use to kill bosses?

Also, your suggestion that Natural Order of all guilds raids 30+ hours a week is absurd. I don't know why people in mediocre guilds play that card so much, but personally I raid ~20 hours a week during progression and about 4 hours a week right now, and my guild is ranked 25th in the world. Natural Order raids WAY less than we do. You don't need to raid long hours unless you're pushing for world firsts.

Just to make the argument, "you" was never directed at anyone specific, it was used in a general form. I did not mention any guild by name. Though, if we wanted to talk about specific guilds, World of Logs shows a snipit of raids that guilds are willing to post. I do know for a fact that some guilds snip out some bad stuff from the logs, IE: They don't post a bad night. There is nothing wrong with that either. I have plenty of bad nights. But I usually just blame the beer.

Rassoodocks, you are one of the few polite people our server has in a leadership position. Our server is just fine honestly, it is just over run with casual players. That is not a bad thing. Instead of talking down to the casual player like the posters above you, you actually take the time to teach them something. That, unlike the other posters above, is something to be commended.

My original point was:
Don't bill this server as a top ranked server. It won't work because we're really not. Midwinter is a top ranked guild, but they should not carry the entire server to success.
Try recruiting people who want to play because it is fun, not people solely interested in being #1. Supporting a somewhat social atmosphere within your guild helps to retain interest, which in turn helps keep turn-over down. I see Rassoodocks gets that. I wish more people could.

25 man raids are not the end all be all raid experience. That's all. I was not bashing or insulting anyone who runs strictly 25s. I came from a 40 man turned 25 man guild to this server after a stop or two along the way. I like this server. I think other people should like this server too. But I also think that if my own guild raided 20 hours a week, we'd be on your "radar". None of us want that, so we don't do it. We don't raid 12 hours a week. We raid for 5 hours a week. That's 2 nights for 2 and a 1/2 hours each night. It's great being in a 10 man guild!

Keep going Midwinter. Will be looking forward to watching you guys when Panda rolls out.

edit: Apparently no one bothered with my links. You really should read them.

http://manaflask.com/en/article/1540/the-raiding-pinnacle-angered-10-man
http://manaflask.com/en/article/1554/the-raiding-pinnacle-angered-10-man-part-2

02/07/2012 03:10 AMPosted by Peako

But I usually just blame the beer.

Funny, I usually just blame people like you.

Rassoodocks, you are one of the few polite people our server has in a leadership position. Our server is just fine honestly, it is just over run with casual players. That is not a bad thing. Instead of talking down to the casual player like the posters above you, you actually take the time to teach them something. That, unlike the other posters above, is something to be commended.

So inviting hardcore raiders to a server that (in your mind) is dominated by casual players would be a bad thing? Also, just because you don't know the inner workings of the other guilds who posted above, you just assume that nobody else works hard to teach casual players how to raid? You sir are just blissfully unaware of what it takes to run a successful guild.

My original point was:
Don't bill this server as a top ranked server. It won't work because we're really not. Midwinter is a top ranked guild, but they should not carry the entire server to success.
Try recruiting people who want to play because it is fun, not people solely interested in being #1. Supporting a somewhat social atmosphere within your guild helps to retain interest, which in turn helps keep turn-over down. I see Rassoodocks gets that. I wish more people could.

Nobody cares what your original post was. Akraen was simply congratulating the 25man guilds on the server. You came along and turned it into a whole 25s vs 10s, and now a casual vs. hardcore debate. Nice going there.

Keep going Midwinter. Will be looking forward to watching you guys when Panda rolls out.

Way to suck up.

That's 2 nights for 2 and a 1/2 hours each night. It's great being in a 10 man guild!

Natural Order raids 3 nights/wk for 3 hours each. Quite often though we clear our heroic 25m on 2 nights, then help people out on the third night for fun, or help gear up alts/friends.

So quite often our raiding, which hovers around US top 100, only entails 6 hours per week.

Man we have no lives at all.

Actually, you are US ranked 482.
But who's counting?
:)

"Discussion is an exchange of knowledge; an argument is an exchange of ignorance."