Account-Wide Achievements + Rep

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Zarhym, I'm a little confused.

Why would making reputation gains account wide take away from play alternate characters? If anything, it still forces you to continue playing the same character to complete exalted reputations if that is what you like to do because they have made the most progress so far.

Looking at factions like Warsong Outriders for example. How would playing multiple toons to gain exalted reputation take away from alternate characters? To gain the Conqueror/Justicar titles for example, requires you to grind out exalted with the original 3 BG factions. I have completed this achievement on two characters, the first took me 2 years, and the second 4 years. So I am a little confused how having the option of playing any character would take away from the objective of gaining exalted status in the original BG factions. As far as I could tell, it would still take someone on the order of years to complete the objective, only this way, you get to play any character to do it. Rather than feeling cornered into one class because it has the most progress made.

Looking from a new players perspective, to gain things like what I just mentioned forces them to play the same character for extended periods of time to achieve them. If the idea is to free the player, not making factions account wide actually takes away from that. And for the more seasoned players, it just leaves them bored having to grind out reputation gains again, for the umpteenth time to collect rewards they have earned already (enchants for example).

Unless of course I am reading into this all wrong.


That's the problem. Some factions only take a day or two until you reach exalted. Some take years, but very few. Why write the system in to take those long grinds into account when there's really only a handful in the game. A better solution would be to nerf rep gains for that small number of factions slightly, but then the people who got grandfathered in would just complain endlessly.


Nerfing the time to get exalted in Warsong or AB isn't the issue. The issue is being cornered on 1 character to do it. The proposed changes to the achievement system are intended to free the player of that "cornered" feeling. Why not take the system to the full extent and grant the player the ability to work toward exalted reputation without it being a detriment to overall progress.

Making me grind an alts reputation is not making me feel like I am having fun. The shear thought of it is so negative that I wouldn't even bother to work on it because I have done it once already (or in some cases multiple times already). In the end I will neglect anything to do with rep on an alt because the time isn't worth it. That takes away from "being free to play an alt" in my opinion.
85 Human Mage
13030
05/09/2012 10:20 AMPosted by Maulee
Yes. Without any sort of rep bonus it is 1200 caps (minimum of 400 wins). I've been playing for 6 years and I'm still chewing on it (however slowly). I play too many damn alts though so it's mostly my own fault.

Keep at it!
You'll eventually get it, I did.
It feels great when you do. :)
Being generous and saying you win 50% of your matches by capping 3 flags (even though thats a <50% outcome) It would still take ~800 games to get that achievement without resorting to pre-mades. If each game is about 20 minutes, thats an estimate time of completion of 266 hours of warsong gulch, or 6 full work weeks.

The grey achievement looks pretty good to me.
85 Draenei Shaman
2675
Once upon a time their was a brave warrior..now this warrior was not like any other for you see he fought with two handed wepaons and not just one. Warriors were know to train hard and vicousley in the ancient technique fighting style known as arms.This fightin style was to be the most effective and never questionable in defeating ones enemies. But one day a strange warrior oddly small and never quiet could fit fully in his armour questioned the method of the arms fighting style. Because of this he was banned from the school of Strength never to be seen again. The years went past and the months grew colder. Outside the school of strength was nothing but wildenress where the warrior was surely to die alone in the cold. One day as the abandond warrior was walking with his one handed weapon slung over his shoulder he noticed a sharp stray sword laying in the mists of the snow. The weary warrior wanting to support his weight even further while walking thought that by picking up the sword he would be able to use both weapons as crouches. But when the warrior picked up the sword he felt something strange their was a unexplanaible surge of eneregy fueld with pure rage. Ths energey coarsing though the warriors body looking for an exit resulted in the warrior shouting to the heavens shaking the very core of the earth underneath his feet. The warrior feeling as though he had the strength off ten druid bears heroic leaped into the sky. As the warriors feet touched down back to earth their lay a crater the size of a falling comet. Ten years later a young boy and his mother crossed this path and saw the crater from years ago. The boy asked"mother what is this hole"? The mother replied " This is where the legendary fury warrior was born my son."
90 Undead Priest
21580
I strongly disagree with the belief that making reputation account-wide would detract from the gameplay of having an alt. Alts are there to provide a different gameplay experience, not just a repeat of an old grind. Reputation, by and large, is what you get as a reward for gameplay - it does not generally supply the gameplay itself. As a reward, reputation can give you a mount, a title, and better repair fees. Sometimes weapons and armor (and enchants which, by and large, are BoA already). But reputation doesn't normally change how you play the game on any character. Your class, spec, guild-mates, and chosen gear orientation (PvE or PvP) have a lot more to do with that. I think making reputations account-wide would benefit the game. If it comes down to wanting alts to seem different, then I think reputation is an arbitrary and ineffective area to do that. Reputations are not something other players typically look at, and the player isn't constantly bringing up their reputation bars to remind themselves of the differences in their characters.

It takes a long time to earn reputations to exalted. People are usually getting rep with many factions in a new expansion. I just don't see how it makes the alt feel more enjoyable to have to re-grind a faction because you switched out of your previous character (something particularly irritating if you wanted a change of pace with your class but were mid-stream in earning reputation with a current raid faction).

Previously I said that reputations don't normally change how you play the game. There are a few exceptions to this I can think of, such as the Bloodsail pirate faction grind. That turns the Booty Bay goblins into a hostile faction. The Oracle - Wolvar factions are another case of this. Perhaps that would be one area you would want to leave unlinked.

