Buying a guild and scammed?

(Locked)

80 Blood Elf Paladin
7490
04/09/2012 09:07 PMPosted by Immature
but Im still out of my gold . I would say that is a win for the scammer


Again, how does the scammer win by getting the account banned, and stripped of all the items?

The scammer DOES. NOT. CARE. about you, and whether or not you have the gold. It's not a win for anyone, most of all for Blizzard, who has to sort through the mess (that you helped create, I might add) and make tough decisions which lead to angry customers.
69 Orc Death Knight
11095
04/09/2012 09:04 PMPosted by Immature
Keep saying I should have known better .


No one has said that.

All I do know is I pay to play this


Everyone does. You are not singular in this, and you are held accountable to the same rules as anyone.


and If someone Screws me over I'm a honest and loyal customer , I shouldnt have to just deal with the fact that I tried to purchase something . and now im screwed >


Why? Why is it that you should not be held responsible for engaging in risky behavior? Is a guild something you can trade in a window? Did you have any evidence whatsoever that Blizzard would support this?

In the real world, people can be held partially or fully responsible for bad things that happen to them, even when someone else is being malicious, particularly when the behavior involved is deemed risky. How is this any different?


Its my fault i tried to buy something you are allowed to buy/sell or trade. And it is also my fault that I wanted to purchase such a thing as a guild for me and my friend's. And it is my fault that I trusted the fact that GM would be able to make thing's right If i were to get screwed. guess I was wrong twice.


You keep saying "fault," but it is your responsibility not to make assumptions and then blame others when your assumptions prove ill-considered.
85 Worgen Warrior
15780
point being its the wrong way to go about it. Okay a stranger ask's to borrow you lighter . its you lighter . you trust he will just use it real fast and give it back. BUT nope he takes it'
if you make a report . Identify him . Cops catch him and find the lighter that u show proof of being your's . Do the cops keep your lighter or would they give it back to you? Um yeah they would give it back to its rightful owner. WHY cause its the right thing to do. sometimes people steel /scam if your part of the law its you job to make things right . If you a Game master of a Game . and one of you customers were scammed . it should be you job to make it all right . Not keep what was taken to begin with . And if you cant see how the scammer wins then idk what to tell you. maybe the scammer is only out to just get you knowing there gonna get banned . and lose all there items they have gotten in the scam. maybe there only real mission is to just do just that . trick you into buying something and never getting you gold back cause the policy says so. they would still win cause you wont get your gold back. You a GM you shouldnt make that big of a deal about giving something back that belongs to them. it would be like complaining about driving all the time and you job is a taxi driver.
90 Gnome Warlock
5920
point being its the wrong way to go about it. Okay a stranger ask's to borrow you lighter . its you lighter . you trust he will just use it real fast and give it back. BUT nope he takes it'
if you make a report . Identify him . Cops catch him and find the lighter that u show proof of being your's . Do the cops keep your lighter or would they give it back to you? Um yeah they would give it back to its rightful owner. WHY cause its the right thing to do. sometimes people steel /scam if your part of the law its you job to make things right . If you a Game master of a Game . and one of you customers were scammed . it should be you job to make it all right . Not keep what was taken to begin with . And if you cant see how the scammer wins then idk what to tell you. maybe the scammer is only out to just get you knowing there gonna get banned . and lose all there items they have gotten in the scam. maybe there only real mission is to just do just that . trick you into buying something and never getting you gold back cause the policy says so. they would still win cause you wont get your gold back. You a GM you shouldnt make that big of a deal about giving something back that belongs to them. it would be like complaining about driving all the time and you job is a taxi driver.


That example isn't even close. What would be close, is if you buy a TV off the back of a truck and then take it home and it doesn't work. You call the cops and the cops find out that the guy that sold it to you was scamming people with stolen TVs. You don't get your money back or the TV and the guy that scammed you goes to jail.

