The Future of PvP in Mists of Pandaria

90 Troll Druid
11620
Is anything changing with Arenas?

Tom Chilton
- Yes, actually. Players will be able to see their opponent’s class and specialization before the match begins. They won’t be able to see the specific talent choices or glyphs being used, however. From there, it’s a bit like playing poker. You won’t know what exact abilities your opponent is using, but you’ll be able to modify your own talents in the staging area before the match starts to try to anticipate what they could be using.


Rogues, Ferals, and 'some' Mages will be screaming and kicking. I have no sympathy for rogues and mages anymore, but feral doesn't deserve that. (#)'s

I strongly disagree with this idea. You may already tell, to an extent, what the other team has right off the start. Knowing what buffs are active, and which specc they belong to, is plenty of heads-up for coming up with a strat against the other team. Players know what do if we get "this team" and what to do against "that team." Sure it's not perfect, but there's absolutely no reason why the element of surprise should be removed from Arena.

"What do we have....it's...RMP." --- Encourage players to learn the game, not rely on the UI to tell them everything.
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90 Gnome Warrior
13000
Is anything changing with Arenas?

Tom Chilton
- Yes, actually. Players will be able to see their opponent’s class and specialization before the match begins. They won’t be able to see the specific talent choices or glyphs being used, however. From there, it’s a bit like playing poker. You won’t know what exact abilities your opponent is using, but you’ll be able to modify your own talents in the staging area before the match starts to try to anticipate what they could be using.


Rogues, Ferals, and 'some' Mages will be screaming and kicking. I have no sympathy for rogues and mages anymore, but feral doesn't deserve that. (#)'s

I strongly disagree with this idea. You may already tell, to an extent, what the other team has right off the start. Knowing what buffs are active, and which specc they belong to, is plenty of heads-up for coming up with a strat against the other team. Players know what do if we get "this team" and what to do against "that team." Sure it's not perfect, but there's absolutely no reason why the element of surprise should be removed from Arena.

"What do we have....it's...RMP." --- Encourage players to learn the game, not rely on the UI to tell them everything.


To me, this makes sense, and I've been wondering lately why this hasn't been added in earlier. We have the same functionality in BG's and Addons will tell you when the match starts which class/spec you're up against.

With the ability to now prepare specs/talents during the prep before a match, it makes more sense and can, hopefully, cut down on the 'my class is horrible because..." or 'x class/spec is OP', because now you CAN adjust depending on the situation.
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85 Orc Warrior
6880
Funny that not a single question was raised that addressed the gross imbalance of classes in cata, and what is going to be done so that one or two classes aren't ridiculously over powered the majority or the expansion. Looking at you mages and rogues.

I am not excited about another expansion where class balance is only addressed every major content patch.
Edited by Axeplay on 6/5/2012 10:28 AM PDT
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90 Human Death Knight
4360
I have a few questions. First of all I am sure you are aware that not all players on PvP realms wish to have any part in world PvP at all, and that these new changes could certainly see to it that large guilds camping certain sections of the world is an extremely likely possibility. On top of this the flying mount limit for Pandaria will not do much past the first few days, as all it will do is stop lower level players from getting away from level capped players that annihilate them in a few hits. I like the addition of a dismounting item, but multiple questions arise such as fall damage, also I do hope that they won't be so ridiculous as to be so quick that you can use it on a player mounting up trying to get away from world PvP.

It also sounds like you are attempting to make quest hubs a PvP zone, I think many people can agree that that is inherently a bad idea. I chose this realm because it was suggested to me when I was new, and I have 10 toons on here, 8 85s, I don't plan on paying ridiculous amounts of money just to avoid being camped endlessly by horde at quest hubs just because I am trying to experience the new expansion and actually level.

