Why do you hate TC?

90 Draenei Death Knight
15480
04/03/2012 01:56 PMPosted by Yfele
The tooltip wasn't updated. 15 yd was too short to heal people against bosses with large hit boxes.


They did that due to Rag correct?
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85 Human Priest
2425


They did that due to Rag correct?


Well yes, initially. There's still handfuls of bosses with large hitboxes that Atonement didn't work on.
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They did that due to Rag correct?


Well yes, initially. There's still handfuls of bosses with large hitboxes that Atonement didn't work on.


Uh, no....
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1033289-Regarding-the-atonement-range

It calculates, rather from just the center of the hit box, from the edge closest to the priest to the center of the hit box. This allows it to more effectively heal on larger boss hit boxes, but it still does not have a 100 yard range, it is still 15 yards from the boss.
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90 Draenei Death Knight
15480
04/03/2012 02:00 PMPosted by Yfele
Well yes, initially. There's still handfuls of bosses with large hitboxes that Atonement didn't work on.


I rarely raid on my priest anymore so i am out of touch. I am a glutten for punishment so i main a shaman.
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85 Human Paladin
8725
15 yards still, but from edge of boss instead of center
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85 Draenei Shaman
10680
Because TC is extremely clunky to be balanced around, a shaman not taking TC is only hindering his/her ability. If TC gave a small amount of mana and we weren't balanced around it that would be fine, but we're not. No other healer has to suffer with regen mechanics like an rshaman.

I honestly don't care if I have infinite mana on bosses like magmaw and deathwing, I want my regen to be consistent. So I don't mind TC if it's not required, but if it is then that's bad design.
Edited by Sensations on 4/3/2012 3:09 PM PDT
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90 Troll Shaman
7615
It's a chore I'm forced to find time for in heroic raids.
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90 Orc Shaman
15810
Yeah everyone summed it up pretty nice. though to be honest, for most fights I don't hate it so far. Outta the four heroics I have done, there has been set times for it (ultraxion you can weave many in throughout the fight). I don't expect it will be an annoyance to use on hagara either...

but man when we get to blackhorn heroic, I think I will find it pretty annoying to use. There just doesn't seem to be a time where there is a complete lull in the damage from the few times I have attempted it on another toon.
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90 Undead Priest
0

The tooltip wasn't updated. 15 yd was too short to heal people against bosses with large hit boxes.


This

04/03/2012 02:10 PMPosted by Gamedin
15 yards still, but from edge of boss instead of center


It is most definitely still 15 yards.
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90 Orc Shaman
10495
Because its an awful mechanic which was not supposed to be mana positive in the first place, as per GC's own words; but eventually became so, and became an excuse for the devs to never give us a real mana regeneration mechanic which is actually worthwile.

The sole existance of the TC glyph in MoP beta is nearly disgusting to me. It just goes from 40% damage returned as mana to 35%, but with fixed mana pools it will scale even faster than in Cata unless said mana pools are huge in comparison to LB damage at lvl 90.
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85 Troll Druid
10420
04/03/2012 01:50 PMPosted by Davvyjoness
Well Shaman regen outside of TC isn't THAT terrible. I use stopcast macros in case I need to save someone right now and I'm casting a LB. Sometimes if I'm really OOM then I will sit there and spam LB while the other healers work a little harder but afterwards (maybe 20 sec) I have a good amount of mana and can start letting them regen while I take care of most of the healing. Team work. It's fun.


Shaman regen is awful compared to the other three. I dislike TC because while it is quite good on fights with damage boost phases, there aren't always good, ideal places to use it which forces you to, as you said, lean on the other healers. That sort of thing shouldn't be necessary just to have similar regen to players who never have to stop casting the entire encounter.

While it is a cool mechanic that could give shaman an edge on certain encounters, the fact that you have to depend on it to actually heal hard makes it a big negative in my books.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
0
Yeah TC is meh. It should really return mana regardless of if LB hits the target or not, kind of like Death Strike but mana lol.
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86 Tauren Shaman
0
I hate TC because Blizzard pretends it's not a mana regen tool when it is.

