Kargath Dynasty - FU, Dosi, OU, ToA, Eternal?

67 Tauren Warrior
690
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that FU has surpassed Dosi as Kargath's top guild of all time.
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100 Draenei Warrior
19245
Fatal Union has done a fantastic job, no doubt.

I'm not sure that I'd call them a "dynasty" at this point. Two server firsts (Rag and DW) do not a Dynasty make, regardless of how high on the "world charts" they popped.

Dynasty material would be if they continue it in the next tier of content.

So, we shall see. Empires build and fade in the blink of an eye. FU is not immune to the 25man to 10 man problems that have plagued most guilds and in fact it's that conversion that allowed them to succeed so handily.

We'll see what they do in MoP and even what raiding turns into in the coming expansion.
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90 Tauren Druid
15455
You can't compare 40man raiding in vanilla with this crap we call raiding now.
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
14665
Fatal Union has done a fantastic job, no doubt.

I'm not sure that I'd call them a "dynasty" at this point. Two server firsts (Rag and DW) do not a Dynasty make, regardless of how high on the "world charts" they popped.

Dynasty material would be if they continue it in the next tier of content.

So, we shall see. Empires build and fade in the blink of an eye. FU is not immune to the 25man to 10 man problems that have plagued most guilds and in fact it's that conversion that allowed them to succeed so handily.

We'll see what they do in MoP and even what raiding turns into in the coming expansion.


Gotta give them credit for being around for so long though, considering how many have come and gone since FU was started.
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90 Goblin Warrior
13415
One of those guilds does not belong on the list and this thread will forever be troll material while it remains.

04/12/2012 07:31 AMPosted by Hoochy
You can't compare 40man raiding in vanilla with this crap we call raiding now.
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96 Orc Warrior
12940
I posted somethings on this topic in this thread:

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/4254459337

So I will not repeat those things. Having said that, no offense to OU, ToA, Eternal, EocD, LoC, etc., who all had stints of great success on Kargath, but overall nothing compared to Paradosi & FU.

I am just glad that I was actively a part of both guilds (Paradosi/FU) at the height of their domination and success! There is one area that I have an enormous amount of respect for FU, something Petagabriel mentioned and something Paradosi could never do, and that is endure through all the turmoil, set backs, and just overall BS that all guilds go through.

If you add up all the active time that Paradosi was raiding and pretty much lead the server in progression a high majority of that time, it's about 2 expansions worth of playing time. Vanilla + 1st half of TBC and 1st half of Wotlk. We had one huge break, came back for Wotlk, and couldn't stand what WoW raiding turned into and left for good.

FU on the other hand have been raiding since Vanilla, lead 2nd half of TBC, parts of Wotlk, and 2nd half of Cata right now. But think about that for a second. FU was together in Vanilla, and are now going into the *5th* installment of this game. They've been forced to rebuild the guild countless times and put up with so much BS, it's not even funny. Their longevity and ability to endure all the tough times and keep raiding despite the game losing a lot of steam the last 2 expansions speaks volumes about the leadership and core of that guild.

I wish I still loved the game the way I used to, but I don't. I look forward and hope Diablo 3 will keep me busy the way WoW has until Blizzard releases their MMOFPS.
Edited by George on 4/12/2012 8:04 PM PDT
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100 Draenei Warrior
19245
This is going to sound like a total #%*! comment but it's not meant to be:

I am just glad that I was actively a part of both guilds


Fixed.

Vastly different meanings there.

Longevity has its role but many guilds have been around for quite some time. Longevity does not make a Dynasty either.

In order to be a Dynasty you have to dominate and continue to do so. Killing two end bosses isn't enough to make a Dynasty. They could be the top guild in Cata (and mostly likely would be considered such by just about everyone) but if they don't continue in MoP then they are no different than the team who wins the superbowl once and then quietly fades back into every-day life.

If nothing else the required change from 25 man to 10 man raiding shows that FU is not immune to the same problems everyone else has. (I know I mentioned this earlier but it obviously is worth repeating.) As such they may very well find themselves in a #2 or #3 slot with the coming expansion if their core raid group decides to play other games or do other things. MoP may have plenty of content to offer for the general public but it only matters if people want to play MORE of the game otherwise they may find less of an overall reason to sign on. (F*ck pet battles.)

Also, as much as I liked (most) Eternal, they most certainly don't belong on a list comprised of long-standing Kargath guilds with consistent server firsts and community recognition. What happened to Eternal is pretty much what I described above as FU's potential issue coming soon.

TL:DR - Wait and see what happens.
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85 Human Priest
8425
One of those guilds does not belong on the list and this thread will forever be troll material while it remains.

You can't compare 40man raiding in vanilla with this crap we call raiding now.


remember when you would pass out in the middle of BWL and wake up the next day with like 3 pieces of new look and had no clue how you got them lol. good times.
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85 Human Warlock
3745
One of those guilds does not belong on the list and this thread will forever be troll material while it remains.



remember when you would pass out in the middle of BWL and wake up the next day with like 3 pieces of new look and had no clue how you got them lol. good times.


