Souldrinker

85 Blood Elf Paladin
8270
Looking at the loot tables, there are four possibilities:

1: Blizzard decided Crit was a tanking stat, and Hand of Morchok is the tanking weapon this tier.

2: Souldrinker, with a proc that is most effective, in terms of damage dealt and secondary effect, for tanks, is the intended tanking weapon this tier.

3: Somebody forgot to inform the itemization team that Agility no longer grants Dodge, and No'Kaled is the intended tanking weapon (considering it's limited to rogues and shaman in LFR, this is unlikely)

4: Blizzard decided shield tanks were a bunch of whiners and said "Screw 'em all" and didn't give us a tanking weapon this tier.

Forget everything else and apply a bit of thought and see which of the four you decide is right.


Once again Zap is the voice of reason =)
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
18325
The Frost DK, who is actually the raid leader, in my DS 10man basically said he wants souldrinker and the Hand of Morchok and that i need to roll on stuff for my position. Not really sure what he meant by that.

As far as I see it I'm not getting a new weapon until Panda so screw it.


That means that you roll on both as well.
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90 Human Paladin
12665
Both HoM and SD are good for warrior/pally tanks and frost DK's. If I were the loot master, any of them could roll on it for the first one, and the next one that drops would go to the other (if they were both showing up regularly). HoM isn't ideally itemized for tanking, but it is still better than SD for some situations (and optimizing CTC).
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
8270
I got my HoM using an offspec roll. I refused to need roll on a weapon with crit =P
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90 Human Paladin
12665
I got my SD because the only other person who could use it already had one. Same for the shoulders - they didn't even ask me to roll.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
8270
I really think blizz needs to change the way they do weapons.

I think they should make all weapons either as:

AP/hit or exp/2ndary stat

Or

SP/2ndary caster stat/2ndary caster stat.

Get rid of tank weapons and the division between agility and str weapons. Melee use AP weapons, caster sp weapons. Str dps/blood dks can use polearms again and agility users can get whatever weapon type is str only (if there is one).

A weapon for only 2 specs is pretty dumb anyways and dks/druids also use dps weapons. Just get rid of tank weapons altogether.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
14460
I've never had HoM drop while I've been present.

Worse even, never seen the tank ring drop ever.
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85 Draenei Shaman
5500
I don't play as DPS, so serious question. Why would a DPS want Souldrinker? Does the Strength from the higher iLevel make up for the lack of secondary stats? Is the proc any good for DPS?
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90 Human Paladin
7930
05/10/2012 02:03 PMPosted by Feanorion
Is that viable? Competitive? Superior? First I've heard of it.
Superior. But you (1) need to know your RE gaming, like Blood DKs used to do, (2) need the gear to support it--410 it's clearly ahead, but that's because you need so much mastery, (3) secondarily, weapons.

Unclear whether it's better in 384 gear, and I'm starting to go into speculation.

From what I understand--I could be wrong--DW is required for all of the KM procs, but 2h prefers mastery-Frost, due to all of the RP it can't spend if runes regen too quickly. But 2h is behind both 2h unholy and DW Frost, without question, even if played correctly.
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85 Night Elf Druid
8710
05/10/2012 11:58 AMPosted by Redshiftja
If i were a Loot Master, what role would I prioritize for rolls?


As someone that raid leads and is the loot master for my guild if it drops i allowed the frost DK and the prot warrior to both roll for it same for HOM, and if the prot warrior one HOM which dropped first souldrinker went to the frost DK.
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85 Human Paladin
7460
Does the Strength from the higher iLevel make up for the lack of secondary stats? Is the proc any good for DPS?


I've noticed from running simcraft that more desirable secondary stats usually range from .90-ish to maybe 1.89-ish while strength is pushing at least 3.50-ish for stat weights.

Couple that with the higher top end damage and a proc that adds a little more survival and damage... I'm thinking that it does edge out the other option from DS for Frost DKs even if only because of ilevel.

Blizzard probably just likes to cause friction between dps and tanks. Remember in WotLK it was friction between Hunters and Melee? Because Polearms and axes had AP and agility worked for str based melee.

Souldrinker is 50/50 for tanking vs DPS both have equal claim.

HoM is 40-45/55-60 for tanking versus dps respectively because crit isn't really that great for tanking but other than that everything can be used by tanks and you can reforge some of the crit to avoidance.
Edited by Fangthane on 5/11/2012 1:13 PM PDT
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90 Draenei Paladin
12425
05/11/2012 09:20 AMPosted by Paintbrush
If i were a Loot Master, what role would I prioritize for rolls?
The checks this tier are by far DPS/healing checks; unless your current progression fight is H Blackhorn, prioritize your DPS.


There are DPS checks at 20% nerf? =P

[quote]Blizzard probably just likes to cause friction between dps and tanks. Remember in WotLK it was friction between Hunters and Melee? Because Polearms and axes had AP and agility worked for str based melee.

Souldrinker is 50/50 for tanking vs DPS both have equal claim.

HoM is 40-45/55-60 for tanking versus dps respectively because crit isn't really that great for tanking but other than that everything can be used by tanks and you can reforge some of the crit to avoidance.


Yeah, there is no doubt that HoM is a dps weapon first, and a tank weapon second. This isn't making any claim on how good it is for those specs, but just there's no denying it IS a dps weapon with dps stats on it, that happens to be very good for tanks. Souldrinker on the other hand, its really hard to say that the effects on it speak to one role or the other. I guess you could say that the fact that it heals shifts it a bit in tank's favor, but the fact is it's still adding to damage, so /shrug.

If they had just added a 397/410 tank weapon to the earlier bosses, we could happily grab that, dps could happily grab HoM, and then we could feel completely justified in rolling 50/50 for Souldrinker, but blizz likes to see us squirm =P

Edit: That being said, I feel like its completely fair for a loot master to either treat both weapons as tank/dps weapons, or count HoM as DPS and Souldrinker as tank (or vice versa if you prefer). Treating HoM as a DPS first weapon and then Souldrinker as 50/50 is a bit ridiculous imo.
Edited by Xanrael on 5/11/2012 2:23 PM PDT
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
9580
05/11/2012 09:00 AMPosted by Jahoota
I don't play as DPS, so serious question. Why would a DPS want Souldrinker? Does the Strength from the higher iLevel make up for the lack of secondary stats? Is the proc any good for DPS?


The strength does not compensate for the lack secondary stat but the proc does. The consensus is that Souldrinker does not have an internal cooldown. This means that haste based dual wielding frost DKs will get lots and lots of procs. The procs add up and can contribute quite a bit of damage.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
14460
We've been trying for Heroic Morchok every week. If Hand of Morchok does drop, would it be better than Souldrinker?
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
14460
Heard it depends on the fight though.

If it's a fight with little movement, like Ultraxion, Souldrinker is supposedly better.`
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90 Human Paladin
12665
You can swap weapons in mid-fight for movement/still phases, so it's nice to have both options.
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