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I have raided with both Last Word and Chosen. Last Word’s raid is a straight up copy of Chosen’s raid. I was the one that told Beastyn some of his raiders at that time were sharing Chosen’s strategies with Last Word. I attended one of Last Word’s raid on an alt and witnessed them use Chosen’s raid strategies, all from how the strategies were presented to the raid, to the actual diagrams used. It was all a straight up copy of Chosen’s raid.
After I told Beastyn and presented him with enough evidence. He immediately removed Therran, Rimefang and Isilmedae from Chosen. I talked to Therran, Rimefang and Isilmedae after they were removed from Chosen and they acted like victims when they backstabbed the guild they were in.
Ex-Chosen raider Rimefang telling Last Word’s Raid Leader Klutched how Chosen does Strategies.
[2012-01-10 18:15:31] Rimefang: i definately like one strat that chosen uses that Ive never seen before, for planning
[2012-01-10 18:15:45] Rimefang: i think beastyn uses some kind of googleshare for documents
[2012-01-10 18:15:51] Rimefang: then links it in mumble..
[2012-01-10 18:15:53] Isilmedae: google docs
[2012-01-10 18:15:58] Rimefang: its like insta-whiteboard.
[2012-01-10 18:16:27] Rimefang: its very slick and means changes can be made on the fly, and strats can be visualed by all..something u might want to look at
[2012-01-10 18:16:49] Rimefang: for example: we actually assign spots for people for heroic hagara..it works damn well
[2012-01-10 18:16:54] Klutched: google docs?
[2012-01-10 18:16:55] Rimefang: something u might want to look at.
[2012-01-10 18:16:56] Rimefang: yeah
[2012-01-10 18:17:19] Rimefang: so you could assign yourself and lind as admins for it..eveyrone else opens it via mumble..and sees changes and views on the fly.
[2012-01-10 18:17:28] Isilmedae: ^
[2012-01-10 18:22:34] Klutched: what do you create for google docs? as in a spreadsheet or what?
[2012-01-10 18:22:48] Isilmedae: sec, lemme check
[2012-01-10 18:22:56] Isilmedae: and you can do google draw and google spreadsheets
[2012-01-10 18:23:33] Rimefang: I think beast was using both draw and spreadsheets
[2012-01-10 18:23:38] Isilmedae: on the dropdown menu on top, you should be able to click on more
[2012-01-10 18:23:44] Isilmedae: and click on google docs
[2012-01-10 18:23:44] Rimefang: for example..he had a list for soakers for each of the morchok twins
Klutched would go in Last Word’s chat: http://www.vitality-nerzhul.com/chat/blab.php where Isilmedae, Rimefang and Therran would hang out and ask them how to do bosses. Instead of figuring things out for himself, he instead would go the easy way out and ask Chosen’s raiders how to do mechanics.
[2012-01-10 18:34:31] Klutched: do you use 5 or 6 ppl to chain lightning between the pillars on hagara?
[2012-01-10 18:34:40] Isilmedae: 5
[2012-01-10 18:34:44] Isilmedae: no wait
[2012-01-10 18:34:47] Isilmedae: 6
[2012-01-10 18:34:53] Isilmedae: yeah 6 people
[2012-01-10 18:35:09] Isilmedae: with healers interspersed
[2012-01-10 18:35:45] Klutched: 5 heals?
[2012-01-10 18:36:18] Isilmedae: er...lemme check
[2012-01-10 18:37:16] Isilmedae: 6
The chat history on Last Word’s website is permanent and is easy to browse and find everything they said to help Last Word’s progression. I was able to find enough evidence this way. Anyone can join http://www.vitality-nerzhul.com/chat/blab.php and browse their chat history.
Last Word eventually got links to Chosen’s diagrams and they straight up copied them. They started to present strategies the same way Beastyn does it in Chosen.
Chosen’s Hagara: http://i.imgur.com/vFF9s.jpg
Last Word’s Hagara: http://i.imgur.com/Y7Rrl.jpg
Heroic Zon’ozz is the worst, their execution is an absolute complete copy of Chosen’s execution of the fight. From how the groups were split, the diagram used, how dps was distributed, how healers were positioned, everything was a complete copy of Chosen’s execution of the fight.
Last Word’s raiders think their Raid Leader did all the work, when all he did was copy Chosen’s strategies after they had already killed those bosses and had them on farm. They carry themselves and act like they have accomplished something when in reality they were carried throughout Dragon Soul.
When Last Word finally reached the progression fight of the tier, they went and did what they were good at and asked Riggnaros for help on how to kill Heroic Spine of Deathwing.