You seem to be putting to much reliance into cross realm zones to balance the odds out, but toss in one guild group of people and it's game over. I can understand wanting to force players into the world for PvP like that when the only thing happening is PvP, but it is not something I nor many many other players that I know want to have to deal with when leveling. It is very possible that leveling in Pandaria will exceed new levels of frustration because of these world PvP changes, and I really do hope that you are thinking about those unfortunate players on PvP realms that don't play on them to have their entire playing experience completely dominated by being endlessly killed at quest hubs, and don't give me that "Just get your guild to help" bologna, that just causes them to bring more and then you dragged all your guildies in to be endlessly killed as well.

But seriously though, the design of limiting flight in pandaria is fine, but the situation where one level 90 will pretty much be able to camp any sub level 90 for pretty much forever because of the 310% mount speed versus 100% mount speed is pretty ridiculous. I can't wait to level my alts...

Respectfully I have to say you are in the wrong kind of realm. PVP realms are made to people fight. I´m very happy with the changes.
06/05/2012 09:44 AMPosted by Shalura
Yeah, that's great and all, but the reason there's no "World PvP" is that people don't want a fair fight, they want to "Pwn n00bs". There are about as many people who want a good fight as there were twinks who were "only in it for the challenge".
No. The reason there´s no World PVP is that everything is made on instances and there´s no reason to go out in the "real world" (can I say real world talking about a virtual world? nvm)
If you want a fair fight, go for Arenas or RBG.
These ideas sound great on paper, but a lot of them are "been there, done that, it didn't work out as planned". So why try them again?

Why is this a problem? Faction imbalances. They exist, they are real. On some realms, they are overwhelmingly tilted to one sides favor. This will affect world bosses, world PvP, quest hubs, and now that you're weakening city guards, day to day life.

hmm... this makes sense. And this is why I changed from a Horde dominated realm to a 50%/50% (almost) realm (and not to a Aliance dominated realm)
Edited by Mallignus on 6/5/2012 10:41 AM PDT
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90 Troll Druid
11620
To me, this makes sense, and I've been wondering lately why this hasn't been added in earlier. We have the same functionality in BG's and Addons will tell you when the match starts which class/spec you're up against.

With the ability to now prepare specs/talents during the prep before a match, it makes more sense and can, hopefully, cut down on the 'my class is horrible because..." or 'x class/spec is OP', because now you CAN adjust depending on the situation.

Those addons extract information from the game itself. They simply display data, in a nice GUI, that is already available to you. It's not really an ode to skill if you knowingly have the best, well-rounded, talent build to counter your enemy.
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90 Blood Elf Death Knight
20750
FAQ:
Q: Why should I be forced to PvP when I'm on a PvP realm?
A: You picked it and get sufficient warning at the character creation screen.

Q: My friends made me play on a PvP realm, why should I be forced to PvP?
A: Blame your friends, not Blizzard!

Q: This will disrupt my usage of my city. How am I supposed to get anything done?
A: Go to one of the other capital cities. If they capture all of your cities, go to Dalaran which has a bank and AH. Also, in your Capital City, important vendors are unable to be killed, and you do not need ot PvP flag, so buying items won't be a problem.

Q: What about Faction Imbalance?
A: Populations are generally even across WoW. When cross-realm zones are in play, it should even out. Also, remember that after a certain population point, organized groups tend to be the same size, baring special organized events.

Q: Will dismounting players really work?
A: Not on travel - players will just fly higher up. However, when hopping between quest mobs or trying to escape, you'll need to be quick and clever. I imagine that players will either be gripped in and take 0 fall damage or that they'll gain a parachute. RP wise, if dismounting became common, there's no reason everyone wouldn't be saddling up with a chute!

Dismounting flying players is a requirement for World PvP. Without it, PvP combat ends everytime somebody dies. You res and fly away before you even load in to your enemy's screen. It'll also do away with all those pesky alliance sniping people in Durotar / Horde in Elwyn forest... though I imagine these dueling hubs will be moved to Durotar / Westfall for cross realm reasons.

