Dethroned and kicked from guild bank

(Locked)

Around 6-10 months ago I slowly became inactive and left WOW.

During my time playing the game one of things I did was create a guild bank for myself and a few friends. Hoping to level the guild, I invited many of the guildless players on the server. Many of these players left or became inactive, but the guild slowly leveled as long as we kept inviting new players. We gave free repairs and access to some of the goods in the guild bank to create an incentive for new players to level up the guild. The guild eventually levelled to level 8; when we became inactive in world of warcraft no one opted to keep inviting daily and so guild experience stopped accruing. Now fast forward to today, when I am thinking of resubscribing.

One of the first things I did was check here what had happened to the remains of my guild. Naturally the guild has very few members (3) and all of them have been inactive for months. Now one of the things I was somewhat shocked to find was that someone had taken guild leadership of the guild in my absence. This was not someone I had known or anything of the sort. Instead it was a random stranger. Now this in itself is one small issue, since dethroning is a reality and I can understand that I was inactive for quite some time. The other shock I saw was more frustrating.

When this person gained leadership, it seems that they opted to kick everyone out of the guild. Now that I am trying to be active again, this creates big problems for me trying to gain the leadership once again, of a guild that I created and intended solely to function as a guild bank. I am now unable to dethrone the player because I do not see any of my character accounts or any of my friends' character accounts in the guild anymore.

So herein lies the problem. As of right now you can see, because I have not resubscribed and logged in, that this character is in the same guild as before. However if you go to that guild you will see that he is not listed in the roster of players. I would like to go back into the game and dethrone the guild back, but as soon as I log I am worried that this player will update and be recognized as not being a part of the guild (and thus have no claim to dethroning the guild leadership back).

Is it possible for a GM to help with this problem? The original dethroning seems almost like a guild hacking; an unassociated player took control of the guild and then kicked everyone else (and probably made 20,000+ gold from the items and gold left in the guild as well). From what I know, Blizzard has always acted against similar non-dethroning takeovers in the past.

If it was possible to retake leadership of the guild I would resubscribe today. With the new policies on dethroning, I could also avoid running into these problems next time (merely by forcing all other players to be of a super low rank, as had been my practice in this guild originally). This guild has a lot of sentimental value for me and a blue response would be much appreciated.
25 Night Elf Druid
0
You don't need 2 threads.

If you'd like ot see a change in policy then you'll want the Guild Leadership Forum
MVP - Customer Support
90 Tauren Druid
12960
If you've been removed from the guild, you cannot regain leadership of the guild without the current guild master giving it to you.

If you have not, it's possible for you to take control from an inactive guild master.
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90 Human Death Knight
10320
05/06/2012 10:41 AMPosted by Softknuckle
I would like to go back into the game and dethrone the guild back, but as soon as I log I am worried that this player will update and be recognized as not being a part of the guild (and thus have no claim to dethroning the guild leadership back).


The Armory, and the web services that rely on the Armory, such as posting characters, do not always reflect current data. You are either in the guild or not, and that can only be determined via being in the game, not via the web site.

05/06/2012 10:41 AMPosted by Softknuckle
Is it possible for a GM to help with this problem?


No. If you are no longer a member of the guild, you have zero rights to that guild.

The only way you can get the guild back is if you are still a member of the guild in the game and the dethrone option is available to your guild rank.
This is the problem:

- You can see right now that I am in the guild "Desperate Hordewives" from this website
- If you go to the guild, I no longer appear on the roster

I would like to be placed back in the guild so that I can dethrone back the leadership (if i logged in right now, I believe I would no longer have proof that I was ever in the guild).

You don't need 2 threads.

