"Shockadins" dont need a nerf ( why )

85 Blood Elf Paladin
4075
I feel like my feedback had an impact and my opinion of Blizzard has gone up a bit after the disappointment of Diablo 3.
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81 Tauren Paladin
5015
PvP hasn't been balanced since TBC. And it never will be. They don't know how to, simple as that.
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100 Human Paladin
aus
19445
09/06/2012 10:25 AMPosted by Bándet
If healers want to level as a healer, LFD is a perfectly acceptable way of doing it. You level much faster in LFD as a healer or tank than a DPS due to que times. DPS should level faster in solo situations... because, you know.. They aren't a class that's role is to support other people. That is the tradeoff.


Except dungeons in mop are slower then questing by a large margin, So with instant queues you might quest at 50% of the speed of a quester. Btw you get rep from quests but not from dungeons so you need to the quests anyway if you need the rep.
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100 Human Paladin
aus
19445
I don't understand how massive healer damage is a good solution to this issue. There may be problems with the current leveling design, but that doesn't mean the solution is to make it so healers can do it all. Saying "Shockadins don't need a nerf" is saying just that.


Except we are hardly talking massive damage.

@ 85 in 4.x Any dps can jump me knowing the regardless of success or failure I am no threat to them. Ok in 5 mins if they have not killed me, they can just run away. Their was no downside to attacking a holy paladin because worst case it would be a draw. Even now between cc etc I can't kill a lesser geared dps without shockadin glyphs. So after farting around for 5 mins at the far end of tol barad I then spent 10 minutes walking very slowly back to the alliance camp. I can't kill him, he can't kill me. Their is no downside to attacking me.
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88 Human Paladin
4595
ok since you nerfed holy shock and made me think i needed to relad the game and ret just sucks to get decent dps dont want to tank what is left? feel like i wasted alot of effort here. i for one am not pleased
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88 Human Mage
9395
I don't mind the Holy Shock Nerf knew it was coming. But the Priest have to get nerfed also.
In the lower lvl BG's I've seen a hunter, mage and pally all hitting on a Priest and the Priest takes no damage and the shield doesn't come down. That's a little to OP. I understand the need to help healers stay up longer but healers aren't healing any more they are dpsing cause they can't be brought down. Nerf Priest Next they are the OP class in the Low,mid and higher lvl
BG's
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85 Orc Death Knight
WAD
5240
09/06/2012 05:30 PMPosted by Graybeerd
ok since you nerfed holy shock and made me think i needed to relad the game and ret just sucks to get decent dps dont want to tank what is left? feel like i wasted alot of effort here. i for one am not pleased

So you want the 1shotkill holy shock back eh?...
Play a Holy priest, then talk about low dps healer.
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90 Draenei Paladin
13225
at level 85 in full heroic ds gear, i have to take the glyph to get back to my old level of HS.

methinks you dun goof'd with that maths there mr blue san.
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87 Blood Elf Death Knight
0
This is brutally off-topic, but I feel a great place to ask anyway:

When I am on these forums, it seems most of the discussions/feedback/complaining about different classes and their abilities and mitigation of others' is coming from the perspective of how these characters interact against each-other rather than from a player versus environment point of view. I hope this written off the top of my head post, unreviewed for grammar/spelling/punctuation doesn't skullfack the lot of you...

So my question is now, are a majority of you guys playing on pvp realms where you encounter other players often just like environmental threats? Are most people on regular, or even on pvp realms, but you guys are really into battlegrounds as well as regular progression methods of play? Or are you guys all into arena?

My guess is:
1. Majority of people are playing on normal, or pvp realms, but spend much of their time in battlegrounds and this is where this feedback is largely coming from.
2. Next is people in PVP realms that often encounter other players, or practice pvp often with their faction-mate's to be prepared for battle with the opposition on said PVP realms.
3. Lastly I believe are people that play arena primarily, or focus almost entirely on pvp. If this isn't true, and most of you do focus on pvp, how do you go about it? What is your main venue for such things?

I ask all of these things as I just started playing recently about 2 months ago, and while the game is awesome, I am playing with many toons and realize that for soloing pve and not fighting others for example death knights are totally great. But if I were to engage in a one on one pvp scenario I may want to use a rogue. If I do arena or battlegrounds maybe I want to be a hunter at low levels, or later a mage?

