Please Welcome Nyorloth!

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90 Orc Death Knight
8660
Nyorloth. Whats your favorite Lovecraft story? This is a real question and is quite important to me.

Mine is The Outsider.
84 Draenei Paladin
1470
Could Ask the CDevs become a more regular, consistent feature?

Unlike the Ask the Devs venture that primarily discussed game mechanics, I think the player base has generally responded quite well to this series. It would be awesome if we could have our questions answered more frequently and sometimes even in more detail (if the situation calls for it) :)

Personally? I'm itching to find out more about the Old Gods and their minions.

Do the faceless ones predate the arrival of the Old Gods, or are they the result of ancient Azeroth species that became fully "assimilated"?

If N'Zoth was able to wage war against Yogg-Saron and C'Thun, does this make it more stronger than their combined forces? What has N'Zoth been up to since Deathwing was destroyed by us?

Do the titans realize that mortals have begun to take on the Old Gods directly? Do they plan on directly intervening, rather than using a herald like Algalon?
60 Orc Warrior
570
At least you seem to enjoy your job. That's refreshing. So, Nyorloth, I have a question.

How do you (and the rest of the CDev team, if you're comfortable answering for them) feel about the rampant neutrality "at all costs" that has been plaguing both sides of the story? I've always assumed it was more of a concession made because it considerably reduces development time, and lets both factions progress off of the same quests. After hearing about the team's surprise that "Thrall doesn't feel like -their- guy, we messed up thinking about world characters" (speaking of Thrall's presence and the Alliance) and whatnot, I've started to feel like neutrality may actually be the way CDev truly wants to go (even where it isn't realistic).

I'd really appreciate even a slight bit of insight here, because it's been bugging me for a while.
90 Night Elf Hunter
5515
I don't think that he is taking those kind of questions yet. And those seem a bit loaded...
85 Blood Elf Death Knight
3235
/agree Pumlaxer

Muromra, there may actually be a misunderstanding here. The "Dev Watercooler: Faction Favoritism" post you mention (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/3992143/Dev_Watercooler_-_Faction_Favoritism_-11_25_2011#blog) was written by Dave Kosak, who according to the post is the lead quest designer for World of Warcraft, not a member of CDev.

So Nyorloth might not be the right guy to ask. *ponder*
60 Orc Warrior
570
We actually have lore classes for incoming developers, and for devs that want to brush up on some of the finer parts. These are primarily planned and taught by Evelyn Fredericksen, our senior historian. Dave Kosak, the lead quest designer, is also a major lore buff and has given presentations on the lore to the entire development team as well (in costume, no less!)

Beyond the lore classes, the development teams consult with Creative Development (primarily our historians) during the beginning phases of zone/quest development, and in some cases we have been called to help write flavor text and boss lines.


I apologize if I wasn't as clear as I had hoped. Dave seems to work quite closely with CDev. My question was asking how CDev viewed the constant use of neutrality (which effectively strips both factions of some of their most defining features), considering that same neutrality helps Kosak and the other guys from the game dev team. There obviously has to be some back and forth between the Devs and CDevs.

I’ll admit that we at Blizzard often fall into a trap of thinking of our main characters as “world” characters and not individual faction characters.


My confusion came in wondering how the CDev team felt, seeing how Dave mentioned "we at Blizzard". As I said, originally I figured it was a resources thing, and CDev begrudgingly worked a neutral angle for everything to efficiently use resources. After that comment, I wasn't so sure.

So in the end, Nyorloth is the perfect guy to ask about CDev's take on things.
85 Worgen Rogue
13435
On the contrary: I love night elves!

They’re delicious.


And here I took a nice effort on my welcoming post and this is the only sort of answer regarding Night Elves we get.

If you had thumbs instead of tentacles and I not paws I'd declare a thumb war.

I'm onto you, Mister.

