Do you enjoy group healing cooldowns?

90 Blood Elf Priest
10945
I just can't associate him with his PAladin. The Paladin is some kind of evil bastard child that has crept into his posts. It's an alien creature, and not Gamex.

Re: Raid CDs: With my group, it varies. The three of us healers (which, amusingly, includes the raid leader) decide between us when raid CDs should be used, but we also trust each other enough that we may blow that "oh !@#$" button early if the encounter goes a bit sideways.

I do agree his paladin is bollocks and he should be forced to post on the druid all the time.

With raid CDs my group either doesn't need them at all, or needs them at one very specific, very obvious part of the fight. I like having them there as an option when things suddenly become stupid, maybe people are a bit slow on Beth'tilac and there needs to be a Hymn in P1, that's cool with me. What is not cool with me is having parts of fights that're pretty much unhealable unless you're popping CDs one after the other. Something like Rhyolith P2, Yor'sahj YBR, Zon'ozz black phase where that thing is totally unavoidable regardless of what your group does and it demands CDs.

Oddly I'm okay with something like the last minute of Ultraxion, where if you really want to stretch it out you will need to pop some CDs but that portion of the fight is entirely avoidable. I'm not happy about having a button that must be pressed in a fight or rocks fall and everyone dies, but I am happy having a button that can be pressed in a fight or rocks fall and everyone dies.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
9730
04/28/2012 07:19 AMPosted by Audience
The whole, "stack up, spread out, repeat for 6-12 minutes" bit being used over and over again...that can die in a fire.


I sort of agree with this.

I like the stack up/spread out mechanic, just not in over saturation like it has been. I also like raid-cooldowns, just not in excessive.

Basically, I just want a healthy mix of things rather than a repetitious experience of one thing.
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100 Night Elf Druid
9410

With raid CDs my group either doesn't need them at all, or needs them at one very specific, very obvious part of the fight. I like having them there as an option when things suddenly become stupid, maybe people are a bit slow on Beth'tilac and there needs to be a Hymn in P1, that's cool with me. What is not cool with me is having parts of fights that're pretty much unhealable unless you're popping CDs one after the other. Something like Rhyolith P2, Yor'sahj YBR, Zon'ozz black phase where that thing is totally unavoidable regardless of what your group does and it demands CDs.

Oddly I'm okay with something like the last minute of Ultraxion, where if you really want to stretch it out you will need to pop some CDs but that portion of the fight is entirely avoidable. I'm not happy about having a button that must be pressed in a fight or rocks fall and everyone dies, but I am happy having a button that can be pressed in a fight or rocks fall and everyone dies.


I dunno, I think it's nice to have clear situations where some kind of cooldown is needed. It brings a nice little thing to healing where we can all collaborate and try to think of the times they'll be available and try to keep them in a good sync in multiple situations.

What I REALLY think is a bad idea, is what they had us do for rolls on H spine. We literally used glyphed frenzy, tree, volc pots, spirit link totem, and power word barrier all together just to survive the final roll of the fight. This also (to a lesser effect) happened for elementium bolt impacts on madness where 1 CD just wasn't going to cut it. That's just completely ridiculous IMO and should never be implemented ever again. Four friggin raid CDs combined with volcanic potions on healers to survive 20-30 seconds of hell (or I guess shorter if you have the most pro raid ever maybe)... what the hell were they thinking?

Also, the monk's raid CD (at least what it was about a week ago) is compleeeeeeeeeeetely overpowered, and is going to be even moreso in a 25m setting than freakin power word barrier (since things like PWB/AM/SLT in 25m is potentially 2.5x as much mitigation, and things like tranq are still almost the same healing). That is just going to be a mess unless they change that garbage. If it's still 99% when live hits...... there's just no words to describe that level of balancing fail. HOPEFULLY it has already been changed, or will be in the near future.
Edited by Gamex on 5/2/2012 11:36 PM PDT
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85 Troll Priest
12725
The whole, "stack up, spread out, repeat for 6-12 minutes" bit being used over and over again...that can die in a fire.


I sort of agree with this.