It isn't Blizzard's job to babysit you. You engaged in an activity that is judged to be a high risk for scamming. You tried to take the easy way out and buy a guild instead of level one. Blizzard isn't going to get your gold back for that.
Edited by Scuba on 4/9/2012 9:23 PM PDT
90 Night Elf Druid
8725
04/09/2012 06:23 PMPosted by Immature
Someone offered to sell a Guild. So I made an offer. Offer was excepted we both agreed on a price . I pay for the Guild and the guy ignores me. Now Blizz is just telling me Nothing can't help you . Basically saying I should have known better then to try and buy a Guild. So now I'm out of 15k gold that I spent my time to get . Just gone. I think that is a poor way to treat a customer of over 4 years . To just say there is no way to repay me what was just taken from me when I know You can see he mislead me into buying it , you can see why I gave him the gold . Its not like I just messaged him saying here is 15000 gold good luck. Now didn't happen like that. I was even told afterwords in chat from one of his guildies that he has done it to a few others . I know you can see I was just ripped of 15000 gold and I know there is a way to repay me . I also Know I'm sorry I just signed up for a 1 year contract . thank's alot for letting me know there is nothing you can do . And I should have known better then to try and buy a guild . So if anything I guess you can try this your self and if you get anyone to trade you that gold it is yours. I mean worst that can happen is what u get a temp ban and come back having all this gold that you took from someone simply by misleading them . That is what I'm getting out of it since your saying You cant reimburse me . And if your gonna say that you didn't not allow him to keep the gold then why is it that I can't get the gold back ? I mean really is it that easy to just get over on someone ? Wish I could say thanks for the help.


seriously - just cancel your sub (which for a year costs $140) and spend 60 on just diablo if you want it that badly. I am regretting the year long sub - but I am already halfway done with it.
85 Worgen Warrior
15780
Sorry but if it were my game and this happen to someone I would not complain about making things right . its not like im asking for something that is or was not mine Im asking for something i was tricked out of , So I did something that I wish i didn't do . really its not like I bought gold off of a website and im trying to get my money back , I simply tried to buy something in game and fell for a scam . but i was never told just deal with it and take it as a lesson learned . pretty expensive lesson . EXCUSE ME FOR THINKING A GM COULD OR WOULD DO THE RIGHT THING GUESS I'M IN THE WRONG GAME AND YES THE SCAMMER WINS CAUSE I'M OUT OF 15,000 gold . Not the way it should be. well now i know you know you can do this and get over on people cause even tho you will get banned they will not get there gold back so scammers will always win . GG you can say your doing the right thing all you want but no matter who you are or what you say . who cares if that is the policy . the policy is wrong and should be changed . A person should never have to take a loss for being gullible . Specially when you can make it right and just choose not too . This policy just makes scammers that much more motivated . cause they kno when they get cought it wont matter cause everyone they ripped off will still be screwed . by not getting there belongings back. GG great policy . Blame your customers who only tried to purchase a guild . I was in the wrong . I should have known better to trust someone in the game . and I Should have to pay for being so gullible . all I can say is LAWL
69 Orc Death Knight
11095
point being its the wrong way to go about it. Okay a stranger ask's to borrow you lighter . its you lighter . you trust he will just use it real fast and give it back. BUT nope he takes it'
if you make a report . Identify him . Cops catch him and find the lighter that u show proof of being your's . Do the cops keep your lighter or would they give it back to you? Um yeah they would give it back to its rightful owner. WHY cause its the right thing to do.


I'm afraid you're mistaken -- the police would confiscate the lighter, as it's now evidence. Even assuming they don't want to make a legal issue of it to that extent, how much time do the police have to deal with this petty theft in comparison to, say, identity theft, burglary, grand theft auto, etc. -- issues which directly affect lives, and which in most cases the victim has little or no responsibility for their circumstance.

Whereas you? Trusted a stranger. It sucks they abused your trust, but that doesn't make your time more valuable than anyone else's.


sometimes people steel /scam if your part of the law its you job to make things right .


Short of the police going Judge Dredd and doing away with all other aspects of the legal system, no, it's not. It's their job to uphold the law -- there's a world of difference.


If you a Game master of a Game . and one of you customers were scammed . it should be you job to make it all right . Not keep what was taken to begin with .


How many times do they have to do this? How many freebies do you get? How many freebies does everyone get? How long do you want the queues to be?


And if you cant see how the scammer wins then idk what to tell you. maybe the scammer is only out to just get you knowing there gonna get banned . and lose all there items they have gotten in the scam. maybe there only real mission is to just do just that . trick you into buying something and never getting you gold back cause the policy says so. they would still win cause you wont get your gold back.


So the scammer is a sociopath who doesn't mind losing out himself as long as he makes random strangers lose out, too? I suspect you'll find that more are interested in making gold and using it.


You a GM you shouldnt make that big of a deal about giving something back that belongs to them. it would be like complaining about driving all the time and you job is a taxi driver.