P.S: What was he dressed at during those 'lore' classes?
Edited by Ilthen on 2/9/2012 2:51 PM PST
85 Goblin Priest
8620
02/09/2012 12:49 PMPosted by Nyorloth
We actually have lore classes for incoming developers, and for devs that want to brush up on some of the finer parts. These are primarily planned and taught by Evelyn Fredericksen, our senior historian. Dave Kosak, the lead quest designer, is also a major lore buff and has given presentations on the lore to the entire development team as well (in costume, no less!)


In all seriousness, this is fantastic. I would punt 100 gnomes to see one of these lore classes. (Yeah yeah I know they are for Blizzard employees only...but still....EPIC) Its great that you work on keeping the consistency of the lore throughout the entire team.
90 Night Elf Druid
13930
Welcome Nyorloth!

Personally, I love the overall story Blizzard is trying to tell. I think the storytelling sufferes from the constraints of the game. Each Xpac is a frozen moment in time in WoW's Lore and each patch merely moves one of many story arcs. This leave Blizzard needing to fill the blanks with books and comics, which many folks won't/don't read or you have uneven plot advancements within an Xpac.

The most notable plot mis-match is the current Garrosh aggressiveness and Alliance cluelessness which has the forums up in arms on a regular basis. You can easily see Garrosh's maneuverings - his advances into Ashenvale, the Horde's overwhelming presence in Ashzara. Heck, there's even a phased questline in Stonetalon that shows you how nasty the Horde has become.

The issue is, Alliance players witness this and want to retaliate, but they can't because their faction's story line is still trying to build supply lines. So what we're experiencing is the mother of all Escort Quests where the escort is walking v e r y slowly but the hostile mobs are at speed. And Blizzard can't advance the Alliance side, so it appears as if Garrosh is running around unchecked and the Alliance faction leaders are oblivious.

I am sure that behind the curtain, the story tellers have the point and counterpoint of this part of the faction hostilities, it's just that there is no way to make the game catch up - so we have to wait for Mists and books, comics and short stories to fill in the blanks - which is very unsatisfying and impersonal. I was there trying to stop the Horde from blowing up innocent druids. I don't want to read about how the Alliance achieved justice for the murdered druids elsewhere. I want to be part of that.

What would be really awesome is if Blizzard could "split" the storytelling. have the leveling quests tell the ramp up story and then provide max-level toons with follow up quests that complete the story lines and phase the questers; and maybe almost have monthly patches that introduce story advancements. That way, players can experience a lot of moving parts, not just the ones associated with raiding. And for those who don't like questing, maybe you have the faction leaders meet every month to encapsulate the developments of that story-patch. That way, you can see each faction respond to the other while still having stable questing at lower levels.

It's not the story itself that's the issue, but rather its presentation and the limitations of telling the story. If you could get incremental developments out more often for more stories, you probably wouldn't see as much confusion.
85 Tauren Shaman
6230
02/09/2012 02:49 PMPosted by Muromra
So in the end, Nyorloth is the perfect guy to ask about CDev's take on things.


Eh, I think it's probably a flawed question, "CDev" is not a hive-mind after all, two people in it could think completely opposite things.
60 Orc Warrior
570
02/09/2012 03:46 PMPosted by Skytotem
So in the end, Nyorloth is the perfect guy to ask about CDev's take on things.


Eh, I think it's probably a flawed question, "CDev" is not a hive-mind after all, two people in it could think completely opposite things.


Understandable, which is why my initial question was to Nyorloth himself. I'd added in that he could toss in the overall opinions of the others if he felt comfortable speaking on their behalf. He's still representing the Creative Development team here, and while his views won't be shared with everyone on his team, we could get some valuable knowledge of how he and maybe some of the other people involved in the story feel.
90 Draenei Paladin
16740
- To serve as a scapegoat for when something happens in the lore that you don’t like.


K.

I'll start with this one. How about you guys give us a real comment on the entirety of the Vash'jir, Neptulon and Ozumat story line being dropped and left to rot.

