World of Warcraft®

How do you feel about them? I'm not the most seasoned priest, and this is an alt, but I feel like Death Knights give me the most trouble.

They spam Necrotic Strike and litter the floor of my pillar with Desecrates, and when they have a nice buffer of Necro stacked, they open up burst and it's worse than a Warrior while I have slowed casting speed and have no way of escaping the slow, other than running to the next pillar-- leaving me in the way of other CCs or Mana Burn.

Is it just gear? I mean, for some reason I fight full Cata-geared DK's at the 1000's bracket with my RL friend's rogue, but really.

I know my rogue should ideally shadowstep redirect kidney or something like that, but that can't be the only answer.

I dislike death knights, but they're usually not very difficult to kill.

Death Knights are too geared toward fighting casters and kind of flimsy against strong melee. Against some casters they can just cycle through immunity after immunity to all/some of their abilities while sitting on top of them with undispellable CoI and yanking them back with Death Grip should they ever manage to get away.

Then there's rogues...who just rip their heads off as easily as one might decapitate a dandelion.

Fighting a very skilled DK on this Warlock is an exercise in frustration, win or lose, because even if I win I know it's going to take a very long time, require me to use all my cooldowns in perfect order and leave me very nearly dead. Fighting one on my rogue, however, is just absolutely hilarious.

This is too extreme a disparity, in my opinion. It's fine for them to be stronger against certain types of things and weaker against others, but having multiple flat-out immunities against type A and not a shred of defense against type B is too extreme.

03/06/2012 10:15 AMPosted by Yfele

Is it just gear? I mean, for some reason I fight full Cata-geared DK's at the 1000's bracket with my RL friend's rogue, but really.

Rogues eat DKs for lunch. I'm no expert but can't you win by just having your rogue sit on the DK? It's not like the DK will ever escape from the rogue.

This should leave you free to manaburn and cc the DKs healer.

If you leave a DK to sit on pretty much any healer except a holy pally, then that healer is going to die at some point if the DK is decent.

I think DKs just hard counter priests. Incidentally I play a DK, and a feral. The only healers I can ever find for 2s are priests.

When we're matched up against DK teams (usually DK having a paladin or OP resto shaman), the DK just trucks my priest. The team can play crappy, but they'll still win. No amount of peels seems to save my priest partner. He's always pressured hard enough to not be able to go on the offense with me.

Just look at the dynamics of the situation-
Necrotics can be applied through PW:S & pain supp.
Slows casting against a casting (no strong instant casts) healer.
1 fear which the DK can easily negate (or their partner can cleanse).
Death grip for easy gap closing.
Constant snare making pillar humping real difficult.
Pets that do formidable damage and one that stuns (can stun LoS).

Honestly, if it wasn't for the strength of RMP, I wouldn't blame priests for rerolling... resto shaman or maybe holy paladin.

03/06/2012 10:15 AMPosted by Yfele

Is it just gear? I mean, for some reason I fight full Cata-geared DK's at the 1000's bracket with my RL friend's rogue, but really.

deathknights wreck shadowpriests. like, the class itself specifically has an answer for everything they do and makes it impossible for them to function if they sit on the shadow.

death knights themselves are fine, some of their mechanics ARE stupid like necrotic strike and ams, but they're balanced as whole because of their susceptibility to melee trains and coordinated bursts of damage when their cooldowns are down.

Is it just gear? I mean, for some reason I fight full Cata-geared DK's at the 1000's bracket with my RL friend's rogue, but really.

deathknights wreck shadowpriests. like, the class itself specifically has an answer for everything they do and makes it impossible for them to function if they sit on the shadow.

death knights themselves are fine, some of their mechanics ARE stupid like necrotic strike and ams, but they're balanced as whole because of their susceptibility to melee trains and coordinated bursts of damage when their cooldowns are down.

Typical coming from this guy who plays fotm op comps who get's destroyed on the worst bg in the country retaliation. In a world of ferals rets and rogues. No. we aren't close to being fine. There is no excuse for having zero defenses against any melee. 3 minute 20% damage reduction cooldown is easily worst melee defensive and is killed through on a daily basis. Pet sac and lichborne are effected by MS. Lichborne, yes, heals alot more for unholy than it does frost, but that doesn't even matter when you to have trinket every bomb so you don't die in 2 seconds which then leads to a full disarm bc dk's have no disarm protection. Being the train target for almost every comp isn't fine. Having the 2nd lowest representation in the 2.2k or higher brackets right above warriors does not constitute being fine. If rogues or ferals had some sort of nerf I would consider dk's being fine, but they haven't so dk aren't fine.

03/07/2012 11:44 AMPosted by Blightx

deathknights wreck shadowpriests. like, the class itself specifically has an answer for everything they do and makes it impossible for them to function if they sit on the shadow.

death knights themselves are fine, some of their mechanics ARE stupid like necrotic strike and ams, but they're balanced as whole because of their susceptibility to melee trains and coordinated bursts of damage when their cooldowns are down.

Typical coming from this guy who plays fotm op comps. In a world of ferals rets and rogues. No. we aren't close to being fine. There is no excuse for having zero defenses against any melee. 3 minute 20% damage reduction cooldown is easily worst melee defensive and is killed through on a daily basis. Pet sac and lichborne are effected by MS. Lichborne, yes, heals alot more for unholy than it does frost, but that doesn't even matter when you to have trinket every bomb so you don't die in 2 seconds which then leads to a full disarm bc dk's have no disarm protection. Being the train target for almost every comp isn't fine. Having the 2nd lowest representation in the 2.2k or higher brackets right above warriors does not constitute being fine. If rogues or ferals had some sort of nerf I would consider dk's being fine, but they haven't so dk aren't fine.

you're right, dks shouldn't have any counters.

