HGWT helps get people out into the world.

61 Human Death Knight
12740
I really would like a reasonable person to explain to me how Have Group, Will Travel is responsible for people sitting in a city all day and not going out into the world, when its usage is frequently doing just that and that sitting in a city all day has been a problem (that I'm not sure can even be fixed in an MMORPG) since vanilla.

What Have Group, Will Travel Doesn't Do:

Replace flight paths, riding, and flying.

Even in a large, 1000 person leveling guild, it's really unlikely that you're going to have a personal summoner in every zone at all times. In fact, I find myself using traditional travel most of the time. They do compliment each other very nicely, contrary to what some would have you believe.

Makes city raiding too easy

Two rogues with a warlock sneaking into the enemy city near the raid boss using stealth and invisibility potions has existed since vanilla. If you knew where to summon people at, you wouldn't be detected.

Not to mention how killing raid bosses is still a nightmare in certain cities even with the ability to instantly summon everyone. >>

What Have Group, Will Travel Does Do

Makes it easier to...

-Interact with friends and even strangers faster in the world.
-Assemble groups for city raids and world bosses.
-Do holiday events.
-Do player-made events.
-Get to areas to farm items.
-Do achievements.
-Do old dungeons.

Yes, that's right. There are -plenty- of people who use HWGT for reasons beyond getting to a raid faster.

Let's be honest. I'm going to see as much of the game getting summoned to, say, Aerie Peak as I am going to see if I'm AFK on a flight path to Aerie Peak. The former just lets me get there and have fun faster and minimizes downtime.

Then why are people in cities all the time?

Because for the most part, there's no reason to leave. The solution is to add more things that will encourage us to go out into Azeroth, not take away things.

Plus, nobody is holding a gun to your head and telling you to HGWT.
Edited by Caristinn on 4/28/2012 11:34 PM PDT
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90 Human Warlock
12950
I love HGWT, especially for my lowbie alts.

I've already done all this exploring stuff... & when I want a friend to go join me somewhere, it's much easier than spending ages going by land to get somewhere. x_x

Plus being a Warlock it's always been my job to rush out & get there first to summon people. I enjoyed being able to be summoned without rushing to get ready if it was a last minute invite!
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90 Dwarf Warlock
17395
I wouldn't be upset with HGWT if they simply let Warlocks summon without other people.
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61 Human Death Knight
12740
04/28/2012 11:43 PMPosted by Awkward
I wouldn't be upset with HGWT if they simply let Warlocks summon without other people.

I'm really not thinking this would be a good idea, seeing as how Warlocks are one of the least played classes in the game.
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90 Human Warlock
12950
04/28/2012 11:43 PMPosted by Awkward
I wouldn't be upset with HGWT if they simply let Warlocks summon without other people.


I would be quite happy if this could happen.
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90 Human Warlock
12950
04/28/2012 11:50 PMPosted by Sophex
I start to stroll on by thinking about what a pain this is, but on my way to his questing area, I see this one amazing looking pond. It was filled with all these pink flowers, and it looked just amazing. I had to hop off my mount and explore that area for just an extra couple minutes. If HGWT was in the game, I would not have come across that wonderful pond.


& then you will see that pond over, & over, & over again until it becomes just another part of the OMG I'VE SEEN IT ALREADY! LET ME GO FASTER! type things.

I love exploring on my main here. She has the maxed flying, plus the 310, plus guild speeds.

Being able to move around quickly & explore little things when they can't kill you in the face? Fun!

Having to re-travel everywhere on land or with a slow flyer without summons when I've seen all this stuff before? Boring.
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61 Human Death Knight
12740
I think it's more of get people to explore the world. I'll share with you one of my MoP beta experiences with this.

I was off questing somewhere at the bottom of the map, when my buddy asks me to come look at something where he is questing. I say, "Sure, can you summon me?" and he says, "Dude, no summons. remember?"

I start to stroll on by thinking about what a pain this is, but on my way to his questing area, I see this one amazing looking pond. It was filled with all these pink flowers, and it looked just amazing. I had to hop off my mount and explore that area for just an extra couple minutes. If HGWT was in the game, I would not have come across that wonderful pond.

Just one of my personal stories, and with only a couple days of playing MoP and already finding a good reason for not having HGWT, I can say that I will personally be glad that it is leaving us.

Not everyone wants to just explore the world for the sake of seeing things, though. And to be blunt, a lot of us think that Azeroth looks outdated when compared with other recent games. That isn't Blizzard's fault, as they need to tone down the graphics to appeal to the most players, and they're also restricted by the rather old game engine.