So far all we've heard was a joke at Blizzcon on tentacles and how the question was too hard to answer.


Oh, and welcome by the way.
90 Night Elf Hunter
5515
If I recall, Neptulon's kidnapping was phrased as a euphemism in the question itself, so she walked right in to getting no answer. :( Still, a zone's story ending on a cliffhanger that remains unmentioned by even Neptulon as he is getting dragged away is kind of disappointing.
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
10030
Why do you hate Night Elves? WHY!?

On the contrary: I love night elves!

They’re delicious.


Glorious Tentacled Master, me and my kin have brought you many tasty Night Elves for your wonderful pallet, please spare us, we shall serve you well.

edit.

Mr. Nyo, can you explain why the BC starter zones didnt get updated at all? (or anyone for that matter) despite the new intro they have.
Edited by Shaithiss on 2/9/2012 4:39 PM PST
90 Night Elf Druid
14940
Do they go through a lore 'crash course' when they enter those teams?

Who double checks to make sure that they don't say, apply DnD or general mythological principles to WoW?

Do they self-check or do they go to you, or do they self-check using some kind of Warcraft Bible provided by CDev?

We actually have lore classes for incoming developers, and for devs that want to brush up on some of the finer parts. These are primarily planned and taught by Evelyn Fredericksen, our senior historian. Dave Kosak, the lead quest designer, is also a major lore buff and has given presentations on the lore to the entire development team as well (in costume, no less!)

Beyond the lore classes, the development teams consult with Creative Development (primarily our historians) during the beginning phases of zone/quest development, and in some cases we have been called to help write flavor text and boss lines. Unfortunately, our historians don’t have the bandwidth to check over every line of text, every piece of art, and every scripted event. QA helps catch a lot of inconsistencies, but the sheer scope of the game results in the catch-22 of “release with small issues” or “take 4 more months.”


Anyone else read this and immediately think, "then what about the draenei?"
90 Tauren Druid
8985
I try and ignore the Draenei.

Errrr.
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
10030


We actually have lore classes for incoming developers, and for devs that want to brush up on some of the finer parts. These are primarily planned and taught by Evelyn Fredericksen, our senior historian. Dave Kosak, the lead quest designer, is also a major lore buff and has given presentations on the lore to the entire development team as well (in costume, no less!)

Beyond the lore classes, the development teams consult with Creative Development (primarily our historians) during the beginning phases of zone/quest development, and in some cases we have been called to help write flavor text and boss lines. Unfortunately, our historians don’t have the bandwidth to check over every line of text, every piece of art, and every scripted event. QA helps catch a lot of inconsistencies, but the sheer scope of the game results in the catch-22 of “release with small issues” or “take 4 more months.”


Anyone else read this and immediately think, "then what about the draenei?"


Do not anger the master or you will be his next meal.
Edited by Shaithiss on 2/9/2012 5:17 PM PST
85 Tauren Shaman
6230
I have question that's been nagging at me for awhile.

How much of a say in NPC representation and New Races does the CDev team have?

For example, we saw the Taunka take the Blood Oath in Northrend, but didn't see them even in Icy area's in the revamped zones, rather we saw one in Durotar as a criminal slave.

We also saw the Tol'vir in one zone in cata, but there's no real sign we'll see them again in Mists, or that they'll matter all that much.

Likewise, the worgen and draenei are both cool, but we see relatively little of them, even in area's like the Blasted Lands, where the Draenei would make sense due to their anti-demon stance.

I try and ignore the Draenei.

Errrr.


Not a fan Bull?

90 Tauren Druid
8985
02/09/2012 06:56 PMPosted by Skytotem
Not a fan Bull?


Just tryin' to see if I could pull a few more oldies out from the shadows :)
85 Tauren Shaman
6230
02/09/2012 07:01 PMPosted by Bullcowsby
Not a fan Bull?


Just tryin' to see if I could pull a few more oldies out from the shadows :)


I miss Lolotea too hehe.
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