Huh.. wha.. Oh.. Yaaaay Nemesis Gloves!
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70 Human Paladin
2065
<Eternal> doesn't belong in this thread. ***k them.

Over a longer period of time, <Caustic> was better than OU, ToA, and the early-on EoCD, and were the only guild to really challenge Paradosi at the end of Vanilla during 40-man Naxx and into TBC up through SSC, when they quit and Paradosi flat out pulled ahead. There was literally no competition for Paradosi after <Caustic> quit raiding.

Pretty sure LoC should at least be mentioned since they were in the running for Alliance-first Ragnaros (can't remember of it was LoC or ToA that got that).

But none of those guilds have stood the test of time like FU has, and that counts for something.

TLDR: <Eternal>? LOL
Edited by Emmi on 4/13/2012 10:13 AM PDT
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85 Human Priest
8425
To be honest, I would put TIF on that list way before Eternal, just on history on the realm alone. One of the longest running guilds on Kargath with a few realm firsts and always in the top 5-6 guilds. Realm 3rd in 25's right now, in tier 13, # 903 world.
Edited by Suhcamara on 4/13/2012 3:58 PM PDT
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85 Gnome Warrior
11965
<Eternal> doesn't belong in this thread. ***k them.

Over a longer period of time, <Caustic> was better than OU, ToA, and the early-on EoCD, and were the only guild to really challenge Paradosi at the end of Vanilla during 40-man Naxx and into TBC up through SSC, when they quit and Paradosi flat out pulled ahead. There was literally no competition for Paradosi after <Caustic> quit raiding.

Pretty sure LoC should at least be mentioned since they were in the running for Alliance-first Ragnaros (can't remember of it was LoC or ToA that got that).

But none of those guilds have stood the test of time like FU has, and that counts for something.

TLDR: <Eternal>? LOL


Legion of Champions under Willbonney killed Rag40m first on Kargath.
LoC really never recovered after the summer of '06.
There are a few highlights to vanilla, like pre-bg TM. Where Alliance owned the little fraction of Kargath's population that was horde.
paradosi was really the only horde guild that I remember, and that was largely because of premade bgs in the second half. Where george had 2 pocket healers and a thunderfury.
On the other hand, Alliance had plenty of guilds that rose and dwindled, lots more activity. And a lot of guilds were splinters, remakes, etc. specially in vanilla.
Most of my competitive raiding was done in wrath, where the only guild Ethos competed against was TiF... I'm not sure how dosi/fu can be called a dynasty if they were absent for a quarter of the game time.
Eternal really isn't a Kargath guild, and fatal union is the only guild on horde side--that's a pretty good monopoly on potential raiders.

someone has to explain to me what makes fatal union an extension of dosi, and why should it be recognized as such. Plenty of beta or 12/2004 players are still active, just because a group of individuals stuck together on a server that sucked since... forever, doesn't make it a dynasty.

but by all means, cherish your memories so long as you stop comparing their worth to memories of others... who were far removed from your business.
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96 Orc Warrior
12940
<Eternal> doesn't belong in this thread. ***k them.

Over a longer period of time, <Caustic> was better than OU, ToA, and the early-on EoCD, and were the only guild to really challenge Paradosi at the end of Vanilla during 40-man Naxx and into TBC up through SSC, when they quit and Paradosi flat out pulled ahead. There was literally no competition for Paradosi after <Caustic> quit raiding.

Pretty sure LoC should at least be mentioned since they were in the running for Alliance-first Ragnaros (can't remember of it was LoC or ToA that got that).

But none of those guilds have stood the test of time like FU has, and that counts for something.

TLDR: <Eternal>? LOL


Legion of Champions under Willbonney killed Rag40m first on Kargath.
LoC really never recovered after the summer of '06.
There are a few highlights to vanilla, like pre-bg TM. Where Alliance owned the little fraction of Kargath's population that was horde.
paradosi was really the only horde guild that I remember, and that was largely because of premade bgs in the second half. Where george had 2 pocket healers and a thunderfury.
On the other hand, Alliance had plenty of guilds that rose and dwindled, lots more activity. And a lot of guilds were splinters, remakes, etc. specially in vanilla.
Most of my competitive raiding was done in wrath, where the only guild Ethos competed against was TiF... I'm not sure how dosi/fu can be called a dynasty if they were absent for a quarter of the game time.
Eternal really isn't a Kargath guild, and fatal union is the only guild on horde side--that's a pretty good monopoly on potential raiders.

someone has to explain to me what makes fatal union an extension of dosi, and why should it be recognized as such. Plenty of beta or 12/2004 players are still active, just because a group of individuals stuck together on a server that sucked since... forever, doesn't make it a dynasty.

but by all means, cherish your memories so long as you stop comparing their worth to memories of others... who were far removed from your business.


Your memory or information is incorrect! LoC got the realm first Onyxia around that time which is what you might be thinking about. Paradosi got the realm first 40m Ragnaros. LoC might have been 4th at best to 40m Rag because I know EoCD and ToA beat them to that kill Alliance side while LoC focused a lot of that early raid time to working on Onyxia while the rest of us were in Molten Core.