I like the stack up/spread out mechanic, just not in over saturation like it has been. I also like raid-cooldowns, just not in excessive.

Basically, I just want a healthy mix of things rather than a repetitious experience of one thing.
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Healing Forum MVP


Oh, I do think there's a place for it. I enjoy fights with lots of movement (Atramedes and Alysrazor are still my favorite post-Ulduar encounters). But the generic "everybody pile up and spam heals" bit was overused; Blizzard went way overboard with it these past couple of Tiers.

When it comes to big cooldowns, I like having them as an "oh !@#$!" button...not as a "watch the timer...okay here comes the x minute mark again...everybody remember their rotation?"
That sort of thing is what makes healing as boring as DPS. And it pains me to say that. =/
Edited by Audience on 5/5/2012 7:29 AM PDT
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90 Orc Shaman
10495
I do like the existance of healing cooldowns as a way to cope with damage in order for the raid to get through a heavy phase; but I do not like having to make a long list of cooldown rotations, which includes non-healer CDs and tank 4p, only to survive a single attack, and forcing you to call for a wipe in case someone accidentally pressed their CD at the wrong time.

Healing cooldowns should have been more of a luxury to give us some breathing space in an encounter; not something you need to stack en masse just to survive something that hits for 324123125124 damage at a time.

As for stack healing, I do like it (I'm a shaman! D:); however, FL and DS were complete opposite sides of the coin on this aspect. FL had very little tacked healing other than Beth P2 and Alys, while in DS it is STACK OR DIE. There should be a happy medium for everything. As much as Rag sucked for Shaman, I kind of liked the model of normal Rag: you had some phases were everyone was spread out, so stacked healing was not viable; but you also had to stack during seeds which needed burst healing. H Rag just made things iffy because lulz lets cover a big part of the platform in fire at all times.
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100 Night Elf Druid
15530
Sometimes I really resent cooldowns because of balance reasons and having to bring X class because they have a better cooldown for Y situation. I can think of many raid nights that have been canceled because somebody we needed didn't come (yes, in Cata) and Blizz keeps saying they want to get away from that. I can't help but think if the super powerful cooldowns were taken out then the damage/mechanics that require them would (theoretically) have to go as well.

But it sure feels good to use them at the right time. I coordinate with the other healers on my team as well as the tanks (since they have cooldowns as well) to get the group thru challenges. That's called teamwork. And sometimes (especially on progression when I know we won't get to the next phase we'll need my cooldown in) I get to use my big spell wherever I want to help the raid in order to get us a bit further, get a little closer to where we need to be. And then on farm nights I can frequently do whatever I want with it and that's fun too.
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100 Night Elf Druid
9410
Sometimes I really resent cooldowns because of balance reasons and having to bring X class because they have a better cooldown for Y situation. I can think of many raid nights that have been canceled because somebody we needed didn't come (yes, in Cata) and Blizz keeps saying they want to get away from that. I can't help but think if the super powerful cooldowns were taken out then the damage/mechanics that require them would (theoretically) have to go as well.

But it sure feels good to use them at the right time. I coordinate with the other healers on my team as well as the tanks (since they have cooldowns as well) to get the group thru challenges. That's called teamwork. And sometimes (especially on progression when I know we won't get to the next phase we'll need my cooldown in) I get to use my big spell wherever I want to help the raid in order to get us a bit further, get a little closer to where we need to be. And then on farm nights I can frequently do whatever I want with it and that's fun too.


^
Best post.
Edited by Gamex on 5/6/2012 9:56 AM PDT
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
9730
05/05/2012 07:43 PMPosted by Zyleia
But it sure feels good to use them at the right time. I coordinate with the other healers on my team as well as the tanks (since they have cooldowns as well) to get the group thru challenges. That's called teamwork. And sometimes (especially on progression when I know we won't get to the next phase we'll need my cooldown in) I get to use my big spell wherever I want to help the raid in order to get us a bit further, get a little closer to where we need to be. And then on farm nights I can frequently do whatever I want with it and that's fun too.