It doesn't belong to you anymore. You gave it over to someone you didn't know, with no credentials, and no way of enforcing the deal beyond your ill-considered assumptions. You gave someone an unsecured loan with no written contract -- ask a lawyer how easy it is to enforce one of those.
69 Orc Death Knight
11095
04/09/2012 09:48 PMPosted by Immature
A person should never have to take a loss for being gullible . Specially when you can make it right and just choose not too .


The problem with this is, what possible motivation would you have to learn from your mistakes? It sucks you had to pay so much for it, but if Blizzard gives you back the gold, you have no motivation not to turn around and do it again.
90 Gnome Warlock
5920
04/09/2012 09:48 PMPosted by Immature
Sorry but if it were my game and this happen to someone I would not complain about making things right .


You wouldn't have a game for long. It is easy for you to say you would do that here. However you don't have to consider any consequences for doing it that way. Blizzard does. Again they have been doing it this way for a very very long time, this isn't something new.
85 Worgen Warrior
15780
Um no Im Not buying a tv off the back of a truck I was trying to buy a guild off of a game all things said in a chat that is logged . I wasnt shopping in the dark alley for a tv off of some crack dealer . No i was buying something off of someone in a game with all things said logged I wasnt buying a stolen guild . So ur lil scenario is wrong dont work . Bottom line is the policy is wrong and just allows scammers to get away with what there doin. Now getaway with it doesnt mean they keep everything. It means they got something from you for free and even tho they dont get to keep it You wont get it back so to me they win Cause i didnt win i lost . So For you to say it doesnt benefit them then ur a tard to say the least . Maybe that is all they want to do is just scam people knowing they wont get it back and they will be banned who cares right only the person who is really out . think about it if a scammer knows they can do this and this is how it works. wouldnt you wanna do it? Now if it wasnt this way and all items went back to whom they belong too and the scammer would get banned how many would stop doing this? I know I would . I would find another way to scam that would have more of an effect. cause if the policy was different only the gm would have the prob the customers would have a little prob but a gm could fix that . Instead GM has to deal with the scammer and an unsatisfied customer because there policy is whacked . So instead of the gm goin in the logs checkin everytihng banning the scammer and returning all items towhere they belong . Instead all people who might be any of a bit gullible are on there own and a free for all to all the scammers . all i can say is changing the policy on this could only benefit the customer not the scammer . I mean the GM is gonna have this here and there but could be less if the policy was different. ...
85 Human Mage
860
You will NOT get the gold back. Continuing to post here is doing nothing at all. If you want to suggest a change to policy then you need to post in the general forum. Otherwise you have been given your answer by in game gm's and even one on the forum. There really isn't anything more to discuss.
85 Worgen Warrior
15780
Danvers really where do u get this from ask a lawyer? I have it in writing its all in the chat log . lawl if this was RL I Would have my gold back NP
all the proof is there . its just BLizz way of saying they dont wanna go get it for everyone who is scammed and return it its just easier to say sorry . and move on . Knowing its not right . I had a written contract logged in the chat about our deal so u cant say there is no proof . Verbal or written is all you need but this being written is the best besides video. So for it to be all typed out and me to hold up my end of the bargain I did no wrong he did wrong by not holding up his end / So in court with my written agreement I would win my cause . Just here blizz policy just makes it to where we are Phishable thanks? And a cop would not confiscate a lighter if it wasnt used in a murder and u can identify the object being yous the officer would then note you identified it and would give it back You should take some law class's.
Edited by Immature on 4/9/2012 10:17 PM PDT
69 Orc Death Knight
11095
Danvers really where do u get this from ask a lawyer? I have it in writing its all in the chat log . lawl if this was RL I Would have my gold back NP


No, you wouldn't. Do you know why?

Because you could have gotten a guild for you and your friends legitimately, with no risk.

You didn't. You went to a scalper, and you got scammed.


all the proof is there . its just BLizz way of saying they dont wanna go get it for everyone who is scammed and return it its just easier to say sorry . and move on . Knowing its not right . I had a written contract logged in the chat about our deal so u cant say there is no proof .


Funny, I didn't mention proof. I just said you had no credentials and no binding legal contract, so you had no reason to believe him.


Verbal or written is all you need but this being written is the best besides video. So for it to be all typed out and me to hold up my end of the bargain I did no wrong he did wrong by not holding up his end / So in court with my written agreement I would win my cause . Just here blizz policy just makes it to where we are Phishable thanks?


