Topic Getting away from rogues in PvP
Edited by Magicmëtal on 5/2/12 1:22 AM (PDT)
Hi! :D I have a level 70 night elf hunter (for some reason I can't post on her, she isn't showing up in the character screen on the forums). Anyway, I was wondering the best way to get away from rogues is in PvP? I try to disengage but they just shadowstep behind me again. I ice trap them but they just trinket out. Is there anything I can do to get away from them, or am I doomed to getting ganked over and over?
Edited by Farsightrx on 5/2/12 4:36 AM (PDT)
i usually counter their opener with trinket+scatter+frost trap+flare+hunter's mark asap, while trying to get an aimed shot at 10-15 yards along with the pet's claw attack.
but you never know if they'll trinket so i just counter what they do,
they are on me = master's call+ pin (in this order)
they stun me = roar of sacrifice+intervene then disengage+wing
they sprint = concussive shot (glyphed) or scatter shot in emergency
they are >15yards away trying to reach me w/o sprint = lay a frost trap behind me pretend to kite they shadow step into trap
they unexpectedly shadow step = scatter shot /or/ disengage+ maybe master's call+ /or/ trap+ maybe master's call /but/ if everything's on CD I buy time with feign death wait 1 sec shadow meld /or/ roar of sacrifice+intervene
they are <15 yards away trying to reach me= kite them into a snake trap or pin sometimes both back to back
they vanish = deterrence 0-1 secs after+ flare snake trap+ hunter's mark /or/ disengage 0-1 secs after+flare+ concussive
they smoke themself= kill command+claw+flare
if a rogue saps me at the beginning i dismount+ move pet to intervene range (charge and attack him with my pet if i spot him) if not then lay frost trap+ flare behind me wait 6 secs and get impatient then leave unless the fight starts.
and i dont serpent sting them till they are half dead so i dont break my own CC.
and I dont disengage if im already out of melee range i would do other things instead, unless i have no choice.
It's not normally wise to use your trinket on their opener.
It leaves you open to a full 5 sec kidney in their next dance or a full 8 sec blind, letting them re-open on you.
Edited by Farsightrx on 5/2/12 10:22 AM (PDT)
usually counter their opener with trinket
the trinket it self is not my counter. I trinket+scatter simultaniously so he cant re stun me but i doubt this is whatyour talking about, and i dont play rogue so i dont really understand you.
what do you do on his opener isntead? im guess'ing you RoS or is it not that big of a deal?
i do it this way cause that counter looks like it could be their nightmare. flared frozen and about to take an aimed shot to the face.
Edited by Gravy on 5/2/12 10:46 AM (PDT)
To be honest, it really comes down to who gets the opener. If a geared rogue gets the opener on you, he will win 90% of the time. You have to check the BG or RBG player list and see if there are any rogues/ferals on the opposite team and be situationally aware at all times if there are. Plant a flare and a fire trap down before engaging targets and stand on that flare/trap. If you let the steather get the opener on you, you're dead. Plain and simple.
Edited by Farsightrx on 5/2/12 10:58 AM (PDT)
the way i see it is, the more damage you avoid, the better chance of surviving you have, so i rather not eat anything i dont have to. unless the fight is looking very hopeless, that way i spawn with all my CDs.
Edited by Kelleni on 5/2/12 11:09 AM (PDT)
Farsight gave some really good advice. For duels, I win about 80% of the time against rogues because I usually get the opener by just being in camo on a flare spamming my /targetnemyplayer /cast Scatter Shot macro. This is devastating against rogues- they get scattered at the opener about 3/4 of the time. As BM I follow the scatter with an intimidation and by the time both of those pass I'm out of shadowstep range, have reapplied a flare, and just nuke him. They are in a lot of trouble then.
If he gets the opener on you, such as in world pvp then it's obviously harder, but still doable- just trinket the cheap shot or if you have a monkey you can blind him or use roar of sac. Then I like to use the same scatter-intimidation combo, often along with a disengage. Scatter-intimidation combos are really, really effective for bm. I like to use intimidation early since I know I'll be swapping for a shale spider at my first deterrence, and I don't want stuns to be on dr.
Spam hunter's mark when he's trying to cloak or vanish- lots of times it goes through.
If they pop combat readiness just try to kill time til it passes such as by scatter trapping them (with a flare down on the trap) and going cheetah form. They won't be able to cloak after using CR so you should consider using serpent sting at this point to ensure you'll bring him out of his vanish.
Feign death is really effective when a rogue shadowsteps to you- they lose target and can't kidney you or whatever they were planning to do and you can trap, disengage, or whatever. There's a brief window of opportunity with shadowstep so you need to be quick to take advantage of it. I also like to feign death if I drop a trap and the rogue cloaks over it.
I always swap pets during deterrence- usually starting with a spirit beast then swapping for a shale spider. You really just need to learn about what rogues do and then just practice fighting them. It's really a lot of fun- I'd rather fight a rogue than anyone.
Edited by Farsightrx on 5/2/12 11:15 AM (PDT)
Oh camo forgot about camo, it makes you look cool, and has some unexpected side effect on the enemy. i also wanted to say it form a BM/SV Pov but didnt wanna write too much so good stuff. & I agree monkeys are sexy when fighting rogues too.
That just seems like a waste of so many abilities all at once. Even at 70, just scatter shot and then using aimed shot saves more cooldowns than scatter-trap. Plus if they trinket scatter to stop aimed shot, then you can use your trap and use aimed shot again.
To be honest, it really comes down to who gets the opener. If a geared rogue gets the opener on you, he will win 90% of the time.
This is completely untrue. In Cata when Blizz screwed up Tracking Hidden to do absolutely nothing, every rogue and feral druid gets the opener. Any good hunter can still beat a rogue 8 time out of 10.
@OP, At level 70, you best counter would be Concussive Shot Glyph. Assuming you're Marksman, since you don't have entrapment, use ice trap mainly to make distance. Since you also don't have Master's Call, It'll be hard to really get away other than Disengage. If you can end up kiting the rogue, I recommend saving Flare to prevent vanish (since if a rogue uses vanish while standing in a flare, he is automatically revealed). Since concussive has a six second duration with a four second cooldown, you want to keep it up constantly; the glyph will make his maximum speed at 50% so that will make Sprint completely useless.
Edited by Farsightrx on 5/2/12 10:01 PM (PDT)
i scatter just to get good distance for an aimed,
i trap for the rogue poison to wear off so i dont have to waist master's call, and the rogue usually trinkets my scatter then gets trapped. if im not slowed for any reason i dont trap but on an opener your usually slowed.
if i dont flare the rogue has a habit of leaving the fight when i do this.
hunter's mark for obvious reasons and i still dont want to break my cc so why not waist this 1sec CD.
then by the time aim shot finishes his slow has worn off and i can do some easy kiting.