February 15 Update to Mists Talent Calculator

85 Draenei Shaman
5740
Will we be seeing warlocks using green fire yet?
90 Pandaren Shaman
15440
Yay! You are changing those HORID level 90 talents. Thank you so much! Though im curious as to what happened to instant ghost wolf
90 Pandaren Shaman
15440
I can't wait to try out Ascendance. And it looks like the Grace of Air buff is going to be awesome.
90 Draenei Shaman
0
I agree! Looks like Shamans are getting the buffs they deserve! Way to go Blizz!
Community Manager
Qustion: What are the developments for the Cat and Bear versions of Mangle/Swipe/Thrash/etc.?

Answer: Several abilities for Cats and Bears are slightly different depending on Cat or Bear Form. The abilities you’re seeing in the talent calculator are the base versions that show up in your spellbook. Here are some additional details about their different effects in each form:

  • Mangle: In Cat Form, has no cooldown, costs energy, and generates a combo point. In Bear Form, generates 5 rage, and has a 6 second cooldown, which can also be reset by a proc from Lacerate and now Thrash ticks.
  • Swipe: In Cat Form, has no cooldown, and costs energy. In Bear Form, has a 3 second cooldown, and is free.
  • Thrash: In Cat Form, has no cooldown, and costs energy. In Bear Form, has a 6 second cooldown, and costs 15 rage.
  • Skull Bash: Costs 15 energy or 10 rage, depending on form, and has a 15 second cooldown. The current talent calculator says that it has a 10 second cooldown, but that is a mistake. It is 15 seconds like most other interrupts are now.
  • Stampeding Roar: Costs 30 energy or 15 rage, depending on form.
  • Faerie Fire: Has a 6 second cooldown when used in Cat or Bear Form.
  • 90 Night Elf Druid
    16905
    The Talent Heart of The Wild in Level 90 Druid Tier is very underwhelming for a PvE druid, since we don't have our others specs toolkit and passive abilities to perform the role. This in being addressed somehow ?

    Also Symbiosis not being able to change on the fly is kinda meh =/

    I thought maybe it leave a debuff Recently Linked that last for 1 minute on the druid and the target. how about that ?
    86 Night Elf Rogue
    4735
    The new ability Shadow Walk really concerns me.

    It seems like we're not exactly hurting for stealth right now. So it looks like you're going to nerf stealth to more detectable levels and then give us Shadow Walk as a band-aid.


    That's a good point. Hopefully stealth will stay where it is and Shadow Walk would be a true boost.

    Thing is, Shadow Walk isn't even a new ability. It should be rolled into Vanish like it used to be, with either a glyph or with a little Shake n' Bake.
    Edited by Troelsen on 2/17/2012 12:49 PM PST
    85 Blood Elf Mage
    4440
    We’ve just updated our [url="http://ow.ly/94f5N"]Mists of Pandaria Talent Calculator[/url] to reflect many of the most recent changes and renovations currently being made to the next expansion of World of Warcraft.

    We’d like to discuss these and other changes to talents and specializations in this thread. Here are a couple of thoughts to start with:

    • For shaman and hunters, we still have a ways to go with the revamp of talents, and this latest calculator doesn’t have some of the changes that we’re currently working on.
    • If you don’t see a favorite spell in the talent list, there is a good chance it is something you get automatically for choosing a particular spec. For example, all Fury warriors learn Raging Blow without having to choose it as a talent. All Discipline priests know Divine Aegis. Chances were almost certain that you were going to choose those anyway so we just gave them to you.
    • If you don’t see a favorite spell or mechanic as a class ability, spec ability or talent, then there is a good chance it is becoming a glyph. Examples include Atonement (priest), Gag Order (Warrior), Rude Interruption (Warrior), and the Acts of Sacrifice Cleanse component (Paladin).

    Feel free to have a look at the updated calculator, and then discuss it here!




    Blast Wave? where is it? This is one of mages funnest spells I do not see any mention of it anywhere.

    not like fire mages have too much control or something lmao...common guys been a mage 7 years don't yank this spell.

    This should be baseline or spec for fire.
    Edited by Elmínster on 2/17/2012 12:56 PM PST
    90 Human Paladin
    18535
    Don't take away Holy Wrath! Changing it from an all-spec aoe ability with a stun into a holy-only aoe crit suppressor is just awful. And it's downright insulting that the ability is getting redefined while keeping the older, more aweseome ability's name. Call the new ability Panda Wrath, or Crit Supressor, or PvP Debuffer, or whatever else it really is. But don't take away the true Holy Wrath from the rest of us!

    If Holy Wrath should be limited to a single spec, it should be prot, not holy. Should the other tanks lose their multi-target stuns to make this fair? Are paladins going to lose everything else that does extra harm to demons and undead, just to further homogenize the classes? This is infuriating.
    90 Blood Elf Paladin
    9780
    I'd still like to get an idea of what Blizzard's intention is with Melee Paladin Rotations.

    Currently, I would consider Protection to be very fun. It has a rhythmic nature to it due to the 3-second "builder" ability, and then you weave other skills around that. Procs and Holy Power usage keep it from being too linear, but it definitely has a nice flow to it. (For the record, I consider Fury warrior to be the same way, but Fury is not raid-viable right now so my alt -former main- has been forced to going Arms)

    Currently, I would consider Retribution to be absolutely terrible and in no way fun to play. Granted, that's personal preference, but all of the flow and smoothness that exist for Prot are just destroyed by the 4.5-second cooldown on your primary builder. In an earlier blue post, it was stated they were okay with having open GCDs for melee classes as long as it didn't happen with "frustrating regularity" and that blue poster must have never played Retribution.