Again, you're not taking into account your own responsibility. In civil suits, it's entirely possible for someone to rule that you were scammed, but also that you were culpable for it by not taking proper steps to ensure you weren't.

Quite frankly, too, you're proving Blizzard's case. You're who knows how many tickets along, and four pages in, swearing blind that you shouldn't be held responsible for the consequences of your own behavior and your own mistaken assumptions. Despite everyone here, you still act like you're blameless, even when you took few or no steps to protect yourself. You're insisting the scammer's somehow come out ahead even when he has no measurable gains, and likely serious measurable losses. You're choosing not to learn from your mistake right now, when it hurts to lose the 15K gold -- how on earth is it reasonable to believe you'd learn from your mistake if Blizzard gave it back to you?

04/09/2012 10:13 PMPosted by Immature
And a cop would not confiscate a lighter if it wasnt used in a murder and u can identify the object being yous the officer would then note you identified it and would give it back You should take some law class's.


If you want there to be any punishment, you better believe they'll confiscate evidence.

And, incidentally, I can't help but notice you're cherrypicking your response here. You neglect to mention why you feel this is worth the cop's time when they've got more pressing issues.
Edited by Danvers on 4/9/2012 10:25 PM PDT
85 Human Paladin
9670
I don't see the downside of refunding the OP's gold. It costs Blizzard nothing, and not refunding costs Blizzard Good Will and possibly a couple subscribers.

Maybe I missed something. Is it actually in the ToS that guild selling is against the rules or is an unsupported transaction?
69 Orc Death Knight
11095
I don't see the downside of refunding the OP's gold. It costs Blizzard nothing, and not refunding costs Blizzard Good Will and possibly a couple subscribers.


Nothing directly. Word gets out that this is now a supportable transaction? Your tickets take another week to get resolved.


Maybe I missed something. Is it actually in the ToS that guild selling is against the rules or is an unsupported transaction?


Is it in the rules that it's supported?

"Will I get my items and money back?
Due to the many variables involved with item reimbursement and types of scams, restoration is not guaranteed. We will make every effort to verify your particular case and, once verified, will try to assist in returning the missing item(s) to you. Please refer to our Character & Item Restoration Policy for further details on recovering lost items."

"Never give your prized possessions to anyone you do not trust
In World of Warcraft there should never be a reason to hand your items to an unknown player for any reason. Such things as casting enchantments to your items can be done safely through the trading window. Moving an item to the "Will not be traded" box in the trading window allows other players to enhance the item without it ever leaving your possession. Use caution when someone you don't know suggests a proposal or deal that involves trust."
100 Worgen Druid
21750
Surprised they didn't help out the OP here, I got scammed a very long time ago (for a spectral tiger LOL) from some guy for 500g (i know, i know, stupid!). Opened a ticket and spoke to a gm and they got my money back. I felt like a total idiot but they did fix the situation for me - no idea if the person got banned or not - but they did "disappear" off my friends list so who knows?
61 Worgen Priest
10505
Granted blizzard refuses to help players who do this and they knew it was going to happen is pretty inconsiderate on their part.
Whats even funnier is when you buy a pet code, game time code or anything similar and they simply report the code as stolen. Blizzard then returns the code and refuses to help. What they don't seem to understand is allowing this is supporting actual criminal activity, that in reality could be punished by law. How nice of blizzard to say, there is nothing we can do, criminals win always, because we support the greedy, like us.

Blizzard will take action against the scammer. This is an unsupported transaction. That means not against the rules. People can do it and lots do without any issues. However when people attempt this in a risky situation with people they cannot trust blizzard is not their safety net.

You have no idea what blizzard does with criminal activity in their blizzard store. Please do not post here and claim that you do based on what? Blizzard completely co-operates with all banks, credit card companies and law enforcement to provide any and all information they can for illegal transactions made through their websites with stolen credit card numbers. You do not know what goes on behind the scenes at blizzard, the banks, or the police departments that investigate these matters. When a code is bought with a stolen credit card, they cancel the code, take the gold back the it sold for, and take action against the account that did it. That is not blizzard supporting criminal activity.

When blizzard told the OP there is nothing we can do, that meant there is nothing they can do to help him. They cannot get his gold back. Anything else that happens to the other persons account the OP or anyone else is not privy to. You are reading way to much into that.

Do not come here and post misinformation based on bias, rumors and half truths with no facts or knowledge.
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