If you'd like ot see a change in policy then you'll want the Guild Leadership Forum


This post is completely unrelated to the other post. I cannot access the Guild Leadership forum because I have not resubscribed yet (getting support on this issue is what is delaying my decision at the moment).
MVP - Customer Support
90 Tauren Druid
12960
05/06/2012 10:48 AMPosted by Softknuckle
I would like to be placed back in the guild


Unfortunately, this is not something that the GMs can do for you. If you were removed from the guild, you must ask somebody currently in the guild to re-invite you.
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25 Night Elf Druid
0
05/06/2012 10:48 AMPosted by Softknuckle
I would like to be placed back in the guild so that I can dethrone back the leadership


Not going to happen.

05/06/2012 10:48 AMPosted by Softknuckle
This post is completely unrelated to the other post.


My bad.
05/06/2012 10:50 AMPosted by Pahanda
I would like to be placed back in the guild


Unfortunately, this is not something that the GMs can do for you. If you were removed from the guild, you must ask somebody currently in the guild to re-invite you.


Again, no one remaining the guild has been active for ~3 months+.

If I had known that dethroning was commonplace when I was leaving, I would have gladly kicked everyone from the guild before my inactivity. Now because a player had the foresight to do so, the guild bank that I originally created will remain forever inactive. That doesn't really seem fair IMO
25 Night Elf Druid
0
05/06/2012 10:52 AMPosted by Softknuckle
Again, no one remaining the guild has been active for ~3 months+


The GL last logged on 4/28/2012

Its his Guild now, not yours.

Sorry
MVP - Customer Support
90 Tauren Druid
12960
Unfortunately, even if every single person in the guild is inactive, the Game Master staff cannot re-add you to the guild. It's simply not something that their policies permit.
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"As with other situations, the key seems to be giving Jayne a heavy stick and standing back." -- Inara
Sigh, I guess the system has several ironies then.

If I was hacked and my guild leadership taken away, given to someone else, and kicked from the guild, Blizzard would step in and reinstate my leadership even if I had gone inactive in the interim.

If I went inactive but allowed any remaining players to use my guild bank and get free repairs then I have no recourse being kicked from my own guild and having my guild leadership taken from me.
90 Blood Elf Hunter
10805
Much like Alanis Morisette, you're definition of irony is a bit off. Two completely different situations. One is an in game mechanic and totally intended. The other is an account compromise.

Unfortunately, since you do not currently have an active account, you cannot post suggestions in the correct Forum. If you decide to come back, start up another guild, but remember this for the future should you take more time off.
MVP - Customer Support
90 Tauren Druid
12960
If I was hacked and my guild leadership taken away, given to someone else, and kicked from the guild, Blizzard would step in and reinstate my leadership even if I had gone inactive in the interim.

If I went inactive but allowed any remaining players to use my guild bank and get free repairs then I have no recourse being kicked from my own guild and having my guild leadership taken from me.


Correct. And that's because in the first case, it was not your "choice" to be compromised. Where as in the second case, it was your "choice" to be inactive and not work with your guild members to handle some sort of leadership transfer.

Currently, all three of the officers in my guild are very well aware of what to do if I should have to take a break from the game. We also have ways of getting in touch with each other out of the game, should something go drastically wrong. We all trust each other (and are all looking out for each other). In the future, should you take up a guild leadership position, I recommend planning similarly with your officers.
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If I was hacked and my guild leadership taken away, given to someone else, and kicked from the guild, Blizzard would step in and reinstate my leadership even if I had gone inactive in the interim.

If I went inactive but allowed any remaining players to use my guild bank and get free repairs then I have no recourse being kicked from my own guild and having my guild leadership taken from me.


Correct. And that's because in the first case, it was not your "choice" to be compromised. Where as in the second case, it was your "choice" to be inactive and not work with your guild members to handle some sort of leadership transfer.

Currently, all three of the officers in my guild are very well aware of what to do if I should have to take a break from the game. We also have ways of getting in touch with each other out of the game, should something go drastically wrong. We all trust each other (and are all looking out for each other). In the future, should you take up a guild leadership position, I recommend planning similarly with your officers.


It was a guild bank, not a functioning guild with officers and all. Everyone whom I invited was at a much lower rank (under new dethroning procedures they would not even be able to dethrone).