03/07/2012 03:34 PMPosted by Silencioz

you're right, dks shouldn't have any counters.

0/10
Yeah you're right. We should just accept the fact that any melee should be allowed to kill us in 5 seconds. Seems super logical. Dk hater #2324234234234 step aside.

you're right, dks shouldn't have any counters.

0/10
Yeah you're right. We should just accept the fact that any melee should be allowed to kill us in 5 seconds. Seems super logical. Dk hater #2324234234234 step aside.

Warlocks, elemental shaman, boomkins, resto druids, and all three priest specs can say the same thing about us. The response to your original post was due to the fact that you complained about our weak melee defenses, but you glossed over the fact that we severely gimp most casters and healers.

We can't have the best of both worlds (i.e., we aren't rogues) or the nerf bat will come flying fast and hard, just like it did when they gutted HC and deathstrike.

0/10
Yeah you're right. We should just accept the fact that any melee should be allowed to kill us in 5 seconds. Seems super logical. Dk hater #2324234234234 step aside.

Warlocks, elemental shaman, boomkins, resto druids, and all three priest specs can say the same thing about us. The response to your original post was due to the fact that you complained about our weak melee defenses, but you glossed over the fact that we severely gimp most casters and healers.

We can't have the best of both worlds (i.e., we aren't rogues) or the nerf bat will come flying fast and hard, just like it did when they gutted HC and deathstrike.

what you say is all fine and dandy but werent talking about 1v1 here. I don't know where this 1v1 horsecrap came up. I'm talkin strictly 3v3. Resto druids ele shams and boomkins are severely gimped yes, but these classes have alternative specs that perform spetacularly in pvp atm. Locks usually play with rogues, priests usually play with ferals or rogues. Locks and Priests have a multitude of comps they can play as well. The fact that you are even mentioned ele resto or boomkin shows the fact that have no clue about the state of pvp atm. I know they are terrible specs, but I'm talking the specific class that I play.

deathknights wreck shadowpriests. .

On an under geared alt, but I have zero problems with any dks. Save dispersion for ams and its gg.

DKs are rough on Warlocks and Priests, mostly due to those classes' weak mobility and reliance on magical fear-based CC. Necrotic strike also is nasty versus discipline, due to not being dropped by absorbs.

Other than those two classes, we're sort of like melee arcane mages: Dangerous if unchecked, but quite easy to stop.

03/07/2012 11:44 AMPosted by Blightx

Typical coming from this guy who plays fotm op comps who get's destroyed on the worst bg in the country retaliation. In a world of ferals rets and rogues. No. we aren't close to being fine. There is no excuse for having zero defenses against any melee. 3 minute 20% damage reduction cooldown is easily worst melee defensive and is killed through on a daily basis. Pet sac and lichborne are effected by MS. Lichborne, yes, heals alot more for unholy than it does frost, but that doesn't even matter when you to have trinket every bomb so you don't die in 2 seconds which then leads to a full disarm bc dk's have no disarm protection. Being the train target for almost every comp isn't fine. Having the 2nd lowest representation in the 2.2k or higher brackets right above warriors does not constitute being fine. If rogues or ferals had some sort of nerf I would consider dk's being fine, but they haven't so dk aren't fine.

This is a great post because it does all of my work for me. You actually defeat your own arguments!

There is no excuse for having zero defenses against any melee.

Zero defenses, that's not right...

3 minute 20% damage reduction cooldown is easily worst melee defensive and is killed through on a daily basis. Pet sac and lichborne are effected by MS.

Ah, there we go. You list your defensive cooldowns for me. And there's more than zero!

If rogues or ferals had some sort of nerf I would consider dk's being fine, but they haven't so dk aren't fine.

I don't even need to tell you why representation doesn't matter. You already know that death knight representation is low only because god classes like rogues can replace them. You already know death knights have several Gladiator- and rank 1- viable comps. You already know that death knights aren't underpowered.

Really, why are you even in this thread?

03/06/2012 10:15 AMPosted by Yfele

How do you feel about them? I'm not the most seasoned priest, and this is an alt, but I feel like Death Knights give me the most trouble.

Ret + DK is the hardest spec for me and my disc priest partner to handle. They have a two interrupts and a silence, and good burst. They pretty much perma-slow you.

They're a little weak CC and defensive-wise, but if the fight is over in under a minute AMS can keep them immune to peels long enough to be a problem.

DK + Healer is really annoying too, because they apply more pressure than me (not that applying more pressure than enhancement is saying much--almost everyone does).

On a whole they are fairly strong in PvP in both Arenas and RBG's. Blood DK flag-carriers make me want to cry and their DPS toolkit is specifically rigged to destroy non-mage casters and healers (even put some solid pressure on mages). They have several viable comps in 2v2 and 3v3.

Just make sure someone peels those rogues off you quickly, Blizzard have pretty much confirmed that rogues (and frostmages) are free to rule PvP for the remainder of this expansion.

03/06/2012 10:30 AMPosted by Maleficia

This is too extreme a disparity, in my opinion. It's fine for them to be stronger against certain types of things and weaker against others, but having multiple flat-out immunities against type A and not a shred of defense against type B is too extreme.

i love u

the heck you guys talking about

good unholy DKs will wreck any melee 1v1 also.

DK is the most well rounded class after frost mages, best for 1v1s and crap like that