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Hey guys, just wondering what you think of apple products?
Art is function given form. At least, that's one definition. The simple design, the clean lines, and the purely utilitarian features of a device that is simple enough to be used, and yet has enough depth to be safely explored without risking the object in question, all adds up to what is viewed, to me at least, as a work of art.
I like Apple iPhones and iPods most; I have an iPod nano that's of the first gen, and have gone through four sets of ear buds. The thing won't quit on me, although it might need a new battery. I would like an iPhone 4S, but we'll see in time, the 5's are coming out soon.
There have been several recent as well as older threads on Apple products just to point it out. Reviewing those may increase your knowledge overall.
There are many pluses, first of all, developing on the mac is a lot cheaper for a new dev. You don't have to pay anything to get a copy of Xcode if you want to start poking around at Objective-C. This makes learning the language significantly easier than it is in the Windows world. There's also the fact that it's built on UNIX, now, while the basic user wouldn't have much use for it, for the average geek, this is a huge plus. It allows all sorts of tweaks and customization that would be plain impossible in the Windows world. People say that macs can't be customized, but that was only true before 2001 when OS X was released. Since Macs have been running a UNIX OS, things have changed dramatically.
The reason most gamers don't have any interest in Macs is pretty simple and understandable: Lack of good video cards. The only Mac that has a decent desktop video card is the Mac Pro, and that's a workstation-class computer meant strictly for pros, so way out of the price range for average consumers. It's a mobile GPU or IGP the way things stand, so hardcore gaming on a Mac is just not possible.
The reason I play on a mac is because of the first paragraph. The OS is just plain more advanced when it comes to customization and the technologies built-in. One BIG example of a tech that I make use of every time I launch WoW is AppleScript. AppleScript is one of the most advanced scripting languages I've ever used. It's a bit like COM bindings in the sense that it allows for application scripting, but it's far more usable than that. Every Mac application has support for at the "very" least, GUI scripting, that is, click this GUI element, click this one, click this one, etc. The same cannot be said for COM bindings.
How do I use this tech? I launch WoW with one. The script is set to update my addons every launch of the game, then proceed to start WoW. It also uses dropbox behind the scenes to sync my addons with the cloud. It's just plain awesome what you can do with AppleScript, and if I had all day, I could tell you a long list of neat little scripts I put together using this.
Now for another reason I use a mac that most people laugh at. There are no viruses for Macs. Yes, I know that they have small market share, but the fact of the matter is, there were viruses for macs before they switched to OS X and a UNIX foundation, and then they all suddenly vanished. Say what you want, but it does indeed take quite a bit more effort to write a virus for OS X than it did for OS 9 and currently does for Windows.
Anyway, that's just an overview of a few of the reasons I use a mac. If you're the kind of geek I am, there can be no replacement.
I use the Mac for several reasons.
Mostly painless use. For me, most stuff simply "Just Works(tm)". I simply don't have to mess with it. I loathe messing with computers.
I like Unix. The Mac is the finest Unix desktop on the planet. I get all my Unixy command line fiddly bits along with lots of commercial as well as free and boutique software.
Spotlight is simply amazing. I can not live without Spotlight.
Time Machine is simply amazing. I can not live without Time Machine.
My main disk and Time Machine are both seamlessly encrypted. All I had to do was click a checkbox. All I have to do is provide my password when I boot. Which is rarely. 6 months+ up time is not uncommon, since sleep works flawlessly my machines are never powered off. I never turn off the laptop. I reboot if I finally decide to update to a latest software release.
There is no culture of running as admin. Most of my applications do not have admin privileges, nor needed admin privileges to even be installed. In my Windows experience, every thing wanted admin privs to install, it was insane.
Drag and Drop software install combined with drag and drop software uninstall, nice features.
I get all of this out of the box.
My machine is absolutely silent. I hear fans when it boots, and that's it. It's been silent for 6 years.
Windows locks open files, Unix does not. I can not abide by this behavior on Windows. It interferes with my software development more than I can say. It is fabulously annoying.
If I couldn't run the Mac, I'd be running a linux, and I'd probably not be playing WoW.
