Update on Retribution Paladin Bug

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85 Undead Death Knight
7825
Here is the flaw in the logic of " we wernt doing anything other than what we normally do and our dps was insane so we went and did arena or dragon soul or whatever were we supposed to not use our toons? because of the bug that was blizzards fault? Well if the bug would have made it so all ret pallys no matter what they did could only do 2k dps would you have been playing them? No you would not have you would have been whining that you could not raid or do arenas and so on. I don't think people should be punished if no progression or world first happened now arena rating might need to be looked at. Sure take away realm firsts if they happened maybe soem gear that they should not have gotten, unless it was the "golden guilds" that exploited the LFR tool because after all that just shows that these players/guilds will do anything to get world/realm firsts.
90 Draenei Shaman
13805
So, hold on. The LFR exploit, an exploit caused by a bug from Blizzard not fully testing their LFR results in 10 day bans to really screw over top guilds during hard mode progression. I would wager that there are more Paladins than there are guilds that exploited the LFR.

Ret exploit, an exploit caused by a bug from Blizzard not fully testing their hotfix pretty much results in nothing. Let's think about this, shall we?


You're trying to characterize these as being similar, but they're not. The LFR exploit took a great deal of work to pull off. First, you had to gather 25 guild members and queue for LFR. If a guild was looking to quickly gear their main raid team I could buy this as being within the realm of normal play, so I'll give them a pass on that first step. The next step, however, could not have been done by accident. Everyone in the raid had to leave the group without rolling right after the boss died. What are the odds of that occurring naturally? Have you ever been in a random LFR where everyone in your party left right after the boss kill leaving you to get all the loot? The next step was to reinvite all those people and distribute loot. Tell me how that could have been an accident. To top it all off, 24 of those 25 people requeued and repeated the whole process. You can't chalk the last three steps of that exploit up to coincidence.

The Paladin bug, on the other hand, could have been exploited unintentionally by players who were just doing what they normally do. In this case Blizzard can't distinguish between players who were just playing as normal and players who were aware that there was an exploit and looking to capitalize on it. That's why they're not penalizing players for this.
Edited by Ronduwil on 2/3/2012 11:29 AM PST
85 Draenei Hunter
11685


So I guess all the people who paid the same $15 and had to face those Rets in RBGs and Arena were just SOL ehh?

They just don't have the right to play on an even playing field I guess right?

And I guess all the people who raid for server firsts and server progression rankings and pay the same $15 that Ret Paladins do are SOL as well ehh?
\

Yeah, it's like how I kept paying $15 a month even when rogues starting jumping me with Vial and welfare daggers.

Or when warriors were globalling people in the beginning of Cata.

Or when 2H windfury enhancement shaman were a real thing.

Or when fire mages were ripping people apart with massive Combusts (oh wait).


I'd just like to say on behalf of the objective, neutral parties in this discussion that I find you to be a complete arrogant, unlikeable tool. You arguments are as robust as a 5 year old with chocolate-stained lips refuting that the crumbs around his feet are indeed cookie.

If you are innocent, shut yer yep, ffs. If not, shut yer yap, ffs.
85 Blood Elf Paladin
2555
haha blizz are you retarded ban them for your mistake kk
90 Blood Elf Paladin
11680
HAd no idea about this til today (but I wasnt really on my pally last night other than for AH). Would have been nice to at lreast have seen what I could get up to on a practice dummy :)
90 Draenei Shaman
13805
02/03/2012 11:17 AMPosted by Genbuttnakid
Here is the flaw in the logic of " we wernt doing anything other than what we normally do and our dps was insane so we went and did arena or dragon soul or whatever were we supposed to not use our toons? because of the bug that was blizzards fault? Well if the bug would have made it so all ret pallys no matter what they did could only do 2k dps would you have been playing them? No you would not have you would have been whining that you could not raid or do arenas and so on. I don't think people should be punished if no progression or world first happened now arena rating might need to be looked at. Sure take away realm firsts if they happened maybe soem gear that they should not have gotten, unless it was the "golden guilds" that exploited the LFR tool because after all that just shows that these players/guilds will do anything to get world/realm firsts.


Recount is an addon, not a built-in feature of the game, so there is no way to prove that these players knew that their DPS was off. Any player who typically did arenas or raided Dragon Soul could have conceivably been participating in their usual activities without realizing something was off. Haven't you ever had days where you were "in the zone" and everything seemed to go right? You're right in saying that if they had gotten a massive nerf by accident they would have noticed. That's because they would have been kicked from raids and arenas by other players who were tracking DPS. That doesn't change the fact that there is no proof that all Paladins were aware that they were buggy. There was no MotD or news item that said, "Hey Pallies! You're buggy today so please don't play in ret spec until we get your exploit hotfixed!" Blizzard's support team operates much like the U.S. justice system: you're innocent until proven guilty. Since Blizzard has no way to reliably distinguish between those who accidentally exploited the bug and those who deliberately took advantage of it they have wisely opted to let it go. They simply don't have the manpower to go through all the game logs for every retribution paladin who played that day to discern whether they willfully or accidentally exploited the bug. Put yourself in Blizzard's shoes. What do you think you would have done?
100 Human Paladin
13775
02/03/2012 11:41 AMPosted by Uradin
HAd no idea about this til today (but I wasnt really on my pally last night other than for AH). Would have been nice to at lreast have seen what I could get up to on a practice dummy :)


Wouldn't have worked, it only happened in instanced areas.
87 Night Elf Rogue
10795
Do you people even read what the blue post say? Or do ya'll just come up with your own side of the story every time? It clearly says that they aren't gonna take action on players unless they use it to gain major in-game advantages. I did't read anything about them banning ret players that saw that their pally does insane damage and did some raids or bg's with it to have some fun. Those aren't "Major" in-game things sorry to say. Heroic raid fights that become realm 1st to it...yeah...arguable for sure....but dungeons, regular raids, and bg's...not so much. If you get banned you get banned. You obviously did something wrong for it to happen and them to see it...and nobody cares if you !@#$% about it either
90 Blood Elf Priest
4710
02/02/2012 12:22 PMPosted by Sardorim
Someone's gotta get banned over this, there were plenty of abusers out there.