Because they pretend it isn't a mana regen tool, it remains the most poorly implemented healer regen mechanic in the game. No hit to help land LB, no innate Haste to make it less painful, no actual healing done while regening, and more.

Because it IS a mana regen tool (the biggest Shaman mana regen tool on several fights, in fact), I am basically forced to take it to down any Heroic content in my guild. it almost always puts MTT to shame and most likely does the same for Resurgence and WS too on more than one occasion. "Oh, you don't really need that." Yea, ok lol.

Between Blizzard pretending it's not a problem and several pro-TC Shaman acting like it's an "option" to not take it if I really don't like it, I'm quite disgusted with the mechanic, honestly.

The hypocritical situation that involves leaving TC as it is while revamping HPally Judgement because it was "spammy and not fun"doesn't help either.
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90 Draenei Shaman
7105
Because…eh…I have to change focus to mob and change it back to tank. I hate doing that on my pally too


Why would you be targeting the tank? I just use mouseover macros to heal...
>Keep ultraxion targeted
>HR>RT>CH>LB>CH>HR
>win
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90 Draenei Shaman
7105
04/03/2012 08:16 PMPosted by Korghal
Because its an awful mechanic which was not supposed to be mana positive in the first place, as per GC's own words; but eventually became so, and became an excuse for the devs to never give us a real mana regeneration mechanic which is actually worthwile

Yup. This is my problem with it too. I like the idea and the active regeneration model, but the fact that they refuse to pay any attention to our passive regeneration because of it... ugh.

04/03/2012 08:16 PMPosted by Korghal
The sole existance of the TC glyph in MoP beta is nearly disgusting to me. It just goes from 40% damage returned as mana to 35%,

I thought it decreased LB damage by 30%, but returned 50% of damage dealt as mana? Or did they nerf it again?
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90 Troll Shaman
9995
I find a lot of the fights this tier seem to allow for luls in incoming damage enough to get off a few lightning bolts here and there every fight.

Personally, I'd rather be able to use a shock to get mana back instead (like how holy pally judgement works) instead of having a cast time spell for that purpose, but hey, it works and it isn't broken. I like it well enough.
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90 Orc Shaman
10495
04/04/2012 06:29 AMPosted by Kiango
I thought it decreased LB damage by 30%, but returned 50% of damage dealt as mana? Or did they nerf it again?

Its just math to compare it to current TC:

Current TC returns 40% of the damage done by a normal LB.

Beta TC returns 50% of a 30%-nerfed LB. Or 1*0.7*0.5 * 100 = 35% damage returned as mana relative to a non-nerfed LB. Its a 12.5% overall nerf of TC returns compared to now, but fixed mana pools and LB damage scaling could quickly overcome such nerfs at least by the second tier depending on LB damage scaling and mana pool size.

Current beta mana pools are at 100k give or take a couple thousands. That is a big dive from current mana pool size (namely for Druids and Disc priests), and Glyph of TC is very likely to be mana positive with those numbers, so I would expect something similar come lvl 90.
Edited by Korghal on 4/4/2012 9:33 AM PDT
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90 Draenei Shaman
7105
04/04/2012 09:30 AMPosted by Korghal
Beta TC returns 50% of a 30%-nerfed LB. Or 1*0.7*0.5 * 100 = 35% damage returned as mana relative to a non-nerfed LB. Its a 12.5% overall nerf of TC returns compared to now, but fixed mana pools and LB damage scaling could quickly overcome such nerfs at least by the second tier depending on LB damage scaling and mana pool size.

Ah, very interesting! Good to know.

04/04/2012 09:30 AMPosted by Korghal
Glyph of TC is very likely to be mana positive with those numbers, so I would expect something similar come lvl 90.

I'd bet my gold on it, yes.
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