It's true. For what they offer a typical gamer, they are way over-priced and not worth it.
If you're a reasonably serious gamer, you'll have to upgrade your graphics card at least every two years, but more likely every one. With any Apple procuct bar the Mac Pro (as mentioned above), this is impossible. Note that a lot of Apple stores don't even stock Mac Pros, you'll have to go hunting or buy online to pick one up. Also be prepared to pay at least $2499, and that's for the base model... which is still lower specced than most $1500 custom built gaming rigs.
A big reason many fanboys cry out is that they can't get viruses. This is false.
Yes, at the moment is it very unlikely, but as the flashback virus showed, as Apple picks up more of the market share they'll become more of a target for the dregs of humanity that write viruses and spyware. When they become common, it's going to be a catastrophe - barely anybody that owns a Mac has an anti-virus program installed.
If you simply want a computer that can handle any game you throw at it, and don't care about "art" (who the hell wants to pay a premium for their PC to be considered art?) then buy a PC.
If you develop software, are too computer illiterate to figure out how to set up a backup on an external USB drive in Windows, or don't mind buying a whole new computer (at a higher price) every two years to cope with new games coming out, then get a Mac.
Oh, I should also mention that if you've used Windows for a very long time, be prepared to re-learn everything.
Mess around at LANs with your friends or connect to ftp servers? Apple do it totally differently. Simply because they can. It wouldn't be so bad if they made things similar, the fact that they pretend 99% of people haven't grown up learning Windows really bugs me.
(Yes, I work in tech support and yes, I have to deal with Apple-newbs calling all the time asking how they do the same basic stuff they did in Windows on their new Apple - an Apple that their 19 year old hipseter son/daughter who works "in IT" convinced them to buy, because they're "better". It gets old FAST...)
Edited by Bladefox on 7/30/2012 1:51 AM PDT
Ahhhh - Apple products.
I used to be a hater, even though the first computer I studied on was a Mac - 1979
Mac are for stupid hipsters who don't know how to run a computer.
This $1200 guy sitting in front of me has a 21 inch screen, and is quiet as a mouse. I run Linux AND Windows on it - at the same time as OSX. While transcoding movie files. True story!
Uptime and reliability are great on Macs. The BSDesque underpinnings are awesome. I spend half my time in a bash shell doing stuff for work.
Enterprise wise they have a lot to offer - when you factor in the TCO over a five year period they come out ahead of Windows machines. Microsoft has written Office for Mac since 1989 - before the Windows version I might add. Everything else these days is cloud based - CRMs, ERPs etc - there is little to no "need" for Windows in today's work environment.
Google up "apple vs pc sales" see what comes back at you.
The tide is turning friends!
PS - I almost forgot - they are the most profitable company in the world to date. One facet of this is the $97 billion they have in cash. CASH! That doesn't factor in one paper clip that they might own as assets. So.....
I think the thing that most people get confused about when it comes to a, say, macbook, vs a PC is what it takes to build a computer, what it takes to make it reliable, and what is considered overpriced.
I've always been a firm believer of 'you get what you pay for', unless you're getting ripped off.
Since we are talking about a HUGE computer manufacturer, we can eliminate the possibility of getting ripped off.
I've never used a mac until just recently - my college gave me the latest macbook, adobe cs6, blah blah, its digital arts...
Anywho, after using my macbook, I realized why it costs more than a, say, dell computer with the exact same specs.
Yes, it's true that it's what's on the inside that runs a computer. Yes, it's true that you can build a non apple laptop with the same specs as a macbook pro, install the mac OSX on it, and pay less in the long run.
Now, here is why macbooks are more expensive- they are built SPECIFICALLY to run the mac OSX the best it can. It is also built with a lot of other features that allow the macbook to run cooler, to last longer, and to resist wear and tear.
I've always thought that the 'extra' you are paying is for a product that's all 'ooh shiny'.
The biggest difference between a macbook and a dell xps is that the macbook is made of pure aluminum, where as a dell xps is plastic.
For the computer nerds out there, you know why aluminum is great for computers. It's used on motherboards and graphic cards as heat sinks. Aluminum absorbs heat quickly and immediately releases it.
