You need to reread the blog. Everyone rolls now. There's no choice. If they win but cannot use any of the items they still get a reward of some sort. Also everyone rolls independently of everyone else so robbing someone else of their roll wouldn't do you any good. If they get a 100 and you get a 99 you both win. If they get a 1 and you get a 2 you both lose. If he rolls a 100 and you roll a 2 it's not like you can throw out his roll and then win because you came in second. You still lose.03/27/2012 02:15 PMPosted by KepertThere should be a rule that if a player ALREADY owns the item they cannot roll, or if they have a better gear slot already than they can't roll, of course only in their level appropriate raids such as only 90 so people can still get Transmogrifications, but of course you will have to find out the main stats and have a program thingy in WoW that calculates everything to decide what is better..........
Dev Watercooler – MoP Looting Explained
While I applaud they're desire to try and make things more streamline there are too many flaws. Transmog gear and RP gear will be impossible to get from raids with this system. Want caster plate for transmog? Already have everyone in your raid group agree to this? Well too bad so sad.
Now if this ONLY effects LFR that is a different story. The people who want then to just gear up will go in LFR and the people who want mog items or RP items will go with a group of friends.
Q1. Is the quantity of loot static at 4 for 25 man / 2 for 10 man?
Q2.If not static, could all 25 people in a raid technically win boss from a single boss?
Q3. If not static, can less or more people than the cap win loot? (ie. sometimes 3 win on 25, sometimes 4 win, sometimes 1 wins)
Q4. If it is capped (note: IF) then how can you say that one person winning loot does not effect others chances to win loot? This is very confusing as it is technically not true being that it is impossible to handle all rolls simultaneously so someone will always win out over another person based on what orders rolls are handles by the game.
It seems like there are a lot of people who didn't notice that it is for Raid Finder, not for normal raids (at least according to the article sections) It would however be nice if they still let you have the option to pass, perhaps using like a toggle button before the boss so that if you don't need something you could pass... Of course this would lead to people all passing so that one person could gear up, but they could make it so you may only pass once every so many bosses or something.
We will see what happens, I look forward to seeing this progress =)
No... that's not how it works at all... Your roll or not roll or anything else does not in any way effect the next guy. Say you all could pass, that one person will not have any better chances of getting loot. That person will get the same loot or no loot off a boss reguardless of anyone or everyone else getting loot.
Second, with the personal loot system, I have to disagree with the idea that you can't pass on items. I think it would be a great idea if we can at least see all the loot and if there is nothing we want then we can just pass on all to give a better chance to friends or anyone else in the raid to get the gear they need. I understand it is set up for us to roll on everything at once so with the option to roll on everything or completely pass would be good.
A question I think a few people would ask about the personal loot system is if we can't pass on items and gear drops that we already have or a stronger piece of gear for that slot, will the system still make a roll for us and give us the gear? I would hope not unless it's a dagger, mace, ax, or sword that we would need two of for duel wielding.
Lastly, I just want to say I really love the idea for the bonus roll and how we can use the charm for only one boss encounter.
Currently I do LFR on my shaman but I don't go with a group and I don't need items. I went 2 days ago to learn how to play Elemental in a forgiving raid environment. I was able to decline all rolls without any problems.
In Mists, I feel it will be hard to do this without feeling like I deprived someone a spot as "one of the winners" without knowing the RNG voodoo that happens behind the curtain with this particular system.
Basically, this system implies that there is a chance no one will win an item on a boss fight. Is this true? And if not, what are the steps taken to ensure there are winners?
I'd like to be able to queue in my spare time knowing that my extra DPS is still welcome, and not depriving others of loot because my blind roll happened to be a 100, where previously there wouldn't have been a roll.
Is it something like everyone who rolls higher than x gets a prize, and if there aren't enough of those then top y rollers get prizes? It wasn't really explained how the system will work, just why it will.
I do agree it will help being able to focus frustration on "bad RNG" instead of "that guy", but I'm kinda scratching my head as to why I should continue doing LFR on my main right now, since it wasn't really explained how one roll won't affect others.
Also this is amazing:
We think killing dragons and ransacking their hoard is more epic than shopping at the magic armor store
"If my raiding guild is about to take on a world boss, and some lonely hunter is asking to join the group (it's always a lonely hunter, isn't it?), it would be nice to be able to bring him on without worrying about that jerk taking loot away from me or my friends. We want to foster a "the more the merrier" attitude with world bosses."
Isn't this completely nullified by adding mounts to both world bosses? Unless the mount drops 1 for everyone in the raid, then the World Boss mounts are going to be 1 per kill like all other mob-dropped mounts. Inviting lonely hunter will reduce the chance that the guild is going to have the mount to themselves.