Agreed.
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85 Night Elf Druid
11245
05/05/2012 08:04 AMPosted by Korghal
I do like the existance of healing cooldowns as a way to cope with damage in order for the raid to get through a heavy phase; but I do not like having to make a long list of cooldown rotations, which includes non-healer CDs and tank 4p, only to survive a single attack, and forcing you to call for a wipe in case someone accidentally pressed their CD at the wrong time.


05/05/2012 07:43 PMPosted by Zyleia
But it sure feels good to use them at the right time. I coordinate with the other healers on my team as well as the tanks (since they have cooldowns as well) to get the group thru challenges. That's called teamwork.


That's the point where I get uncomfortable. At the moment, the encounter defines the correct time to use (after prior coordination), almost like a ballet presentation. But sometimes unexpected things happens (someone slips!) and even though I have tools to repair the damage I can't use them because they are so tied. I'm the person that used the CD at the wrong time (in Korghal post) but I feel awesome (like in Zyleia post) because eventually worked out. That doesn't change the fact I'll still have to take an earful.

It doesn't mean I'm not a team player. Group cds didn't change the teamwork effort, just added extra coordination that didn't existed so clearly in previous expansions. There should be room to allow use of abilities outside timed events based on individual thoughts. The lack of a raid CD shouldn't mean an automatic wipe because you recovered from a dire situation earlier.
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85 Night Elf Druid
8560
if you dont want to be told when things should be used because you think its all about you and who gives a hell about anyone else you probably shouldnt play the parts of this game that have to do with other people. Team work is a huge part of raiding and the reason why their are multiple roles. A quarter back doesnt get to make every decision he is told often what plays will be run whether thats the play he wants to use then or not. go quest alone if you dont want to be part of a team and do your part of cooperating.
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100 Night Elf Druid
9410
05/07/2012 11:44 AMPosted by Starfôx
if you dont want to be told when things should be used because you think its all about you and who gives a hell about anyone else you probably shouldnt play the parts of this game that have to do with other people. Team work is a huge part of raiding and the reason why their are multiple roles. A quarter back doesnt get to make every decision he is told often what plays will be run whether thats the play he wants to use then or not. go quest alone if you dont want to be part of a team and do your part of cooperating.


Dude starfox WAS a good game geez... we're sorry
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90 Night Elf Druid
10300
I hate this theme that has taken over WoW honestly. Stack and heal, stack and heal, stack and heal... PUKE...

I miss healing being a challenge mechanics wise too. Not just stat stacking so that your CDs put out the most healing. It would be different if like all of the healing CDs weren't simply "this heals everyone x amount over x amount of time." ... I like the pally AM because it's a damage reducer rather than a heal upper.

Would like to see more diverse and maybe not always raid wide healing CDs. One of the ONLY reasons I still log on my pally at all is because it still offers more situation specific healing options and CDs than any other healing class. I love my bubbles and 'little dude' and AM and all of that. Would love to see other healing classes have that level of 'buffing' options. I remember back in vanilla when a Pally virtually had a buff for every single person... while I don't miss the 10 minute buffing at the start of every instance I do wish there was more to be done outside of 'tranquility-like' CDs for healers.

One of my biggest negatives for my druid is that I have no specific assists. I would like to be able to have some functionality outside of group healing.
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90 Night Elf Druid
8725
My game, my way or the highway.

If someone tells me that my CDs are theirs to call the shot for, that same someone is going notice a lack of heal and expensive repair bill as I suddenly develop an attention deficit of healing him/her.


I suspect you don't raid outside of LFR.

Healing CDs are on timers. During a long fight with burts of heavy raid damage or bursts of heavy tank damage, timing A cd at the right moment improves not only your HPS/HPM, but also that of the other healers. I'll give you an example.

During the deathwing fight, on the third platform when the bolt would come out so fast it would hit the ground, causing a TON of raid damage, at the same time, a tank might be taking impale. Me popping my tranq during that time allowed my resto sham bud and disc priest bud to concentrate on focus healing anyone in danger. Phase down, only one major CD used. During the end second platform, our disc priest might have popped mana hymn to make sure we all got a mana boost for the third platform. On the 4th platform our shaman used mana tide and spirit link, again to reduce/distribute damage and boost mana.

