February 15 Update to Mists Talent Calculator

85 Draenei Death Knight
4065
02/19/2012 12:03 PMPosted by Leviatharan
It'll just re-apply the 30 second diseases every second for the duration. I assume it'll be like hitting Outbreak: regardless of whether your diseases are at 3 seconds or... let's say a full minute duration, it'll reset them to 30 seconds, every tick (so it's effectively 40 seconds if your target stays in for the first and last). So it would be ill-advised to Festering Strike until Unholy Blight is over, since the next tick will cancel out the 6-second increase, unless you just want to burn off some rune


That is kind of what I had assumed, which makes me sad really. A great multi-target ability that COULD be used for single targets, to make the duration of diseases effectively 40 seconds (as you mentioned) without having to FS to extend. Although, I suppose that's kind of the point. They want UHB to be a multi-target ability only, instead of a single-target.

Another thing I noticed... Improved Icy Talons isn't listed in the frost DK's baseline abilities, and Windfury Totem isn't listed in any shaman tree's abilities, but survival hunters still have Hunting Party to grant the raid-wide melee/ranged haste. Is this intended, or just more cases of "we didn't put EVERYTHING in to save up on room"?
100 Night Elf Priest
10300
I think Blizzard just likes changing anything for the sake of having something to work on regardless of the point to it. The bi-annually reinvent-the-wheel mentality is nauseating. Who's looking forward to relearning all their 85's. I wish they'd share their subscription attrition statistics after each patch/expansion.
100 Blood Elf Mage
10255
Loved the mage talents, good work. The second tier is far more interesting now with the Temporal Shield (including PvE, since it has no global cd) and Blazing speed (almost PvE encounter has some AoE that matches the condition anyway, so we get lots of mobility).

I'm not entirely convinced about improved invisibility, since you stay snared. I could just get another Ice Block this way with cold snap. But the 90% reduction is solid enough for arena, i guess. Cauterize looks quite powerful with temporal shield and Incanter's shield, though.

The arcane bomb is far more interesting than before, and frost bomb looks like a good tool for burst, but the chill is too short for a delayed effect. Also, the cast time is questionable, since the bomb already has a 12s cd to match its dps with the other bombs.

And excellent work on the last tier, these talents defines very different playstyles and have a strong flavor for our class.

All specs seems better polished now, they seem to have exactly what they need, with nothing bloating them. Particularly good are Critical mass, missiles generating charges and the fingers of frost, they all get something defining for the spec. I'd like to know, however, what rotation do you have in mind for arcane, since arcane blast doesn't look strong enough for a burn rotation.
Edited by Aowyn on 2/19/2012 3:25 PM PST
90 Night Elf Druid
CFT
10670
02/19/2012 12:18 PMPosted by Tranqx
Can a blue or a game developers please outline when a restoration Druid would use the level 90 talent heart of the wild?.

Think Alysrazor P4, Magmaw Burn, Sons on Rag, Tendons on Spine.

The problem is the CD / duration don't match normal "burn phase" durations.
100 Blood Elf Death Knight
16125
02/19/2012 12:59 PMPosted by Kolorynn
Another thing I noticed... Improved Icy Talons isn't listed in the frost DK's baseline abilities, and Windfury Totem isn't listed in any shaman tree's abilities, but survival hunters still have Hunting Party to grant the raid-wide melee/ranged haste. Is this intended, or just more cases of "we didn't put EVERYTHING in to save up on room"?

I really don't know. If you look, you'll notice that Ebon Plague was removed from Unholy (the 8% magic third disease, ignore the 'new one'), along with Curse of Elements and Earth and Moon- they wrote out that 8% magic damage altogether, to my chagrin. I'd just think they were just removing that kind of buff, if you hadn't mentioned Hunting Party...
85 Human Death Knight
0
Guys you really need to fix unholy talents in mop. Unholy is fun atm and if you make these changes nobody will use it. Scourge Strike is unholy main attack and if in mop it does 75% weapon damage then nobody will use unholy. The last thing I want you to do is turn unholy into a spec that doesn't use melee that much if that happens I will unsubscribe. Please change Festering Strike back to 210% weapon damage and scourge strike back to 150% weapon damage in mop thats all I'm asking. By the way frost will be very op if it get 10% more weapon damage with two handers please don't do that.
85 Human Death Knight
990
As if anyone is still reading this into page 59?