I can go on about all the other beneficial features that a macbook has that your plastic shells from other computer manufacturers doesn't.
In summary, a macbook is designed much better than say a XPS. It is meant to last longer, to resist damage, and to keep cool. I've owned windows laptops in the past. They take a beating. 3 years is the average lifespan, between damage to the shell and the battery life (not day to day, but overall).
So, when it comes to laptops, a macbook will indeed last longer, which saves you money in the long run. I indeed think it's better to pay a little more up front and have a product that lasts you a looong time.
Now, the operating system itself is another discussion, and is purely based on what you need it for. I'm a fan of both operating systems. I have used windows my entire life, and am most familiar with it. Both operating systems get the job done, and is purely based on preference. One is not better than the other.
Fortunately, anyone can buy either operating system and install it on any computer they want.
So, yes, if you want the durability and longevity of a macbook but like windows, you can install windows on your macbook. This is something a LOT of people don't understand.
Heck, you can put BOTH on the same computer at the SAME TIME.
Personally, I ultimately prefer my custom built desktop with windows 7. Very few issues have I had with it. There's never been a problem with windows I couldn't fix. And you know what... if I ever did get fed up with windows, I can always just install the mac OSX on my desktop on a separate hard drive, and nothing would change.
Ah. Now lets get a bit off subject yet still relevant. Mobile device operating systems. Apple is falling behind. Big time. The iOS, as I see it, was only successful because there was not previously a true smart phone OS.
Unfortunately, the iOS's stinginess and strict lockdowns on customization and 3rd party development has killed it. Currently, over 50% of all smartphone users have android. Simply put because it works much better and is much more feature rich. Because the consumer base can edit the OS, features within it, and apps with more freedom, android appeals much better to the consumer base.
A new developer can code on windows for free as well. You don't have to pay anything to get a copy of Visual Studio Express (C#, Visual Basic.Net, C++, and ASP.Net for web development are all free). You can also use free versions of SQL server (enterprise class database) so that if you are doing web development, you can write everything on your own computer and use the same compatible technology on your web server that you use on your own computer. Windows itself of course comes with an enterprise level web server via IIS. It's not installed by default, but all you have to do is enable the feature.
WebMatrix is also free, which provides a more streamlined, lightweight alternative to using IIS. It uses IIS Express for the web server, and also has it's own IDE and makes it simple to create and upload an asp.net website for less experienced developers (experienced devs use it too though).
Windows Mobile was a true smartphone in every sense of the word well ahead of the iPhone. It had literally thousands and thousands of apps, integrated email, calendar, web browsing, text messaging, games, multi-function TV remotes, etc. The only real difference is that Windows Mobile used a more precise input method by using a stylus.
Should be noted that the pro version of Microsoft's new Surface tablet is bringing back the stylus. You can use the standard multi-touch, but also use a stylus for more accurate things such as drawing diagrams, working in photoshop (since Surface pro uses full windows 8 it can run photoshop on a tablet).
Imagine if you are an artist and you are showing off your portfolio to people using your tablet, and then you get an idea during a break and you want to go into photoshop to do something real quick. With Surface, you can use that same device to fire up photoshop and PRODUCE some content.
With the iPad you have to have a separate real computer to create anything meaningful since the iPad is simply a consumption device. It doesn't run first-class applications such as Photoshop.
Edited by Bravehearth on 8/14/2012 8:05 AM PDT
Mac is just another version of the same exact stuff that a PC is.
A lot of Apple's price is the hype they put behind it. Ignoring the Mac. There's people who own an Ipod Touch. Then they own an Iphone (Ipod Touch with phone service). And then a lot of them also own an Ipad (bigger Ipod Touch).
Apple has a lot of people who blindly follow the company. And throw money at them for literally 3 of the same exact thing. Ofc that same idea is going to be there when it comes to computers too.
Since Apple made the decision to make Intel systems, literally the only noticeable difference between a Mac and a PC is the Mac OS. And when it comes to comparing Mac to Windows, it's purely personal preference. The idea that Macs are better for gaming or multimedia work is a myth. It's the same hardware, it works the same way... The only difference is that some of the biggest tools for this stuff are software made for Mac that might not be ported for Windows yet.