The lesson is pretty much just to wait until Blizzard smartens up before you consider using one of the game services. If I had gone inactive now, I would not be dethroned, even if I went inactive for 5 years.

It is truly shocking how zealously some players will defend Blizzard's policies.
25 Night Elf Druid
0
05/06/2012 11:17 AMPosted by Softknuckle
It is truly shocking how zealously some players will defend Blizzard's policies


Understanding them and explaining them doesn't necessarily mean defending.

There is simply NOTHING you can do.

That's what we're trying to tell you.
MVP - Customer Support
90 Tauren Druid
12960
05/06/2012 11:17 AMPosted by Softknuckle
It was a guild bank, not a functioning guild with officers and all.


If it had members, it was a "functioning" guild.

05/06/2012 11:17 AMPosted by Softknuckle
It is truly shocking how zealously some players will defend Blizzard's policies.


I don't agree with all of them. You, however, are simply refusing to accept that they exist.
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36 Blood Elf Hunter
210


Unfortunately, this is not something that the GMs can do for you. If you were removed from the guild, you must ask somebody currently in the guild to re-invite you.


Again, no one remaining the guild has been active for ~3 months+.

If I had known that dethroning was commonplace when I was leaving, I would have gladly kicked everyone from the guild before my inactivity. Now because a player had the foresight to do so, the guild bank that I originally created will remain forever inactive. That doesn't really seem fair IMO


The guild dethrone option is available for members of the guild. If you are no longer a member of the guild, you cannot dethrone.

Guild dethroning has been available for 7 years, written in the guild leader documentation on Blizzard's website. Even before the in-game option to request a dethrone, it was used so much through the ticketing system that the developers made the in-game option to free up GMs time. This in-game feature was then widely discussed last August when it announced.

It was a guild bank


No it wasn't. A bank guild has one Battlenet account as the basis for all member(s). If a guild has other people in it, it's a real functioning guild and must be treated as such.

(under new dethroning procedures they would not even be able to dethrone).

Under the new dethroning in-game mechanism they may not be able to dethrone the Guild Leader at that level, but there is still a ticketing method that allows lower ranked players to request the guild if the guild leader abandons it.

You aren't getting Guild Leader of that guild.
Edited by Alethìa on 5/6/2012 11:30 AM PDT
80 Blood Elf Paladin
7490
05/06/2012 11:17 AMPosted by Softknuckle
It is truly shocking how zealously some players will defend Blizzard's policies.


There's nothing else to be done about the current policy. It is what it is, and that's what others are telling you. If you would like to seek a change in the policy, you'll need to suggest it in the Guild Leadership Forum. However, as you indicated, you are not a subscriber. There's a reason WHY you need to be active to post there.

Now, as to "defending" this policy, yes, I personally do defend this policy. You are not a subscriber, and there's absolutely no reason that you should get to handcuff active players by abandoning your guild. This policy has been in place since the game began, but the recent change was to automate the process, so it did not take GM intervention. They have even tweaked the policy, and those tweaks are actually things that I do not agree with. But it's still the current policy, and it's the answer I will give to anyone who asks, regardless of my personal feelings.

Also, defense of one policy does not mean that I would defend all policies. But in this particular forum, it's not about "defending" or "attacking" policies. This is a place to give others the current policy, and offer clarification.
25 Night Elf Druid
0
05/06/2012 11:55 AMPosted by Madisón
You are not a subscriber, and there's absolutely no reason that you should get to handcuff active players by abandoning your guild.


Well said.

I may steal that in the future.
Support Forum Agent
I think that the thread has derailed a bit, so it's life cycle is over.

At this time, the dethroning mechanics are working as intended. I understand your concern and empathize with your situation, however, the answer the community has provided is correct and will not change.

Once your subscription is active again, you are welcome to post your feedback on the Dethroning system in Raid and Guild Leadership.
Edited by Aeyiera on 5/6/2012 12:32 PM PDT
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