I just find from my "boring" straight pve realm, pve play that many of the issues people complain about or discuss just aren't even an issue for me as I never encounter gaming situations that any of the things you discuss in this thread would ever affect me really. If I am in a dungeon/raid, sure I may care about people's ability to heal my character, etc. but would i ever really worry about who can dispel what, or the fact that warriors healing may be too much for the damage they do currently? Probably not.

In summation, I feel like I am missing out on a large part of the game that you all are enjoying, and I want to have to be forced to learn a character well and how they compete with others, and be engaged in pvp at times. So what are the majority of you guys on this thread doing? Care to reply any of you and explain in short why this conversation material matters to you personally, and the type of gaming you do on WoW mostly?

Don't want to invest too much time into this pve realm or ignore other pvp facets that you guys are largely playing on pve realms actually. I know its my opinion what I want to do, but I want to know are pvp realms the big secret i am missing out on, and after playing pve realms first you guys all realized pvp realms are the only way to go? Or are many of you on pve realms, and even the ones on pvp realms don't really care the realm type you are one, and you just enjoy your pvp'ing at will via arena's or battlegrounds? I know that obviously it varies from person to person, and it is opinion based, and you can't tell me what to do blah blah blah. But I am sure that the majority of people on here, and all the very top notch WoW players engage in a decent amount of PVP in some manner. Is it uncommon for top notch players to play on pve realms, even if they personally enjoy and focus mostly on pve as it's baby-mode to play on pve? Or is the realm type the preference part, and that regardless of realm type, the majority of you all still do battlegrounds/arena whether you prefer being ganked/ganking or watching tv while you run by opposing faction players heh.

Thank you,

I feel like I need to start doing something so that I can start earning all these other currencies besides "gold" and being to gear my toons out and get some pvp enjoyment in but I may not need to go reroll new toons on a pvp realm after all, and I may have enormous pvp potential waiting for me in my pve realm just waiting to be enjoyed.

So what do y'all do?

DEATH BY WALL OF TEXT
Edited by Felborne on 9/6/2012 6:07 PM PDT
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100 Tauren Warrior
12635
Seriously, yes, every patch I hear people complaining about every class being OP, and also about every class being nerfed and nonviable in PVP. Some people just have to complain.
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70 Night Elf Druid
740
Everyone knew Blizz was going to nerf Holy Shock, but to reduce it THAT much at lower levels is just insane. Currently at 33 i battlegrounds i would hit approximately 2k. Which is very over powered, but to go as far and reduce its damage to the highest hit i can make is 449? thats insnane?! Everything is over powered in there own way and everyone complains about it. All these balances do is make everyone angry.

Im not saying restore holy shock to its original ability, but you should definetly increase it to atleast half its normal
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67 Human Warrior
2860
In a recent hotfix to the game, we reduced the base damage and increased the spellpower coefficient of Holy Shock.

We were seeing extremely high base damage at low levels, and made the change in such a way that it only has a moderate impact on characters at or near level 85.

By far, most of our effort is currently on level-90 balance, because that’s what’s important to most players. However, it’s not the only thing that’s important. We’re seeing some Mists of Pandaria changes causing a few balance problems at lower levels, especially in PvP. We’re working on fixing all such imbalances, and this is just the first of many changes. If you’re interested in discussing similar issues, I’ve just started [url="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6515991780"]a new thread about it them our class balance forum[/url].

Details:
  • At level 10, Holy Shock damage has been reduced by 85%.
  • At level 85, with LFR gear, Holy Shock damage has been reduced by 39%.
  • At level 90, with normal raid gear, Holy Shock damage will be approximately equal.


The healing component of Holy Shock is unchanged.


So you're saying Low level pvp does matter? In your face everyone that said otherwise!
Edited by Metrosity on 9/6/2012 8:40 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Druid
2235
Details:
  • At level 10, Holy Shock damage has been reduced by 85%.
  • At level 85, with LFR gear, Holy Shock damage has been reduced by 39%.
  • At level 90, with normal raid gear, Holy Shock damage will be approximately equal.


The healing component of Holy Shock is unchanged.


At level 35 Holy Shock is now hitting for around 250 or so with the glyph (and that's with around 100 spellpower). Since the nerf I now only use Holy Shock for Holy Power generation..