Q: Why not make guards weaker on PvE realms?
A: PvE realms generally have less participation in defending cities. Guards need to be stronger to compensate.
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85 Human Paladin
9180
A: Populations are generally even across WoW. When cross-realm zones are in play, it should even out. Also, remember that after a certain population point, organized groups tend to be the same size, baring special organized events.


That one isn't even close to true. Population imbalances are just terrible right now. Likely why cross realm zones are coming into play, so that a server with a low Alliance population for example can now benefit from servers with high Alliance populations.
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90 Gnome Warrior
13000
06/05/2012 10:32 AMPosted by Cyous
It's not really an ode to skill if you knowingly have the best, well-rounded, talent build to counter your enemy.


To an extent, I agree. However it IS part of the game. PvE content allows for it. PvP allows for it. I think, and maybe I'm off base here, is that the intent is giving the way the new talent systems work greater flexibility and use across the spectrum of game play rather than 'Oh, this boss requires quick movement, EVERYONE switch out X talent for X talent' in PvE content alone.
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88 Undead Warlock
0
My biggest concern is that when I am out in the world questing, I am using my PvE specialization, and this will be especially necessary if I am to fight world bosses. I'm fine with being surprise attacked by an enemy player, but if that player is using their PvP spec and I'm not, I'll be wiped out.
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51 Draenei Paladin
320
06/05/2012 09:52 AMPosted by Katarn
I was just bringing to light that people rolling on a pvp server with 0% intention of pvping isn't always just some idiot expecting blizzard to bend over backward for them and change the rules of the server. Sometimes RL friends just play on that server, they really don't have a choice.


While I understand the situation and it does suck for them, they had plenty of warning and they decided that playing with their friends was worth the risk and aggrevation.


Actually, not all of us did have plenty of warning. When I first started out, I had no idea what "pvp" even meant. I was told to roll a character on a specific realm and that my friends would help me out when it came to learning the game and such. As someone who had never played an mmo before, the whole thing was a really overwhelming experience and I had no clue what I was signing myself up for at the time.

With that being said, I do miss the world pvp we used to have. I'd welcome something more like Halaa (isn't in its own zone / island, but a part of a questing & farming area). Imo it was fairly successful when it came to encouraging world pvp on my main realm and, as someone who wasn't even a pvper, I really enjoyed it.

I think the only thing that concerns me in this post is no flying sub-90. Does this apply to everyone? Or just people running around on Pandaria? It's one thing to pvp at max level, but after 8 85's, I want to get to level cap as fast as possible, and I don't want to have to deal with being camped all the time because of these changes.
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90 Night Elf Druid
10670
Is anything changing with Arenas?

Tom Chilton - Yes, actually. Players will be able to see their opponent’s class and specialization before the match begins. They won’t be able to see the specific talent choices or glyphs being used, however. From there, it’s a bit like playing poker. You won’t know what exact abilities your opponent is using, but you’ll be able to modify your own talents in the staging area before the match starts to try to anticipate what they could be using.

I am also a bit concerned about costs.

If we are expected to change talents and glyphs on the fly, but each change costs 10G (e.g. Dust of Disappearance), arena play at even a moderate level can easily become prohibitively expensive. At 100G per match, you can spend 2k+ in one evening. OK, you will probably not change all talents and glyphs every time but it's something I find worrisome.
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90 Night Elf Druid
10670
06/05/2012 10:50 AMPosted by Glitz
I think the only thing that concerns me in this post is no flying sub-90. Does this apply to everyone? Or just people running around on Pandaria?
Just people in Pandaria. But you'll have a hard time getting enough XP to level beyond 86 outside of it.
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90 Worgen Warlock
13365
I really like the arena change, being able to pick my pet to better suite the comp I am playing against will be amazing.
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85 Human Paladin
3615
First of all, let me say I love these changes, maybe a bit edgy on the dismounting thing, I'm all for pvp, I can say this without hesitation that when I started playing wow I thought it was one of the most amazing games out there as a whole. One concern that really bugs me is regarding world bosses. I can understand how this will really get the players back in the world but wont they lose their appeal once we advance in higher arena tiers and players will no longer feel they need the gear the bosses drop? I am hoping(fingers crossed) that MoP will really deliver on the world pvp because its one of those things that will keep a lot of people playing and enjoying the game.
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90 Troll Mage
13645
06/05/2012 10:38 AMPosted by Katarn
Population imbalances are just terrible right now. Likely why cross realm zones are coming into play, so that a server with a low Alliance population for example can now benefit from servers with high Alliance populations.


