Griefers & LFR - Blizz please respond

100 Night Elf Priest
20370
Dear Developers -

It seem in the down time of people waiting for a new expansion, griefing LFR is becoming a popular past time. I personally, have not seen much done to prevent nor deter this. Its getting old and frankly, YOU at blizzard need to do something to put this to a stop.

Just last nite, while tanking 2nd half of DS with a guildie as off tank - a group of 4 people from Greymane decided to grief our raid. It was 2 priests, a rogue and a mage. Each of the priests use Leap of Faith to pull a tank behind the boss and off the cliff. Then after the raid wiped due to no tanks, the rogue rezes' the group on the ledge underneath the boss. Somehow they also managed to restart the event before we could get all 4 kicked so that when we pulled again, because they bugged it to where as soon as we pulled - we had twilight eruption because nobody was in the twilight realm upon pull- so we died again. So, we experience 2 repair bills and a good 20 mins of wasted time because this group of 4 people thought this would be fun. Please go check my logs for Medivac's Ultraxion run last week. BUT many in the raid submit tickets about this. Most of which your GM's will not even accept the ticket because they are unaware u have to click thier name to report and we can not do that once they have been removed from the raid. But even the ones that are accepted - nothing substantial is being done. If GM"s look back at the logs and see it was a blatant attempt to wipe the raid - WHY are you not coming down on them with a ban hammer. OR find a way to ban players from LFR for several weeks. I guarentee you, you come down hard on those who are doing this stuff intentionally, we might really start to see people not wanting to do this. I am starting to AVOID LFR now - its not fun. You are letting people who are not healers que up as heals to reduce thier que times which often only wipes the raid due to lack of heals. This damn PVP gear allows people already who do not pull thier weight to get in. I have 9 85s who can go into LFR. Between all the LFR's I have been in - I have seen a LOT of griefers doing downright intentional things to kill people. I zoned into a first half a week ago - only to find a shadow priest was running and gathering as many mobs as possible to bring back to the raid before morchock to kill everyone. Some people died several times because as long as they stayed in combat, she was unkickable. Almost every time I do run into people doing these I have submitted tickets - but I admit I am starting to feel like its not worth it - you guys are not listening. THIS IS NOT A PROBLEM THAT CAN WAIT TO BE FIXED WITH NEXT EXPANSION!

So, Please Blizzard - FIRMLY address this problem with griefing and people quing for roles they are not doing (Tanks or dps queing as healers but not actually healing). Also, even though you have added a new report system - you NEED to add griefing as a category. Most people look at the choices and cheating or name is not really an appropriate category >.>
Would love a Blue if u have information about anything being done about this. Thanks.
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100 Night Elf Priest
13225
I assume you're reporting these people for [physical] harassment. Unfortunately, Blizzard can't tell you what's being done with regards to their account. Keep in mind Blizzard uses a penalty volcano; while some acts can result in an immediate ban, others require continuous activities to build toward permanent removal.

It is, also, unfortunately impossible to build a foolproof system; the looting and LFG systems have been seeing tweaks since introduction, people just find new ways to grief or exploit the systems.

People actually get banned for cussing. However, there's still a lot of cussing going on. :/ Sadly, jerks will continue to be jerks.
Edited by Amaelalin on 5/3/2012 4:20 AM PDT
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92 Human Death Knight
12155
05/03/2012 04:07 AMPosted by Vazziera
Dear Developers


There are none on the support forums.

If you want to suggest changes to the LFR system you will want to post on the Dungeons and Raids forum.
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100 Night Elf Priest
20370
:)
Edited by Vazziera on 5/3/2012 7:59 AM PDT
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92 Human Death Knight
12155
Note I said support forums.

04/24/2012 05:55 PMPosted by Medearn
We members of Customer Service are not liaisons for development and cannot pass on any feedback you may have.


This is the forum you want - http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/1011645/ - Dungeons and Raids. This is the wrong one.
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100 Night Elf Priest
20370
05/03/2012 04:19 AMPosted by Amaelalin
. Keep in mind Blizzard uses a penalty volcano; while some acts can result in an immediate ban, others require continuous activities to build toward permanent removal.


The problem is - I do not think its really working as intended. Sadly, I have heard people on our server talk about how they repeatedly do things like this and "Blizz does nothing about it but a warning - even after the 20th time" Sad imo.
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100 Orc Hunter
13510
The vast majority of the griefing could be stopped if it required a majority-vote "ready check" to start a boss encounter.
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90 Troll Druid
10620
05/03/2012 10:03 AMPosted by Kathucka
The vast majority of the griefing could be stopped if it required a majority-vote "ready check" to start a boss encounter.


You mean a majority vote ready check that a bunch of people can decline, prevenying ANY progress over at least premature progress? Yeah, that'll never be abused.
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90 Draenei Death Knight
0
Just out of curiosity, did that happen after 12 mid-night Pacific / 3am Eastern? I've noticed that grief players tend to swarm out after that time. I've stopped running dungeons/LFR after mid-night Pacific time unless I convince myself that I don't mind wasting my time.
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100 Human Mage
19780
You'll never make LFR grief proof - people determined to do this will find ways. However, it would be nice to have tools to be able to tell who pulled the Morchok adds to the raid or who pulled Yor'sajh while we were still killing slimes. I feel bad for booting people on Morchok because it's too hard to tell the actual person responsible so I'm sure a lot of innocent people were booted to try and flush out the real culprit.