You need to reread how looting works in LFR as well as world bosses. Everyone rolls individually specifically to remove the liability that the lonely hunter represents under the current system. In the new system you're rolling against the game. Your odds of winning are purely dictated by RNG. This is regardless of whether or not the hunter won the mount. His shot at winning a mount is also dictated by RNG. You could both get really lucky and get awarded a mount. It will be as if the boss had dropped two mounts. Your chance at the mount has no dependence whatsoever on the number of people in the group under the new system.
I usually run as dps but occasionally I'm asked to tank. I don't mind tanking with friends and guildies but I will probably never tank a LFR. So the way I usually get tanking gear is because no one else in the raid needed the tanking item. So I will get it so I can build my off spec.
With the way I'm reading this, the only way that I will be able to build an off spec is to run as that spec in the raid. The system, as it says, "gives those players a spec-appropriate item". So if I am the lucky one to win a roll but because I'm not in my tanking spec I will never get a shield.
I think what has been implemented in the LFR system is close. So why can't we just adjust that system? There have been a lot of good suggestions that I've read. One being about not allowing someone who already has won or has that item on them, in there bag or bank to receive roll need on it. Makes sense to me.
This is only for LFR and world bosses.03/27/2012 02:23 PMPosted by PlainstriderNow if this ONLY effects LFR that is a different story. The people who want then to just gear up will go in LFR and the people who want mog items or RP items will go with a group of friends.
03/27/2012 02:26 PMPosted by Stkxat a interview Greg said that they where thinking between 3-6 ppl will win loot of the boss in LFR but it was not final yet
In today's blog he said that everyone will individually roll against the game and that their odds of winning will not be impacted by the other players' rolls.
This means that each week, you can become a little more powerful
This seems like the only issue I saw in reading because, from the way it was said, it makes it out to be sort of focused on people who had more time, Example*: Jim Bob just received Mists of Pandaria and reached level cap within a regular WoW week (Tuesday to Tuesday) and has begun accumulating valor for the week, Jim Bob very quickly achieved Valor Cap. At the end of Jim Bob's second week of owning MoP Naomi just purchased the Game and levels to level cap within the same time frame of Jim Bob, Naomi is also very adamante about reaching Valor cap and does so her first week. Sadly, Jim Bob reached Valor cap the week Naomi began playing and is thus one week ahead of Naomi. Throughout all of MoP Neither Naomi nor Jim Bob miss a week of valor cap but because Jim Bob began a week earlier Jim Bob will Always has better gear than Naomi. Naomi is sad. Raging ensues.*I realize an example was uneccesary but it was also fun.
I can't believe this concept is so difficult for people to grasp. With all of the clarification in that post, I still see people saying things like "we should be able to pass" or "I don't like that I might be taking an item away from someone who actually needs it."
I don't think they could have made it any more clear in that post, but here's my attempt:
Your chance of winning loot does not affect and is not affected by other players' chances of winning loot!
All this garbage about "top rolls" or "only 4 drops per boss" or whatever is completely contradicted by the details in the blog. Why is this so hard to comprehend?
he did not state anything about how many ppl will be able to receive loot of a boss in any LFR grp but as i said before they have not finalize if say 4 ppl can or if every one can but i agree fully with the rest of this :)
In fact, they should make things more valor oriented (or another currency which can only be obtained in normal/heroic raids). I completely hate the randomness involved. If i could, i wish all loot wasn't just completely random and I had some way of controlling my drops by at least a bit.
03/27/2012 01:27 PMPosted by DelekiiSo, when you click on filter on the current dungeon/raid journal and filter by your class, you get some REALLY !@#$ed up choices. Tell me that whoever is assigning items to particular specs is not the same person, because I really have no use for strength trinkets as a feral.
That is just a can equip filter.
If you can equip it, you can see it.
Nice - thanks.
One question: will it be possible (however rare) for everyone in the raid to win an item? Conversely, will it be possible for no one to win anything?
Is there a "sweet spot" that you're aiming for in terms of how many people win loot, recognizing that it will vary on each roll?
This is what i would like to see answered. If it is possible that everyone receives loot then you've implemented a good system. The way it's explained, I assume this is how it should work
Otherwise, Bringing that extra hunter would hurt your theoretical chance of winning loot
03/27/2012 02:30 PMPosted by RonduwilIn today's blog he said that everyone will individually roll against the game and that their odds of winning will not be impacted by the other players' rolls.
he still said kill>roll>loot he didn't go 25 roll top/everyone loot there has been no fixed terms to this yet as they don't even have raids in the beta yet.... well open beta any way XD
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