As for your other question as to why people feel that FU is an extension of Paradosi. On one hand, a few key Paradosi members have helped FU from TBC to Cata. On the other hand, when Paradosi stopped raiding in TBC, Fatal Union took over the #1 spot on Kargath until Paradosi fully came back in Wotlk. Fast forward to this expansion, Paradosi does not make another comeback and Fatal Union is the #1 Horde guild from start to finish, and now the #1 guild on Kargath as well for the 2nd half of this expansion.

I think the main reason is that we're both Horde guilds, and the only Horde guilds to achieve noteworthy server firsts and a few high ranking kills. If you go from Molten Core to Dragon Soul and consider every boss this game had to offer, and there's many, I think Paradosi & FU have every single Horde first, and most of those, also happen to be server firsts. So basically on the Horde Side, if it wasn't Paradosi, it was FU, and that's that.
Edited by George on 4/13/2012 6:50 PM PDT
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85 Gnome Warrior
11965
not sure as to why i clearly remember willbonney mentioning ragnaros. either way i didnt join till fall of '06
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90 Pandaren Rogue
7120
video games
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85 Human Mage
9090
04/14/2012 12:39 AMPosted by Ðeathweaver
video games


Say what you want about video games but WoW is not in the same category as the video games of the 1980's... There is much more to video games today than in the past...So yeah its video games and games like WoW deserve to be given the energy they get as seen in this forum. Look at some sports like golf... you are tryign to hit a ball into a cup and look at all the attention it gets... WoW is much younger than golf but there is more to WoW than hitting a ball into a cup or than the stereotype of a video game from the Nineteen Eighties...

WoW deserves the energy it gets in guilds debating about progression...It is a modern thing that is here with us to stay...Thank you and Congrats to all the people who are excellent or fans of (like me) the excellent players and guilds on Kargath and every other realm.
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96 Orc Warrior
12940
04/13/2012 09:12 PMPosted by Wrathbringer
not sure as to why i clearly remember willbonney mentioning ragnaros. either way i didnt join till fall of '06


To impress you o.O
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90 Pandaren Rogue
7120
Say what you want about video games but WoW is not in the same category as the video games of the 1980's... There is much more to video games today than in the past...So yeah its video games and games like WoW deserve to be given the energy they get as seen in this forum. Look at some sports like golf... you are tryign to hit a ball into a cup and look at all the attention it gets... WoW is much younger than golf but there is more to WoW than hitting a ball into a cup or than the stereotype of a video game from the Nineteen Eighties...

WoW deserves the energy it gets in guilds debating about progression...It is a modern thing that is here with us to stay...Thank you and Congrats to all the people who are excellent or fans of (like me) the excellent players and guilds on Kargath and every other realm.


TL;DR
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100 Human Paladin
15765
04/14/2012 01:54 AMPosted by One
video games


Look at some sports like golf... you are tryign to hit a ball into a cup and look at all the attention it gets... WoW is much younger than golf but there is more to WoW than hitting a ball into a cup or than the stereotype of a video game from the Nineteen Eighties...


Look at some games like WoW... you are trying to kill a boss and look at all the attention it gets...

Summing something up to make it sound simple is ignorant. As someone that plays both WoW and Golf they each have some similarities in terms of decision making, management, knowing what you're capable of doing, and playing the course/raid instead of the other players. The main difference I find is that you have 1 chance to make the right decision and execute it in golf. In WoW you just wipe it up and try again.
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85 Human Mage
9090
04/14/2012 11:36 AMPosted by Mikerk


Look at some sports like golf... you are tryign to hit a ball into a cup and look at all the attention it gets... WoW is much younger than golf but there is more to WoW than hitting a ball into a cup or than the stereotype of a video game from the Nineteen Eighties...


Look at some games like WoW... you are trying to kill a boss and look at all the attention it gets...

Summing something up to make it sound simple is ignorant. As someone that plays both WoW and Golf they each have some similarities in terms of decision making, management, knowing what you're capable of doing, and playing the course/raid instead of the other players. The main difference I find is that you have 1 chance to make the right decision and execute it in golf. In WoW you just wipe it up and try again.
The attention that golf gets is about a thousand times more than the attention WoW gets in the public eye. Its a no brainer. I don't see the top progression guilds or the top WoW arena teams being broadcast on national tv every week like I do golf pros. I don't see WoW players making millions of dollars from being good at WoW like i do golf pros. Look at the names in golf made famous by the public eye. Do you see any WoW players that command the attention or income of a Tiger Woods or Bubba Watson who just won the Masters??

Now as for making the right decison. WoW forces you to progress boss fights in a linear fasion in many ways. In golf, you just go on to the next hole and hope you shoot better if you messed up your last hole. Same thing with a round of golf. If you mess up your round then just go play another round the next day.

The only place i know where video games get much attention in the public eye is in Korea with their Starcraft matches being held as big events and some of the top Starcraft players are famous in Korean society. Thats South Korea, North Korea be cursed with their recent missile launch...
Cheers.
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