Feral : Incarnation/Dance

90 Tauren Druid
8905
I understand why Blizz decided to not give a dance bar or dance stance : It would screw up macros and require too much time for a player to reajust when changing talents (especially in arenas where you only get 1 min or so).

The problem :
Without a dance bar or some macro functions, we are forced to waste good keybinds on abilities we only use during non-Incarnation (Mangle, Shred) or only during Incarnation (Pounce, Ravage) as they are mutually exclusive

What I see :
Mangle costs 35 energy and hits for X. No requirements.
Shred costs 40 energy and hits for 1.20*X. Must be behind target.
Ravage costs 45 energy and hits for 1.875*X. Must be behind target and in stealth.
Pounce costs 50 energy. Must be in stealth.
Incarnation removes Pounce and Ravage's requirements.

My reasoning :
During Incarnation, Ravage replaces both Mangle and Shred as it no longer suffers from positional requirements (why Mangle may sometimes be used over Shred) and hits harder than both (with the same restrictions). The energy cost is a non-issue considering how much more efficient Ravage is to both. You'd have to be desperately in need of a kill to waste energy on Mangle during Incarnation; so much that it would be a huge stupid risk to do so. Ravage therefore makes both Shred and Mangle useless during Incarnation.

My (elegant) solution :
Remove Pounce and Ravage from the game.

Change Mangle to :
40 energy.
Mangle the target for 400% normal damage plus 224 damage. Awards 1 combo point.

When used in Stealth or during Incarnation, Mangle instead stuns the target for 4 sec and causes 13530 Bleed damage over 18 sec. Awards 1 combo point.

Reduce the target's movement speed by 50% for 12 sec

Change Shred to :
40 energy.
Shred the target for 400% normal damage plus 224 damage. Awards 1 combo point.

When used in Stealth or during Incarnation, Shred the target for 625% normal damage plus 350 damage and has a 50% increased chance to critically strike targets with over 80% health. Awards 1 combo point.

Reduce the target's movement speed by 50% for 12 sec

Deals 20% additional damage to bleeding targets.


Changed the energy costs to be more in line with such a change. Energy costs and damage values can obviously be tweaked (raw numbers used my own druid self-buffed, but the idea is there).

The change would force old-Ravage to benefit from 20% Bleed so I nerfed the base dmg to 625% + 350. With 20% increase from bleeds, we get the current 750% + 420.

***

Before people complain about "dumbing it down", this change wouldn't dumb anything down. It's simply how these abilities interact with each other. There is no decision to take. Without Incarnation, you Shred unless you can't be behind the target; then you Mangle. With Incarnation, you just Ravage and forget about Shred and Mangle; but you also get to access Pounce that way without going through ridiculous keybind setups.

It's a necessary quality of life change.
Edited by Billgatez on 8/30/2012 8:31 AM PDT
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85 Troll Druid
11945
With the changes already made in this patch I see no reason why this should not be considered.

+1 Support
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90 Tauren Druid
8905
Bump
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100 Night Elf Druid
13415
I was just complaing about this the other day, sounds like a great fix to me!
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85 Human Rogue
5175
Your complaining...... druids are beyond retarded right now being as they are now rogues..... everything the rogue class had is now no longer unique. Why would i even play a rogue now?
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88 Human Rogue
5155
08/31/2012 01:21 AMPosted by Suicides
Your complaining...... druids are beyond retarded right now being as they are now rogues..... everything the rogue class had is now no longer unique. Why would i even play a rogue now?


Neither here nor there in this topic. Either keep a stiff upper lip (Which you damn well should have after playing a rogue for any period of time and reading posting on these forums) or reroll to something else.

On topic, what i'm basically getting here is that Pounce and Ravage are basically rolled into Mangle/Shred when used in stealth or Incarnation? Sounds interesting. Leveling my druid Feral/Balance, so i'm kind of interested in how all of this would play out.
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90 Pandaren Warrior
11505
08/31/2012 01:21 AMPosted by Suicides
Your complaining...... druids are beyond retarded right now being as they are now rogues..... everything the rogue class had is now no longer unique. Why would i even play a rogue now?


Because you enjoy the class and it's play style?

Same reason every non rogue/mage played through cata?
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100 Worgen Druid
13855
I absolutely agree with this. Without our free Ravage proc from our feral charge, Ravage simply takes up space in my UI until I use Incarnation.

(Side note: I must say, I really miss being able to Feral Charge, Pounce, then Ravage as an opener.)
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90 Tauren Druid
8905
Bump.
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100 Goblin Warlock
18050
Saying bump is actually a temp bannable offense.
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90 Night Elf Druid
8395
08/31/2012 01:21 AMPosted by Suicides
Your complaining...... druids are beyond retarded right now being as they are now rogues..... everything the rogue class had is now no longer unique. Why would i even play a rogue now?


09/03/2012 07:13 AMPosted by Purebalance
Saying bump is actually a temp bannable offense.
So don't say it and just respond to warning?
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90 Night Elf Druid
8395
08/31/2012 01:21 AMPosted by Suicides
Your complaining...... druids are beyond retarded right now being as they are now rogues..... everything the rogue class had is now no longer unique. Why would i even play a rogue now?
you mean now that its no longer fotm?
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100 Human Death Knight
13605
I absolutely agree on this. They should add an [Incarnation] condition to macros so you could change whatever buttons you like to Ravage/Pounce during Incarnation.
Edited by Aerona on 9/8/2012 9:27 PM PDT
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85 Goblin Shaman
5270
+1
Well said hopefully someone from blizz reads this post.
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100 Night Elf Druid
12675
Bumping this post because it's been at least 2 months and I'm still annoyed as f*^% about not having a separate bar for Incarnation. C'mon now, do you even play your own game?
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90 Night Elf Druid
0
I would like this change, or at least a separate Incarnation bar.
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77 Troll Druid
7215
Lightly modified macro from http://www.skill-capped.com/forums/showthread.php?21432-feral-incarnation-macro

#showtooltip [stealth]Ravage;Shred
/cast [stealth]Ravage;Ravage!
/cast Shred


It works because when you're in incarnation the Ravage spell turns into Ravage! So if you're in stealth it will cast Ravage, incarnation will cast Ravage!, and normal will cast shred since it can't find a spell called Ravage!

Now if only there were a 'Shred!'...
Edited by Funfuzz on 12/8/2012 3:33 PM PST
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100 Night Elf Druid
12925
09/03/2012 07:13 AMPosted by Purebalance
Saying bump is actually a temp bannable offense.


dont tell on him bro, do you study the forums tos or something, pretty sad man.

anyways i think the ideas good but i dont think it is needed, It is very possible and do-able to be able to macro a ravage to either its own button or macro it into something else. Good idea but i just dont think its 100% needed, they need to nerf frostbomb first.
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