What were rets supposed to do? Stop playing the game until it got fixed?

Idiot.
88 Night Elf Priest
17790
Well I hope you intend to comb through world of logs and see which raids intentionally stacked ret paladins to gain an advantage. It is rather stupid to allow guilds that PROGRESSED with bugged paladins to keep their heroic achievements. Progression might not be important to all, but it is to some and seeing someone cheat their way up is incredibly annoying.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-dk0ge78dc9n6s24q/sum/damageDone/?s=95&e=277
90 Human Paladin
6595
02/03/2012 11:51 AMPosted by Eyais
Someone's gotta get banned over this, there were plenty of abusers out there.

What were rets supposed to do? Stop playing the game until it got fixed?

Idiot.


That particular spec yes. Many of us did the right thing and did not play Ret for the evening. We either played other characters or played Holy/Prot.
26 Night Elf Rogue
0
NO people should not get banned.. Why some one should get banned? They didn't make the bug blizzard did.. and if some one used it in PvP oo well get over your self's.. happens.. Thats the blizzard that needs to learn how to make patches without bugs.. its the easiest thing to ban some one for something that is not their fault lol.
90 Dwarf Paladin
13855
02/03/2012 12:09 PMPosted by Boonadin

What were rets supposed to do? Stop playing the game until it got fixed?

Idiot.


That particular spec yes. Many of us did the right thing and did not play Ret for the evening. We either played other characters or played Holy/Prot.


Did you seriously do that? Or did you just not happen to be playing during the tiny window the bug existed for?

If the bug happened during your guilds standard raid time and your a key member of the raid then what exactly are you meant to do? From what we can tell no guild made unexpected gains in DS. FL doesn't matter any more. LFR I suspect everyone just had a laugh, and it is not as if you don't faceroll the bosses even if a ret isn't doing bugged DPS.

The same goes for PvP. Any rets in an established team who benefited will see their ratings drop over the next weeks if they continue playing. Any rets who formed new teams, on the other hand, I suspect will lose their ratings. And there is no fair way to return lost rating to teams who got stomped by rets. You got your rating before. You can get it back again.

And I will remind many of the PvPers, who in all honesty are the only ones who lost out to this, that PvP is not balanced anyway. High rank in PvP is more dependent on picking the correct toon than your own skill.
90 Human Paladin
6595


That particular spec yes. Many of us did the right thing and did not play Ret for the evening. We either played other characters or played Holy/Prot.


Did you seriously do that? Or did you just not happen to be playing during the tiny window the bug existed for?


Yes I seriously played my Priest rather than my bugged Ret Paladin on Wednesday night.
85 Blood Elf Paladin
1400
02/02/2012 12:22 PMPosted by Sardorim
Someone's gotta get banned over this, there were plenty of abusers out there.
Or you can just be quiet and stop backseat modding. Huntards these days.
26 Night Elf Rogue
0
I still think that no one should Get banned. Its just not fair. when i played my pally (he is prot) I didnt even know there was a bug going on.. So why should people get banned for something that most likely they didn't know anything about?
26 Night Elf Rogue
0
02/03/2012 12:40 PMPosted by Stylosgf
Someone's gotta get banned over this, there were plenty of abusers out there.
Or you can just be quiet and stop backseat modding. Huntards these days.


Tell me about it.. The other day in random BG there was multiboxning huntard.. God he was annoying with hes 10 hunters running around..
85 Blood Elf Paladin
1400
02/03/2012 12:41 PMPosted by Vladim
I still think that no one should Get banned. Its just not fair. when i played my pally (he is prot) I didnt even know there was a bug going on.. So why should people get banned for something that most likely they didn't know anything about?
Exactly, people are acting like this little bug was a huge game ruining thing that made the game unplayable for maybe 12 hours?
85 Blood Elf Paladin
1400
02/03/2012 11:17 AMPosted by Genbuttnakid
Here is the flaw in the logic of " we wernt doing anything other than what we normally do and our dps was insane so we went and did arena or dragon soul or whatever were we supposed to not use our toons? because of the bug that was blizzards fault? Well if the bug would have made it so all ret pallys no matter what they did could only do 2k dps would you have been playing them? No you would not have you would have been whining that you could not raid or do arenas and so on. I don't think people should be punished if no progression or world first happened now arena rating might need to be looked at. Sure take away realm firsts if they happened maybe soem gear that they should not have gotten, unless it was the "golden guilds" that exploited the LFR tool because after all that just shows that these players/guilds will do anything to get world/realm firsts.
It's called taking advantage of something that is uncontrollable. We pay a fair amount of money to play this game, I'm sure a bug that increases DPS won't stop anyone from playing.
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