And doesn't removing HGWT go against the overall design philosophy of Mists of Pandaria, which can be boiled down to "Every player is different. Give them options to have fun."? We're not being given the option of not-exploring.

Also, that pond is probably going to elicit feelings of "meh" after you see it a couple hundred times.


& then you will see that pond over, & over, & over again until it becomes just another part of the OMG I'VE SEEN IT ALREADY! LET ME GO FASTER! type things.

Beat me to it. q_q
Edited by Caristinn on 4/28/2012 11:57 PM PDT
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It's like the old saying goes, "The best part of the trip is the journey." Getting from point A to point B isn't seeing the virtual world, it's just teleporting
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61 Human Death Knight
12740
04/29/2012 12:35 AMPosted by Kazakar
It's like the old saying goes, "The best part of the trip is the journey." Getting from point A to point B isn't seeing the virtual world, it's just teleporting

Except I'm having more fun at my destination than getting there, and who are you to tell me (and millions of others) otherwise? Does it negatively impact you?

I do not see anything rewarding about me running to a flight master, clicking on my destination, and then alt tabbing to do something interesting out of game.
Edited by Caristinn on 4/29/2012 12:42 AM PDT
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100 Gnome Mage
14955
I think it's more of get people to explore the world. I'll share with you one of my MoP beta experiences with this.

I was off questing somewhere at the bottom of the map, when my buddy asks me to come look at something where he is questing. I say, "Sure, can you summon me?" and he says, "Dude, no summons. remember?"

I start to stroll on by thinking about what a pain this is, but on my way to his questing area, I see this one amazing looking pond. It was filled with all these pink flowers, and it looked just amazing. I had to hop off my mount and explore that area for just an extra couple minutes. If HGWT was in the game, I would not have come across that wonderful pond.

Just one of my personal stories, and with only a couple days of playing MoP and already finding a good reason for not having HGWT, I can say that I will personally be glad that it is leaving us.


Dude! I would have already had that parceled out in beachfront property lots. A) you would see that area anyway as you quested through there, B) you are leaving your friend waiting while you are lolligagging around lookin at the flowers (/_-)
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85 Human Death Knight
10860

I do not see anything rewarding about me running to a flight master, clicking on my destination, and then alt tabbing to do something interesting out of game.


I think I am happy at the removal of HGWT because I want to see that mentality gone. I want to see more of the player who wants to exist in a virtual azeroth, and not just have this task-master ideal of just hopping quest to quest. It feels very soulless and consoley to me.

Instead of seeing travel as something "not interesting" blizzard should foster the kind of ideal where travel lets you see cool things and stuff to see. Is part of that blizzards job to make the world interesting? You betcha. But this "I want everything to be super convenient so I can chomp through the content like I am playing a console game." leaves a sour taste in my mouth. People always talk about trying to recapture that magic when they first started wow, and I feel that stuff like HGWT can be detrimental to that goal. That being said, If HGWT had a much longer cd, say 12 hours, I could support its return.
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61 Human Death Knight
12740
Instead of seeing travel as something "not interesting" blizzard should foster the kind of ideal where travel lets you see cool things and stuff to see. Is part of that blizzards job to make the world interesting? You betcha. But this "I want everything to be super convenient so I can chomp through the content like I am playing a console game." leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

World of Warcraft has never been a game about taking things slow, and most content has always been at end-game. There's no reason HGWT should be removed. If you think it's soulless, don't use it. Top RPGs have done fast travel since '94. However, a lot of people don't use it. Why? Because in those RPGs, there's a benefit to not doing so.

There is no benefit to avoiding fast travel in WoW.
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85 Human Death Knight
10860
04/29/2012 01:55 AMPosted by Caristinn
Instead of seeing travel as something "not interesting" blizzard should foster the kind of ideal where travel lets you see cool things and stuff to see. Is part of that blizzards job to make the world interesting? You betcha. But this "I want everything to be super convenient so I can chomp through the content like I am playing a console game." leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

World of Warcraft has never been a game about taking things slow, and most content has always been at end-game. There's no reason HGWT should be removed. If you think it's soulless, don't use it. Top RPGs have done fast travel since '94. However, a lot of people don't use it. Why? Because in those RPGs, there's a benefit to not doing so.

There is no benefit to avoiding fast travel in WoW.