And Macs CAN get viruses. You're just lucky for now because PCs are so much more common that anyone making a virus makes one that targets a Windows machine because they can get a lot more people with it.
90 Night Elf Hunter
A PC is a computer for the masses.
An "Apple" is a brand name you buy.
If you are old enough to remember, around 1984 Apple came out with some commercial in the theme of the book "1984" or something. In it, Apple was acting like IBM was big brother while Apple was the computer for the masses (or was it about microsoft/ibm? I forget.) This is SO IRONIC now; Because IBM is pretty much gone as a personal PC maker.
Meanwhile, Apple is the "big brother" of the "Apple platform." They squashed everyone else, so that APPLE is your only choice as an Apple vendor. Meanwhile, the "IBM pc" is an open platform which is priced accordingly.
Apple is a brand name. It is something you buy because you want an Apple computer, rather than "a computer." It is like buying a Jaguar automobile, because you want a jaguar automobile. Someone could tell you its very overpriced, does the same thing (often a lot worse), but you just want a Jaguar.
You can build the EXACT pc you want, of component parts which are the best parts for the job. You can get an OEM version of a microsoft OS cheap, often from a vendor you buy one or more of those parts from. You can do all of this at an incredibly competitive price, greatly lowering the cost of ownership. You can even not buy an OS, putting Linux on it or something (or multiboot to both.) In fact, if you bought the RIGHT apple computer, you could even triple boot on it (Apple, a unix/linux AND a microsoft OS.)
My PC, with Linux on it, has incredible uptime. The operating system is opensuse linux, which is totally free. I have a great programming environment (if I ever did that), as well as publishing environment, all for free. I can also multiboot to a microsoft OS, for the games I can't play or the things I can't do.
Or you can buy an Apple computer, from Mother Russia. You could put a linux or something on that too, multibooting. However, most of the people who will buy an Apple computer will never do that.
Many people who did get hooked on Apple, did so when it was THE computer to have for desktop publishing or being an artist. That has not been the case for years now. However, these people still retain that "brand name loyalty."
Steve Jobs and Apple finally got smart, which is when they really made the company more successful. They realized that the money was not in their closed computer platform, but rather in closed platforms like the Ipad/Ipod and their other stuff.
The IMAC was a gimmick, which brought them back into personal computing in a big way. Meanwhile, their pads and phones have become their bread and butter.
If I won the lottery tomorrow, I'd still be building my own PC's out of the best component parts. I'd probably also own at least one Apple computer, to look pretty and dink around on.
I've been using opensuse Linux, since patch 2.3 of Wow which broke my sound forever in Windows vista (audigy LS card, no subsequent creative updates or Blizzard Wow updates fixed that.)
That one event got me back into Linux again. I found that Wow ran just as well in Linux on my old computer, better actually because the sound existed (and was great.)
Overtime, I found I was booting into vista less and less.
Wow I've been running great, since patch 2.3, in Linux. I even run it with the 64 bit exe, now that such a thing exists. I do this in a 64 bit OS, with 64 bit wine. The experience has mainly been error free, even after patches. I usually am playing fine after a big patch, while I check out the tech support section of this board and see many window users having trouble in Wow after the patch (in Wow's native environment, IRONY.)
I've not booted into Vista in two years now. My first reboot into it was a couple of days ago, since I could not get Diablo 3 (part of the free subscription commitment for Wow perks) to run in Linux; I tried everything but diablo 3 just came up with a black screen (though I could move the mouse about.)
Everything I did in Vista, I found I could do just as well or better in opensuse Linux. This included streaming media files to watch on my Xbox 360. Again, this is rather Ironic. In linux I use Ushare, which streams them better than media center did in Vista.
I game on a pc and do all else, business, email, etc., on my mac. It just works.
I can play wow on my mac just fine, but not and use full video settings.
I orginally went mac because while they are not inherently more secure, they are not the target windows machines are.
Also think about the advantage to having the folks who design the hardware be the same outfit as those that write the operating system.
Edited by Coshise on 8/26/2012 10:46 AM PDT
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