    Ret has 4 primary attacks. 4. Divine Storm or CS (4.5s), Judge(8s), TV(varies with procs and judge availability, let's say about 10s), and Exo(varies, only cast on a proc). That's it. We have Wrath on a 15sec CD and the near-worthless Consecrate on 30sec, and a ~35 second buff to maintain. Wrath and Cons aren't even good, they're just things to push if they happen to be up one of the dozens of times per fight that Ret has an open GCD.

    I benched my Pally early into the T11 content and picked up a warrior because I was the OT for my guild and I couldn't stand Ret's jank, unintuitive, open-GCD-filled rotation. Now, in 4.3, with the gutting of Fury (I'm not fond of Arms' rotation, I like it better than 4.0.3 Ret but not by much) I've dusted the Pally off again. As of right now, there are only 3 things that make playing Ret remotely tolerable, and all three have to exist or it goes straight to hell:

    1) 2T13 lets Judgement pop a Holy Power. This helps with the flow a bit and allows you to get to your TVs faster, reducing some of the open GCDs. Will this behavior become baseline in MoP, or can I expect my rotation to get crappier once I lose that extra HP? EDIT: I see Judgements of the Bold does, in fact, grant this effect baseline.

    2) Exo procs can help fill gaps in the rotation, giving me the impression that I'm doing something more frequently. Exo procs appear to be going away in MoP, dropping my "core abilities" from 4 to 3, and my rotation was already kind of crap when I had 4. EDIT: Art of War looks like it still retains the over-all functionality, but the MMO champ info says otherwise. Was there a bugged/non-updated tooltip that was later fixed?

    3) The "Holy Power Procs" that allow me to use my finishers at max power look like they're going to become ridiculously less frequent. Again, this is something that helps fill gaps in the rotation, and help to make it feel a little less static while at the same time giving me buttons to push. I like having buttons to push.

    TL;DR: My main concern about Melee Paladins is this: I like 4.3 Prot. MoP Prot looks like it will play more like 4.0.3 Ret (which I can't stand). MoP Ret looks like it is going to remove or severely diminish the small handful of things that makes 4.3 Ret tolerable.

    I'm trying to see the glass half-full and reserve Judgement, but I'm a Paladin and can't help it. Please tell me our rotations aren't going to suck in MoP. I'd rather not have to bench this character again.

    Edit: Minor comment, it feels a bit contradictory to state that the design for melee classes is to sometimes have an open GCD while simultaneously releasing a new class that doesn't even have auto-attack. I'd assume/hope Monks won't have any open GCDs where they literally sit at their keyboards while their character does absolutely nothing -- not even white swings. <strong/>
    Edited by Unruhe on 2/17/2012 1:46 PM PST
    1 Undead Warrior
    0
    Don't take away Holy Wrath! Changing it from an all-spec aoe ability with a stun into a holy-only aoe crit suppressor is just awful. ...But don't take away the true Holy Wrath from the rest of us!

    If Holy Wrath should be limited to a single spec, it should be prot, not holy. Should the other tanks lose their multi-target stuns to make this fair? Are paladins going to lose everything else that does extra harm to demons and undead, just to further homogenize the classes? This is infuriating.


    I agree with this. Holy wrath needs to stay in all specs as it is. Rework a holy spell to give them what you want. As for the stun, holy wrath has never been an all-out AoE stun since it only worked on certain classes. Still it was a very useful AoE threat move for prot.
    55 Undead Death Knight
    480
    02/17/2012 07:32 AMPosted by Haakkon
    It definitely looks like most of the DK talents need to deal shadowfrost damage instead of just shadow. Being increased by mastery of one spec and not the other seems like hell to balance.

    This. Please pay special attention to our new Soul Reaper ability, it seems quite unfair that only one of our specs will really get any mileage out of it.
    85 Blood Elf Mage
    4440
    Scorch...


    please replace this as a talent choice and add it as spec for fire..it will fill no function for any other spec but fire...the other two look good though.

    I really don't see without having the rest of fires specs how scorch is going to be of any great benefit to frost or arc without specialties like ignite and critical mass which are in fire tree solely to make it stronger.

    Imho this is a big oversight.
    Edited by Elmínster on 2/17/2012 1:46 PM PST
    90 Human Paladin
    18535
    02/17/2012 01:15 PMPosted by Supahmen
    I agree with this. Holy wrath needs to stay in all specs as it is. Rework a holy spell to give them what you want. As for the stun, holy wrath has never been an all-out AoE stun since it only worked on certain classes. Still it was a very useful AoE threat move for prot.


    Granted, it's a situational stun, depending on the mobs you're fighting. But those situations are frequent, and it's a beautiful thing. Even if it did no damage, I'd still love it and use it all the time just for the stun component. Ever since I saw the Panda ability changes for the first time, I've mourned a little bit inside whenever I'm tanking and stun all those mobs, realizing that this stunning goodness won't last when 5.0 destroys my quality of life as a tank.
    85 Human Paladin
    9015
    I'm so excited about the last paladin talent choices! Ever since the Burning Crusade I have always though that we needed a healing Consecration and Light's Hammer is very close, even better!
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