As an alternative suggestion, here's another idea: What if the achievements associated with getting Exalted in a faction unlocked a perk reward with that faction across the account, multiplying reputation gains by 10 or something like that. So, instead of gaining 250 rep for a character doing the grind a second time, that character can gain 2500 rep. Something to make the characters experience the faction a little bit again, but not subjecting them to the same exalted grind they had to go through the first time.
Edited by Torvald on 5/9/2012 1:00 PM PDT
90 Human Warrior
15335
Will the pvp transmogs be available to all toons if you've gotten the old pvp system achivement on one toon?
90 Worgen Death Knight
5530
The only reputation i want to be account wide would be Guild rep....
- Double the cap
- only have same guild reputation sync.
This is the only one that i find pointless to have to do over and over and over.....
81 Dwarf Paladin
4485
Excuse me Zarhym if you are still monitoring this what about the achievement "What a long strange trip its been" it that one is account wide with the rewards go to everyone?
85 Human Priest
7390
Does that mean there won't be a Therazane style rep where you have to do 2/3 of a zone just to unlock it?

That would make me very, very happy.


THIS
90 Undead Priest
17085
Zarhym,

As long as Blizzard is revamping the achievement system, how about resolving the Horde-Alliance achievement point issue while you're at it? At present, Alliance is capable of earning 20 more points than Horde can (by virtue of two additional 10-point achievements required for Loremaster of the Eastern Kingdoms). This could be easily resolved by simply increasing the point reward for Loremaster of EK for Horde players by 20 points.

Thanks!
85 Human Rogue
11710
so someone who plays all 11 toons all day, gets exulted in 11 times the speed of someone who plays 1?

no.
Edited by Achickenbone on 5/9/2012 12:52 PM PDT
85 Gnome Warrior
6770
Rep, mounts, pets, professions, everything.

A character is just a character, not a class. Each character has 3 slots to choose any of the 3 specs from each of the classes.

Slot #1 - Protection Warrior
Slot #2 - Disc Priest
Slot #3 - BM Hunter

Therefore you can have your favourite classes combined into one toon retaining all your hard earned goodies.
85 Night Elf Druid
6580
Repetitive grinds are not good gameplay. I've switch mains a few times and always dread getting my reputations back. I've just switched back to my druid after years on my warrior. Doing this loses me my Zandalar rep, which I'm kind of sad about.

I do understand some of the reasons why account wide rep would be bad. An alt getting to cap would have access to all the rep gear immediately for example. Maybe an imbalance of those who have more time to grind rep out using multiple characters making those who do not feel like they are missing out. But I think there are probably very simple solutions to these issues, like daily caps.

Alts should be fun because you enjoy playing the class and the activity you are doing.
85 Night Elf Druid
0
We don’t want to make reputation account-wide. We think that removes too much of the gameplay of having an alt. Harkening back to the blog, the goal is for players to feel free to play their alts. If you have a cool mount on character A, then that might be an issue. Being exalted on character A so that enchants are easier to buy doesn’t seem like the same issue. (What I mean is, it’s a short step from there to saying character A has better gear so you aren’t going to play B).

We can understand where the desire to have reputations function in this way stems from, however. For this reason faction rep is going to work a little differently in Mists of Pandaria and, we think, will feel better for players with multiple characters.


Frankly, Zarhym, I'm surprised by this response. I've figured for awhile now that Blizzard considered reputation as an outdated mechanic as a lot of the rest of us did. Hence why you give it away so easily as compared to previous expansions. Nowadays you gain a lot of rep passively, and it doesn't seem like a choice so much as an eventuality; I have to confess that I can't conceive of the argument for reputation gain being an interesting mechanic, and that's coming from someone who has 52 reps at exalted, and is almost done with Bloodsail, before I begin to rebuild my Goblins.

When I play my alt DK, rogue, or priest and I see rep gains (in dungeons or from quests) I see them as more of a nuisance than exciting...

I know the developers are still very early in the iteration process so far, and I am interested to see how "rep is going to work a little differently in Mists of Pandaria", but I was really hoping that character-biased reputation was on its way out.
75 Worgen Druid
6545
05/09/2012 12:16 PMPosted by Jinxette
We don’t want to make reputation account-wide


FAIL

What is the point than? I mean really. Waste of F'ing time. Once again. Blizzard only goes half way. This is the exact reason blizzard fails on so many levels. They have this wonderful idea. But instead they decide that nope, your alt can NOT have rep. It is your account, you grinned out on your main. Why on earth would you not let your alts have it? It DOES NOT make sense. Rep is rep its access to BOA. enchants, recipes, and so on. I am so tired of farming Deepholm on my alts to get end game shoulder enchants. Please Blizzard for the love of all MMOs please allow this to be on all your alts. IT DOES NOT CHANGE GAME PLAY. You will be playing an alt no matter. IN FACT, you will be playing your alt MORE if you didn't have to worry about stupid REP. Get it? Geez not that hard.


they make you log in to grind rep and to grind rep you have to have a sub fee, the longer the sub fee for the time you are grinding all that rep..

its a business, they made the game so that people will pay to play, its about money in the pocket

havent you figured that out yet?

i mean really i bet people like you figure since you pay a sub fee that it entitles you to free max level toon any darn time you want.

amiright?
100 Human Mage
11485
05/08/2012 05:15 PMPosted by Zarhym
We don’t want to make reputation account-wide. We think that removes too much of the gameplay of having an alt.


To my mind, this seems to work against encouraging players to roll alts. Grinding rep is not the sort of "gameplay" I look forward to on a new character. I'm not sure the word "gameplay" even applies.
90 Dwarf Warrior
12320


Because people would be exalted in a day or two.


That depends on how much rep would be awarded per kill. If it was 1 rep, it would take a VERY long time to get to exalted.


BG bots. They're used too much already. This would make them used more. Also why BGs don't give gold.
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