OK here goes.

A general theme for each talent spec should be decided and then mechanics that play off of class spells should be created to ensure that the choice is actually an "interesting" and "fun" one.

As a priest is my main, I would like to throw this out:
Tier 15 - CC tier. Tie each CC into the CC's we already have. Give psychic scream back to the player as a class. I would go with something like Dark Shakle. Shakle undead becomes Dark Shakle - Shackles the target with darkness, reducing movement speed by 60% for 8 sec. Also infects the target with Shadow Word, Pain. PsyFiend. Your Psychic Scream manifests itself as a being of pure psychic energy. The Psyfiend stands in place casting a PsyFiend Scream on a single nearby enemy within 30 yards every 2 sec lasting for 10 sec. PsyFiend Scream causes enemies to flee for 1 min. Damage caused may interrupt the effect. Sin and Punishment - places a ward on the target that causes Reduces target's movement speed by 40%, increases the time between ranged attacks by 40% and increases casting time by 15%. Lasts 15 sec. If the ward is dispelled all nearby enemy targets within 8 yards have a 100% chance to be instantly feared in horror for 5 sec.

Could also create a variation on psychic horror/slience as a 4th idea where target is terrified, trembling in horror and interrupted for 3 seconds and silenced for 5 additional seconds.

Tier 30 - Movement tier. Path of the Devout - Increases movement speed by an additional 10% when the priest uses Inner Will. Body and Soul - though this is against what I said earlier it actually fits with Power Word: Shield so I would leave it. Phantasm also works very well as it plays off of fade. So I would leave this as well.

Tier - 45 - Light and Shadow tier- Leave Divine Star in theory but make it more like Arcane Bomb or Living bomb, damaging enemies around the target and healing friendlies around target. Could make it targetable on both allies and enemies. Archangel. I would recommend keeping this but reworking evangelism to additionally proc off of healing spells such as flash heal and greater heal for Disc and Holy since they both have access to these as well as smite and holy fire. From Darkness comes light is fine but would remove binding heal since that only benefits holy or give binding heal back to discipline.

Tier 60- self healing/survivability. Final Prayer and Desperate prayer are fine here. Would add something like Prayer of the Pheonix which gives you a self rez a la Reincarnation: Allows you to resurrect yourself upon death with 35% health and mana.

Tier 75 - I guess this would be the haste tier - get rid of twist of fate as it and make it an instacast button al la Inner Focus- reduces the cast time of your next priest spell by 100% and increases its crtical chance by 25%. Could leave Power Infusion and Divine Insight as is.

Tier 90 - Give Vow of Unity to Holy, Void Shift to Discipline and Vampiric dominance to Shadow and make this the shadowfiend tier. Shadow of K'ure - your shadowfiend becomes a permanent pet decreasing damage output and increasing mana regen. Gift of A'dal - your shadowfiend becomes a infused with light, while damaging and enemy, lowest health friendlies within 10 yards are healed, mana regen remains the same. Protection of O'ros - your shadowfiend leaps forward at an enemy target exploding doing shadow damage to the enemy and granting an absobtion shield to 5 of the nearest enemies equal to 100% of the damage given. After the explosion the priest recieves 50% of the damage as mana regen.

Just some ideas for the devs. This does not have to solely be limited to priests. I think if you make each tier a type of specific flavor without taking away from the specs people already enjoy things will be much better!

Hope this helps. Now for any thing taken from a class, say the haste tier (inner focus and power infusion), grant then a new power, such as Light Form, which increases holy damage done by 15% and direct healing done by 15% and increases party and raid spellpower by 5%, however you may not cast shadow spells while in this form.
Edited by Deathicka on 2/20/2012 12:13 AM PST
90 Draenei Paladin
0
Hi,

Can a blue or a game developers please outline when a restoration Druid would use the level 90 talent heart of the wild?.

It seems that all other healing class's (with the exception of monks and shammies - which is still work in progress) benefited with great healing or damage reduction talents at 90.

But "heart of the wild".....

I don't get it......

It was hard enough getting into a raid group in DS due to the lack of raid / tank damage reduction abilities.

Considering the fact that I've never played a bear tank.