I'm not even sure that's the case - as far as I can tell, if a zone is marked cross-realm, it's cross-realm for both factions. And for PvP realms overall, the faction imbalance is predominantly horde-favored.

You can check this with http://wow.realmpop.com/us.html
Click on the PvP side of the PvP/PvE edge and look at the resulting faction balance.
(I realize those aren't official numbers at all, but it's the best there is for now)

If you look at the faction balance for individual PvP realms, there are very few in the 0.85-1.15 A/H range - most are skewed heavily towards one faction or the other. It amuses me that people claim to want fair world PvP given that situation.
Edited by Fimbulvinter on 6/5/2012 10:58 AM PDT
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90 Troll Rogue
8170
06/05/2012 10:47 AMPosted by Derix
My biggest concern is that when I am out in the world questing, I am using my PvE specialization, and this will be especially necessary if I am to fight world bosses. I'm fine with being surprise attacked by an enemy player, but if that player is using their PvP spec and I'm not, I'll be wiped out.


All I can say is tough luck. That's part of the game when you roll on a PvP realm.
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90 Human Mage
14510
I really like many of the changes. I honestly didn't like Tol Barad or Wintergrasp at all, so if they don't add a new area like these ones, I don't care.

I'm worried about guards being weak in PVP realms. I'm glad I transfered my characters from Chromaggus to Alterac Mountains (both PVP servers). Chromaggus is pretty much a horde server. Horde could just move to Stormwind and live there, if they wanted. Alliance in Chromaggus would be in a living hell come MoP.

I'm glad Alterac Mountains is slightly Alliance favored but not many people have the resources to transfer 4 or 7 characters to another server because, when they were new to the game, were assigned to a PVP server that happens to be favored towards the other faction.

How will you solve that "not so small" problem?
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90 Human Mage
14510
06/05/2012 10:47 AMPosted by Derix
My biggest concern is that when I am out in the world questing, I am using my PvE specialization, and this will be especially necessary if I am to fight world bosses. I'm fine with being surprise attacked by an enemy player, but if that player is using their PvP spec and I'm not, I'll be wiped out.


Don't forget we won't have a PVP or PVE spec strictly speaking in MoP. We'll just have tools, suchs as glyphs and new talents that don't impact the amount of damage you can dish. Pretty much all the new talents add new flavor and meaning to PVP.
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
11915
I LOVE that it sounds like there will be some world pvp on pvp realms, thank you for this. For all the people that complain about it, that is the nature of a pvp realm, if you dont like the idea of it you are on the wrong realm and that is no ones fault but your own. Blizzard did not force you to make a character there. Thank you Blizzard!

Also, what happened with some kind of reward for Wpvp did that idea get dumped? Alot of people were excited about that idea.
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85 Gnome Priest
8485
I can't wait for the dismounter item.

Should go something like this..

Mount up and fly towards enemy.
/use Dismounter
/Point
/lol
/cast levitate

Tea bag the corpse.

With that said I hope it is an eng only item so that not everybody has one. It should have a faily decent CD 3-5 mins.

I also hope its name is really cool like Gnomish AAA guns or Goblin anti air rockets
Edited by Compactdisc on 6/5/2012 11:22 AM PDT
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