I presented a compromise: 12 hour HGWT. It allows people to use fast travel but not abuse it. Its there for raids and helping friends, but not so often that It replaces in-game travel and forcing, yes forcing, people out into the wilds to engage the world. It feels like you play this game the way I go about shopping: Quick in, quick out, minimal time to stop and enjoy anything. Targets, goals and back home when done.
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90 Blood Elf Warlock
10675
04/28/2012 11:24 PMPosted by Caristinn
Even in a large, 1000 person leveling guild, it's really unlikely that you're going to have a personal summoner in every zone at all times.

HGWT was never meant to replace all travel. Also, why did you make your own thread about this? Tired of getting shot down and made a fool in the other thread?

-Interact with friends and even strangers faster in the world.
-Assemble groups for city raids and world bosses.
-Do holiday events.
-Do player-made events.
-Get to areas to farm items.
-Do achievements.
-Do old dungeons.

Yes, that's right. There are -plenty- of people who use HWGT for reasons beyond getting to a raid faster.

None of which gets people out of the city prior to being summoned. You're using strawmen as the basis of your argument. You did the same thing in the other thread.

04/29/2012 01:55 AMPosted by Caristinn
World of Warcraft has never been a game about taking things slow, and most content has always been at end-game.

Don't presume to speak for everyone. The most awesome aspect of WoW is that can be many things to many people. Just because you think everything is rush rush rush doesn't mean everyone does.
Edited by Sintestra on 4/29/2012 2:17 AM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Warlock
10675
Top RPGs have done fast travel since '94. However, a lot of people don't use it. Why? Because in those RPGs, there's a benefit to not doing so.

There is no benefit to avoiding fast travel in WoW.

This isn't a positive for HGWT. It's a negative for the game world in general. What you're saying is that HGWT is just covering up the lack of content for max levels to partake of outside the city. Scenarios are supposedly going to counter this (skeptical monkey is skeptical, though).
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61 Human Death Knight
12740
04/29/2012 02:16 AMPosted by Sintestra
HGWT was never meant to replace all travel.

Then why are people acting like it's the end of all times and actually does?

Also, why did you make your own thread about this? Tired of getting shot down and made a fool in the other thread?

Because people don't read the full thread when replying to a thread and I'm not going to type up my paragraphs long posts every time someone replies.

04/29/2012 02:16 AMPosted by Sintestra
None of which gets people out of the city prior to being summoned.

And what is the problem with this? Let's say that I want to get from Ironforge to the Plaguelands. The zone I want to get is the Plaguelands, and I'm not interested in the zones on the way there. I do, however, by coincidence, have a friend who is in the Plaguelands, and now I'm presented with two options.

1) I hop on a flight path, and go AFK.
2) HGWT there and do what I want to do.

If we're looking at semantics here? Technically, using the flight path will make you "see" more of the world on a predetermined, constant path. However, this carries the implication that people are actually going to be looking at their screen while on a flightpath. At best, they'll be talking to their friends if they're a more social person (and looking at a chatbox). It's also really hard to see anything in detail due to the altitude. A HGWT summon will let me get where I want to be faster if someone is in the area I need to go and will maximize fun.

No matter how you slice it, it does get people out in the world. It just isn't taking them as much time as you want it to take them.

You're using strawmen as the basis of your argument. You did the same thing in the other thread.

You might want to look up the definition of strawmanning. Or you could look to your own side and see legitimate strawmanning, ad hominem, and people under the impression correlation implies causation.

Don't presume to speak for everyone. The most awesome aspect of WoW is that can be many things to many people. Just because you think everything is rush rush rush doesn't mean everyone does.

You're welcome to find me how many players refuse to use fast travel. The amount of people that use HGWT and summons will prove in the favor that more people want "less traveling and AFK time, more doing."

I'm also not speaking for everyone. If you want to see people speaking for everyone, take a look at the amount of players saying "If you stop and smell the roses you'll have more fun!" If the goal of Mists of Pandaria is to appeal to the most amount and most diverse of players, should we not keep HGWT to present an option to players who want to get around a bit faster, and the people who want to take it slower can opt not to use it?

I haven't found an explanation why the solution of HGWT (if it can be seen as a problem in the first) is not to just not use it. If your raiding guild is "forcing" you (how silly, just fly to the raid before it starts), why not form a guild with like-minded people? Or would the number of people in the guild not be enough to start a raid?

This isn't a positive for HGWT. It's a negative for the game world in general. What you're saying is that HGWT is just covering up the lack of content for max levels to partake of outside the city. S

It's not a direct positive for HGWT, but it is a positive on the side of pro-keeping, as people mistakenly think that it's responsible for the lack of things to do in the world.
Edited by Caristinn on 4/29/2012 9:10 AM PDT
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