Can you please explain to me how I'd heart of the wild going to benefit my raid group and make resto's a little more viable.


I'm guessing it's an oh $@%! button for when your tank dies and your brez is on cd.
85 Goblin Warlock
6150
I have a big question that Id like answered please. Now you soul link will replace health funnel. Does that mean soul link will "split" the healing the warlock recieves or will the warlock recieve the full heal and soul link will also heal the demon for a fraction of that?
85 Orc Shaman
5755
My question is why reduce the damage of Stormstrike and Lava Lash? Enhancement is already the bastard-child of melee dps as it is.
100 Orc Shaman
20655
02/19/2012 07:55 PMPosted by Wolffury
My question is why reduce the damage of Stormstrike and Lava Lash? Enhancement is already the bastard-child of melee dps as it is.

They reduced the damage of pretty much every single melee-instant-weapon attack.
90 Worgen Druid
One
7275
Can a blue or a game developers please outline when a restoration Druid would use the level 90 talent heart of the wild?.

Think Alysrazor P4, Magmaw Burn, Sons on Rag, Tendons on Spine.

The problem is the CD / duration don't match normal "burn phase" durations.


I respect your opinion, but considering your not main or off spec heals - its a bit rich.

i cant see how a Raid leader would choose me over another healer because during a raid encoutner i can go bear and dps.

Does blizzard expect me now to learn how to bear tank?

This is not viable Blizzard.

Correct me if im wrong - but most of the talents appear to be for PVP purposes.


The thing that I find the most disheartning about the new talent trees is the focus on PvP abilities. Almost all of the talents that we have in MoP are PvP oriented.

Level 15 talents: All of these are movement speed increases / escape talents. These would have very situational use in PvE encounters, but lots of usability in PvP

Level 30 talents: Only NS would be a talent that would be usable in PvE consistantly, Renewal and Cenarian Ward would be situational at best in PvE, great for PvP though.

Level 45 talents: All PvP talents. Either a 50% snare that replaces Farie Fire, a mass root, or a knockback. All very situational in PvE.

Level 60 talents: PvE oriented talents, and talents that actually require good thinking about what to take. All of the talents here work well in both PvE and PvP.

Level 75 talents: Purely PvP based, only marginally situational on PvE (add fights mainly).

Level 90 talents: DPSing talents and a PvP talent. Only talent worth taking would be Dream of Cenarius due to the 30% healing increase (assuming we get fights that we can do damage on without having to fully worry about people dieing).
Edited by Tranqx on 2/19/2012 9:32 PM PST
85 Draenei Death Knight
4065
02/19/2012 05:49 PMPosted by Alphablood
Guys you really need to fix unholy talents in mop. Unholy is fun atm and if you make these changes nobody will use it. Scourge Strike is unholy main attack and if in mop it does 75% weapon damage then nobody will use unholy. The last thing I want you to do is turn unholy into a spec that doesn't use melee that much if that happens I will unsubscribe. Please change Festering Strike back to 210% weapon damage and scourge strike back to 150% weapon damage in mop thats all I'm asking. By the way frost will be very op if it get 10% more weapon damage with two handers please don't do that.


I want to point you to this post: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/4063167954?page=3#51

If you're too lazy to click the link, it says that, basically, EVERYTHING based on weapon damage took a percentage hit because they're revising the formula for damage output.
100 Night Elf Druid
14140
Can a blue or a game developers please outline when a restoration Druid would use the level 90 talent heart of the wild?.

Think Alysrazor P4, Magmaw Burn, Sons on Rag, Tendons on Spine.

The problem is the CD / duration don't match normal "burn phase" durations.


And some of those, like Sons, were also very healing intensive parts of the fights.

Or even Alysrazor, which seems to be a "dead" healing phase, actually was best played by getting a full set of rejuvenations on the raid before going airborne. So there is even less than it might seem by at least 10 seconds.

Plus, what about keeping up-times up on LB which has always been our mana battery?

Pre-nerf spine is like the one example that I even considered when I first saw the talent, but even then, healers that did dps still were in a "form" they could heal, such as a priest or shaman could still throw out mixed heals/dps, keeping some heals up on searing effected players. yeh, tendons had a bit of a lull in healing, but still needed healers to be active keeping ahead on searings before heading into another roll... Anyway, it was obvious this fight was broken to begin with considering the enormous nerf the tendons saw, so the one fight I even considered it should not of even happened.

