[Guide] Changes to CTC and DR in 5.0.4

100 Draenei Warrior
14565
Okay, so I updated my sticky just before the patch went live last night with all the things that changed but I suspect that a: People aren't noticing and b: People can't be assed re-reading the whole threat to find out the one or two changes that apply to, well, combat tables and diminishing returns.

If you want to read my sticky in full, it's here: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2489160859

I know a lot of you know a lot of this already but I thought I'd give a brief summary of what exactly has changed and how it applies to your average, every day tanking. I'm assuming you know most of how this worked before 5.0.4, if not, you're probably better off reading my thread anyway.

Block is now on a second roll. Basically, now, if an attack isn't dodged, parried or it doesn't miss, the computer rolls again to see if you block the attack. This means CTC capping is no longer possible, so don't bother about it. On a related note, warriors now get much less block from Mastery than before 5.0.4 (I think pallies still get about the same? Someone correct me if I'm wrong). This also means you'll block considerably less often than you previously did. If you had 60% block chance before and 30% avoidance, 60% of all attacks made against you were blocks. Now, 60% of the 70% that aren't avoided are blocked. So, only 42% of all attacks made against you were blocks. Yes, this is a nerf, but CTC capping was a really nasty situation balance-wise and we're really better off without it.

Strength now gives parry directly for plate tanks (Rather than parry rating) and parry now has much much less harsh diminishing returns (Only for plate tanks. Druids and probably monks should still have their fairly easy DR on dodge). Furthermore, block now suffers diminishing returns..
Before, parry and dodge both had DR caps at about 65%, which meant that the closer you got to 65%, the harsher diminishing returns. Dodge remains with a cap at 65%, while parry has a cap now at a huge 235%, which means you're really not going to see much in the way of noticable DR on parry until you start getting pretty huge amounts. Block's DR cap is at 149.1% (Which means block suffers harsher DR than parry).
This means you no longer want to balance dodge/parry. It's a little more complicated than that but Theck worked out a handy wee formula that you can use to figure out your ideal parry/dodge ratio, which I macroised for your convenience:
/run d=GetDodgeChance() r=235.5/65.631440-((235.5/65.631440)*5.01-3.76)/d DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage("Ideal parry/dodge ratio: "..string.format("%.2f",r))

That'll spit out a number, say, 2.5, which means you want 2.5 times as much parry as dodge. So if you have 10% dodge, you want 25% parry.
Keep in mind that formula depends on your dodge, so every time you reforge dodge, you'll want to check that formula to see what the new ratio is. If you're not that fussed, you can use the number as a basic guide. Most numbers you get will be around 2-3 though, so that's a pretty decent starting point.

I got this information from Theck because he's smart: http://sacredduty.net/2012/07/06/avoidance-diminishing-returns-in-mop-part-3/
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Combat tables, diminishing returns and you!
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2489160859
Edited by Waniou on 9/1/2012 10:06 PM PDT
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94 Pandaren Warrior
16150
2.51 ratio

come at me
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100 Draenei Warrior
14565
2.32 on my DK. :O
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Combat tables, diminishing returns and you!
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2489160859
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
0
Um i have a question about the ratio but i asked it in your sticky

edit: Thanks for answering the question there!
Edited by Celyndrashad on 8/29/2012 4:05 AM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
16455
so whats the best ratio to have ?
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100 Human Warrior
11955
So I guess Mr Robot (I mean Panda Bot) is about right .... hell it wants me to change about everything!!!

But it seems to confirm what you are saying, it gives me 29.19% parry for 8.78% dodge...
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100 Human Warrior
11955
Hmm I'm no longer sure, if I use your macro up there right now I have 2.49 ratio before even touching my 4.XX gear... currently I have 12.90 dodge and 25.51 parry

!@#$ I'm confused..
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90 Dwarf Warrior
12200
ask mr robot is not correct. it is semi decent, but doesnt take hit/exp into affect. It's parry:dodge ratio is off
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64 Draenei Death Knight
10235
2.01 for me
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
13465
Pff. Its totally possible for Paladins to blockcap still, we just need to stack ~17,900 Mastery. At level 85, that is. It will be more like 60,000 at level 90. Time to work on that gearing!
Edited by Wrathblood on 8/29/2012 8:26 PM PDT
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100 Human Warrior
13245
2.30, beetches.
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100 Draenei Warrior
14565
This is not a blatant bump post. *cough*
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Combat tables, diminishing returns and you!
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2489160859
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90 Human Paladin
11740
2.58 ratio for me! I WIN
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
12350
08/29/2012 08:25 PMPosted by Wrathblood
Pff. Its totally possible for Paladins to blockcap still, we just need to stack ~17,900 Mastery. At level 85, that is. It will be more like 60,000 at level 90. Time to work on that gearing!


Hell, when you put it like that it's always been possible for us to hit 102.4% in complete avoidance!

...

<.<

Anyways. 2.42.
Edited by Kaitelynn on 9/1/2012 11:05 AM PDT
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
11255
2.59 >.>
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my monk is in trouble... I have 170 dodge rating and 0 parry rating on his tank set right now :( Hardcapping expertise to have keg smash never get parried is a pain, plus haste for energy regen is more yummy now considering I can trigger 20% parry from shuffle, and 30% dodge from elusive brew pretty much on demand.

He does have 10.6% base dodge (from agi mostly I'm guessing), and 8.01% parry (3% from knowing parry, and 5% from swift reflexes, not sure where the .01 is coming from, base strength maybe?).
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100 Draenei Warrior
14565
My understanding is the new dodge DR is only for plate tanks. Sorry, should've made that clearer. Monks and druids still get reasonable DR on their dodge and I have no idea what parry DR is like for monks.

EDIT: As far as I'm aware, plate tanks have 3.01% base parry, I assume monks have the same maybe?
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Combat tables, diminishing returns and you!
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2489160859
Edited by Waniou on 9/1/2012 10:06 PM PDT
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I was being tongue-in-cheek about being in trouble, from what theck has mathed out with communism's help the DR curves for dodge and parry on a monk are a lot closer to equal.

I guess the base parry is the same, i thought I read somewhere from GC that parry is 3% base, but 3.01 is close enough for whisky shots in my book.
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90 Dwarf Paladin
9675
Where does the number of 70% come from when talking about 60% of 70%? and how did that come to 42% were blocks? Sorry just a bit confused.
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100 Draenei Warrior
14565
If you've got 30% combined miss, dodge and parry, that means you avoid 30% of attacks, so the remaining 70% aren't avoided. That's where the 70% comes from. From that 70%, 60% of those are blocks, .6*.7 = .42 = 42% of all total attacks made against you (Including the avoided ones) are blocked.
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Combat tables, diminishing returns and you!
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2489160859
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