I don't think anyone was actually arguing that Holy Shock should have been left as is, but come on.

You stuffed up the scaling.

Everyone knew Blizz was going to nerf Holy Shock, but to reduce it THAT much at lower levels is just insane. Currently at 33 i battlegrounds i would hit approximately 2k. Which is very over powered, but to go as far and reduce its damage to the highest hit i can make is 449? thats insnane?! Everything is over powered in there own way and everyone complains about it. All these balances do is make everyone angry.

Im not saying restore holy shock to its original ability, but you should definetly increase it to atleast half its normal


Exactly what I was thinking. Thing is this hurts Paladins that are trying to level as Holy through quests. At the moment I'm levelling with my friend who is playing a Disc Priest, and he's killing mobs faster (when are you going to nerf Penance's damage?).

On a side-note, the DPS specs seem to be absolutely terrible for levelling at the moment.
Edited by Skillface on 9/6/2012 9:03 PM PDT
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90 Gnome Warlock
13490
Blizzard's not even paying attention to what they did.

As others have pointed out, at 85, there's at least a 50% nerf in raid gear.

I do like 2-3k at 83. You guys try killing quest mobs with over 100,000 health with that.
Edited by Bitsi on 9/6/2012 9:11 PM PDT
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90 Tauren Druid
6525
glad this is fixed, but fixing some cases of extreme imbalance and ignoring others is kinda like saying that what rogues have been doing to people in low level bgs for 8 years is okay. and its not ok.
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98 Human Paladin
8625
35% reduction at 85 my butt.
It's at least a 50% reduction (minimum). Not to mention the tooltip is still wrong.
I have glyph of holy shock (does 50% less healing for 50% more damage). Tooltip says Holy shock does 33k damage..... lucky to hit 14k. Heck a crit don't even hit 33k
I'd hate to see it without the glyph.... not to mention that with it Holy shock heals are worthless.

I agree that it was hitting to hard, but for all you saying holy healers shouldn't be able to kill people. What the heck are you smoking? Druids, shamans, priests, etc that are dps spec heal to full with one heal yet can still burst you down something fierce. What is wrong with a healer sacrificing a little healing ability to do more dps.
Once again, I'm not saying holy shock should crit for 65k every 6 secs at 85, but it was nerfed a bit too hard.

Not to mention... whoever said that a holy paladin couldn't be dps spec? There are plenty of dps casters who have multiple healing abilitys (that make them very hard to kill).
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100 Worgen Warrior
13170
09/06/2012 09:19 PMPosted by Kitez
glad this is fixed, but fixing some cases of extreme imbalance and ignoring others is kinda like saying that what rogues have been doing to people in low level bgs for 8 years is okay. and its not ok.


The priest disc spec class still hit hard with penance.
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100 Human Paladin
10300
In a recent hotfix to the game, we reduced the base damage and increased the spellpower coefficient of Holy Shock.

We were seeing extremely high base damage at low levels, and made the change in such a way that it only has a moderate impact on characters at or near level 85.

By far, most of our effort is currently on level-90 balance, because that’s what’s important to most players. However, it’s not the only thing that’s important. We’re seeing some Mists of Pandaria changes causing a few balance problems at lower levels, especially in PvP. We’re working on fixing all such imbalances, and this is just the first of many changes. If you’re interested in discussing similar issues, I’ve just started [url="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6515991780"]a new thread about it them our class balance forum[/url].

Details:
  • At level 10, Holy Shock damage has been reduced by 85%.
  • At level 85, with LFR gear, Holy Shock damage has been reduced by 39%.
  • At level 90, with normal raid gear, Holy Shock damage will be approximately equal.


The healing component of Holy Shock is unchanged.


Good now that you've dropped my dps to the ground could you direct me to the dps partner or pet I can bring for questing? Considering the new quest model I would like very much to know why my damage was gutted from a low level pvp complaint?
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100 Human Paladin
10300
If you want to ransack healing at 85 I won't complain since yeah it's horrendously overpowered for hybrids like shadow priests and boomkins. However I'm not seeing how healers healing was a problem in the first case.

So I can't heal as a healer and I'm not allowed to do damage either... hmm guess I'll direct as a general throughout the progress of dungeons and battlegrounds.
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