Honestly I just think the concept of being a watered down, weak hybrid DPS for portions of a fight is just not going to work. The track record of encounters just does not support it when you really dig into the fights. Even if I accept that there are a couple, are we really going to have our signature tier designed around a once a tier fight?

If it got to a point where it made sense (by reducing healing demands for frequent "phases" etc..)... raids will just take less healers and add a DPS, guaranteed. Combine the fact they are making the reverse much more effective (DPS heals are going way up within these designs) and it just does not seem this could ever made made to work. The reverse has always been far more viable and would make dropping healers for "real DPS" even more predictable.

We need a better option for the 90 tier, even the dream talent is not only awkward, but seemingly not worth the effort to begin with for just a single buffed heal every 30 seconds, which is how it reads to me. Being forced to cast a weak non-specced dps spell, wasting mana and time, for no real reason other than forced by a talent... is weird. The best scenario I see for it would be a buffed direct heal on the tank.. but that makes no sense as we would waste time casting a DPS spell to buff a single heal, while a tank is waiting in danger at low health... not smart
Edited by Fangthorn on 2/20/2012 12:08 AM PST
90 Worgen Druid
One
7275
Well said,

If im not mistaken, the shammies have that ability right now, which allow them to cast a cheaper or more powerful spell after hit an enemy with a shock spell.

I would like to know how many shammies actually take up this ability. especially in heroic encounters.

Do Developers actually read these posts?

honestly blizzard what the hell where you you thinking with that level 90 ability.

would honestly like to see a developer respond to this objectively not politically.

Sorry about the frustration - but it was hard enough getting into a raid comp without raid wide damage reduction CD's - now this.


100 Night Elf Druid
14140
If they made the Force of Nature effect a small raid damage mitigation (say 10-20%), and separated it from the Tree of Life tier... I would be stoked.

It think that would finally get us the tools to compete with other healers outside of effective heals.

That and separating soul of the forest from that tier as well. I like that talent, chasing a swiftmend with a buffed HoT (assuming the haste will effect them), especially WG, or a direct heal gives a little more burst to us. Going through a fight like H. Madness and trying to compete with other healers on Mutated Corruption slaps reminded me just how bad our tools are when it comes to healing small groups quickly..
Edited by Fangthorn on 2/20/2012 12:04 AM PST
85 Human Death Knight
990
I have another suggestion about mages. take out the bombs and give them to the respective classes... also add back in flame orb and arcane orb.

Make a Utility tier for Level 75.
1. Backdraft- summons a pillar of fire in front of the caster, knocking back enemies and stunning them for 4 seconds.
2. Hungering Cold - Purges the earth around the mage of all heat. Enemies within 10 yards are trapped in ice, preventing them from performing any action for 10 sec. Enemies are considered Frozen. Any damage will break the ice.
3. Nether vortex - Gives your Arcane Blast, frostbolt, and fireball spell a 100% chance to apply the Slow spell to any target it damages if the target is not currently affected by Slow.

I think focusing on talents removed but in a new way will help. Obviously backdraft is like typhoon. Now that is a very situational spell but that's the point. Sometimes you may want to freeze in place vs. knock back vs. slow... now we have choices that we can make but will not affect our dps. You are still giving this class their cool new things and something like nether vortex which was effectively removed is now back in the game.
85 Human Death Knight
990
As for Druids. Level 60 talents should be level 90. For force of nature... Treants should be able to assist your spec. If tanking they act like army, if DPSing they remain the same as they have been until now, if healing they should run around and heal the lowest health targets. Now resto is going to be upset because they wont get tree form until level 90. That does make for a penultimate talent and also gets rid of the pesky level 90 talents that are their now saying you have to switch forms.

Get rid of the you have to shapeshift tier. Leave disentanglement. Bring back master shapshifter and the old heart of the wild for the other 2 level 60 talents. Done.
02/15/2012 01:14 PMPosted by Kaivax
Chances were almost certain that you were going to choose those anyway so we just gave them to you.


It's like reading, "Chances are, you want a cookie, so we gave it to you... before we eated it."

It made me smile. ^_^
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