It seems to me that people intent on griefing will keep doing it until they get booted, and apparently they wind up tormenting other runs - I guess that's their evening's entertainment. We had one clever rogue just last night tricksing the boss to a healer to try and get them to take the blame for it. We punted the rogue and a person in the raid on that rogue's server said he was busy griefing his friend's raid now.

We need better tools to deal with griefers as well as a set of criteria for when we can boot in combat. Like if the person initiated a boss pull and isn't a tank their name is listed in chat as having pulled and they can get booted while in combat. This could be made more generic and list the name of anyone (not a tank) who aggros a new mob into combat, to handle the case of pulling Morchok adds during the boss encounter. Also if a person starts an event, that name is listed so everyone knows who started it. Just adding tools for these three scenarios would cover a majority of the griefing right there.
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100 Human Paladin
10265
What would the ramifications be if they allowed LFR kicks during combat but still not loot rolls? It seems that one big issue is they can start combat to avoid being kicked.

I suppose players would kick right before a boss' death to avoid loot competition, which of course only works because most LFR players are sheep and just accept the vote to kick to get the window off their screen.

Also allowing us to type in a kick reason in LFR would be nice. Last time I tried that you couldn't type anything in. Have they fixed that yet?
Edited by Sarvan on 5/3/2012 12:01 PM PDT
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98 Blood Elf Paladin
7050
I like the idea of stating who pulled
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100 Tauren Death Knight
12705
Recently I have found LFR unbearable due to the rampant increase of greifing. Like the OP suggested, I think people are just bored and are getting their "kicks" at the expense of other players.

To make matters worse, the new "Reporting system" is useless for reporting griefing or harassment. To those of you left without an out, as well, you can log into battle.net and still open a ticket regarding "I want to report a player for harassing behavior or conduct" and the ticket will be responded to. I've done that a couple of times recently and was assured that "the matter will be investigated and taken care of." I wish there was a better way for 25 randomly strewn together individuals to deal with an immature nuisance. :-/

I understand the need to prevent kicking during combat to prevent abuse, but honestly, for content intended to be streamlined, smooth and quick, needing 5 votes to initiate a kick and majority to confirm ALL while outside of combat is a bit unreasonable. I'm not sure about the best system for it, but if it's going to be hard to kick someone and require 5 motions and a majority vote, what's the harm with kicking during combat?
Edited by Trevalyon on 5/3/2012 1:15 PM PDT
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85 Dwarf Death Knight
17665
05/03/2012 12:02 PMPosted by Mortania
I like the idea of stating who pulled


You do an attempt, everyone's ready, you pull.
You wipe over something

"KICK BILLY HE STARTED IT"

I've seen people complain and want blood after a wipe with full groups and just standing around, when someone started spine.

Just last night "WHO PULLED, THE TANK WAS AFK!"
"HE TOLD ME IN VENT"
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100 Human Mage
19780
05/03/2012 01:47 PMPosted by Darthasane
I like the idea of stating who pulled


You do an attempt, everyone's ready, you pull.
You wipe over something

"KICK BILLY HE STARTED IT"

I've seen people complain and want blood after a wipe with full groups and just standing around, when someone started spine.

Just last night "WHO PULLED, THE TANK WAS AFK!"
"HE TOLD ME IN VENT"


I've never seen the pull person blamed for a wipe where everyone was ready and something went wrong. Granted, I always state exactly why we wiped and what the raid needs to change in order to prevent that.

It's pretty easy to tell in advance why you'll wipe - Ultra because of tanks not clicking the button properly for fading or not taunting off each other, Ship because people stood in crud, tank didn't taunt off with stacks and died, don't have brezzes to keep 2 tanks around (or my favorite, fight started without 2nd tank), Spine because of people killing tentacles and getting 5 amalgs running around, and Madness because dps can't swap targets properly or tank decides to eat 2nd impale).
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100 Tauren Death Knight
12705
05/03/2012 03:09 PMPosted by Grobin
I suggest getting several of your own guild members together and queuing for a raid. Setting up a loot gestapo or a vote kick lottery can be lots of fun. Last night we determined that the vast majority of players in LFR are completely unaware of Spine of Deathwing's primary gimmick when we managed to flip every non-Goon off of his back. We then determined that LFR Spine of Deathwing has a 15 minute enrage timer. Who would have known if there hadn't been enough Goons there to hold the raid hostage that whole time?


Wait, so let me get this right. Are you endorsing griefing LFR as a guild and citing the fun you had doing so last night?

Ugh, the mentality and complete disregard for other players people have disgusts me. I hope a Chinese gold farmer has his way with your account, sir. :-P
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90 Goblin Priest
0

Wait, so let me get this right. Are you endorsing griefing LFR as a guild and citing the fun you had doing so last night?


Yes that's right.
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85 Night Elf Hunter
1310
I've seen a HUGE increase in griefers in the last few weeks, this week it made it nearly unbearable for several of my toons getting through LFR.

From people pulling multiple add groups and the boss on Yor'saj over and over again to tanks that spin Zon'azz continually so people cannot dps properly, to people pulling side adds before Morchok to tanks that stand off to the side and do nothing on Hagara so people die from focused assault.

In each one of these cases it is 3-5 people from the same realm and they think it is absolutely HILARIOUS to do this and do not care if people get upset.

Making it even worse there is no real way to report these people because Blizzard has not implemented a reporting system that is effective for these situations.

And 99% of the time you try to kick these people but you cannot because they time it perfectly so that they get to the next set of trash before the last loot rolls are over.

All I want to do is get my toons through LFR each week and I'm getting pretty close to not going anymore at all and in fact taking a break from the game because it is upsetting to me and many other people.
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