Sure I can pop my CDs whenever I feel like, but if I don't use them wisely, bosses won't die. I don't know how other guilds work, but our resto sham raid leader and every one else will usually discuss what is going wrong and come to a consensus on how we can fix it, and that includes CD usage.
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90 Draenei Shaman
9100
My game, my way or the highway.

If someone tells me that my CDs are theirs to call the shot for, that same someone is going notice a lack of heal and expensive repair bill as I suddenly develop an attention deficit of healing him/her.


I suspect you don't raid outside of LFR.

Healing CDs are on timers. During a long fight with burts of heavy raid damage or bursts of heavy tank damage, timing A cd at the right moment improves not only your HPS/HPM, but also that of the other healers. I'll give you an example.

During the deathwing fight, on the third platform when the bolt would come out so fast it would hit the ground, causing a TON of raid damage, at the same time, a tank might be taking impale. Me popping my tranq during that time allowed my resto sham bud and disc priest bud to concentrate on focus healing anyone in danger. Phase down, only one major CD used. During the end second platform, our disc priest might have popped mana hymn to make sure we all got a mana boost for the third platform. On the 4th platform our shaman used mana tide and spirit link, again to reduce/distribute damage and boost mana.

Sure I can pop my CDs whenever I feel like, but if I don't use them wisely, bosses won't die. I don't know how other guilds work, but our resto sham raid leader and every one else will usually discuss what is going wrong and come to a consensus on how we can fix it, and that includes CD usage.


*bump* anyone who thinks that healing CDs aren't for your healing leader to call on if that's what they want doesn't obviously raid at a top level. Heroic Spine and Heroic Madness specifically REQUIRE cooldown planning and management. You can't just pop it whenever you feel like it.
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90 Night Elf Druid
8725
05/09/2012 08:43 AMPosted by Gimim
Although Holy Radiance is OP I'd give my soul for an "i win" button like Tranquility.


Talented Avenging wrath has a 1 min CD! This plus HR = You win bro!
Divine Favor 3 min CD plus HR! More You win bro!
Lay on hands - The closest thing a druid or shaman has to this is nature's swiftness and their biggest heal.

The above two talents will increase your healing and show on the meters

Aura mastery, 2 min CD - Causes your Concentration Aura to make all affected targets immune to Silence and Interrupt effects and improve the effect of Devotion Aura, Resistance Aura, and Retribution Aura by 100%. Lasts 6 sec. You can buff armor, or resistances during heavy damage phases. This is an off the meter CD but very powerful.

Hand of Sacrifice, 2 min cd - Places a Hand on the party or raid member, transferring 30% damage taken to the caster. Lasts 12 sec or until the caster has transferred 100% of their maximum health. Players may only have one Hand on them per Paladin at any one time.
6% of base mana, 30 yd range, Instant cast, 2 min cooldown. Another off the meter CD - freaking awesome when a tank is taking impales or heavy damage - when used with divine protection even awesomer.

Lets not forget you can bubble yourself and hand of protection another healer for some more off the meter damage mitigation.

I love playing my paladin so much more than my druid.
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85 Human Paladin
6300
04/27/2012 11:18 AMPosted by Erielen
Are you happy with this model? Why? What make it so exciting over the previous situational model?


Yes, I am happy with this model. Without the requirement of raidwide CDs, healing would be much less complex and fairly easy. The complexity of coordinating cooldowns is extremely dense and opens up a whole new aspect to progression raiding that was unheard of before cata. On HLK it was just AM now.. AM now... AM now... AM now... AM now. (2 holy paladin 3 rets, required for each infest before ~20% buff, usually).

Then again, I'd prefer it if we went back to wrath healing entirely. I loved spamming.
Edited by Misery on 5/9/2012 7:59 PM PDT
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85 Night Elf Druid
0
Talented Avenging wrath has a 1 min CD! This plus HR = You win bro!


Did they change it? Last I checked, it was 2 minutes talented.
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