Go to exactly 1 hour into the video and watch how Riggnaros hand holds Last Word and spoon feeds them how to kill Heroic Spine of Deathwing. If you look at their execution of the fight, they were weeks away from a kill. Positioning was wrong, cooldowns were wrong, DPS allocation was wrong and even the Corruptions were being killed at the wrong time.
I don’t know how anyone would want to be in Last Word. Their leadership is so weak all they do is habitually ask for help to kill anything. Is all they did during Dragon Soul progression and I don’t expect them to be any different going forward. None of their progression kills were actually due to their own effort. Their raid is more like a cheaply made copy of Chosen’s main raid.
I play Horde side on Ner’zhul now and I hear all the !@#$ Last Word talks about Chosen. Abbador instead of you doing all that talking. You should learn to lead your guild so it stops being a parasite and stop trash talking the guild you copied raid strategies from. The only respectable guilds left we have on Horde side are Spike Flail and Triumph and I heard both were quitting for Mists of Pandaria.
Beastyn is more of a leader than Last Word officers and GM combined. I have not seen anyone put in as much effort during progression than him in all the guilds I’ve been in. If you join Chosen you quickly find out he runs the guild from top to bottom and while he is sometimes harsh and direct, he puts in the most effort I’ve ever seen making sure every raider improves.
I wish Chosen good luck for Mists of Pandaria. I know you guys will do great.
Chosen fan boy not good enough to make the final cut GG.....
** Didn't you already get trolled about this in http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6489880959?page=4
Edited by Abbador on 9/9/2012 11:36 PM PDT
90 Orc Shaman
http://www.wowtrack.org/character/231339 - starlol is that you?
Check it out... Everything any guild on this server has done this tier is likely a strategy thought up and executed by somebody else in a higher-ranked guild. None of the guilds on this server are doing anything really cutting-edge.
Zon'ozz Diagram google search:
http://tinyurl.com/d3f2myy - diagrams are common. Google docs is a way persons can have a socially editable diagram. Rather than bossblueprint.com, which isn't editable at all.
I don't think anybody in our raid thinks that our raid strategy's are our own creations. There were hundreds of guilds killing it before we got to it. There aren't really hundreds of ways to do the fights.
I play Horde side on Ner’zhul now and I hear all the !@#$ Last Word talks about Chosen.
What !@#$ do we talk? The only thing we've said is related to and during or immediately after progression, and it was in a comment section on the forums, or perhaps on our Deathwing video comments. Thats the extent of it, however.
I can't believe I've given this coward this much time. Grats on making waves.
1. Plans were from Icy Veins but good try
2. Lots of people watch Rigg's stream (including Chosen raiders)
3. By your logic every guild should have a different strategy for every boss.
4. It's either this or "we only raid 3 nights a week so don't compare us"
5. Your first post of this exact text was dissected and turned on itself, in the end no one cared, so you repost. You have the same thought process as a South Park Underwear Gnome.
6. I can post on alts too.
7. Idk what chat your reading, but Ner'zhul trade chat and DS general chat never mention the word Chosen. It's almost always dumb Samwalker.
8. "Cheaply made copy of Chosen's raid" beats Chosen by almost a day if not more in Dragon Soul even though they were months behind them in the first place?
10. Literally copying and pasting a forum post into another, different thread should be considered spamming.
See, i just said the same thing you said except i actually made sense.
You on the other hand dont even have a valid response to my post.
Also, LOL, if a guild is better than chosen, its cause they raid more according to them, they seem to pride themselves on being one of the best guilds that raid X hours and talk !@#$ about guilds who raid more than X hours
Nothing against you or anything. I just felt like correcting spelling just now. I mean, insults and retorts work much better when everything is all correct and stuff. This is the internet, after all.
I never said "stupid"!!!
I'm sorry, but Chosen doesn't make make comments like that. We don't talk !@#$ about guilds who are ranked higher or lower than us, and we don't talk %^-* about guilds just cos they raid X amount of hours. Not sure what are you trying to prove here? You should stop assuming and you should stop putting words in our mouth.
Why so much hate towards this guild Ka?
Im pretty sure anyone competitive guild that says they dont talk !@#$ about other guilds is probably lying cause even i talk %^-* about guilds who are better than me. Why? because thats part of the competitive nature like bragging about @!%% sizes saying one guy takes more extenze
I agree with Epictoez. Raiding is essentially one big pissing contest, even big boss man Riggnaros talks smack about other guilds. I distinctly recall him saying TM is full of a bunch of wannabe scrubs.
In a perfect world we would just race and let our ranks speak for themselves, if Last Word did indeed copy Chosen's strats as you do say well so what? At the end of the day they out-ranked them by playing better, being a good raiding guild isn't necessarily about crafting strats but about doing everything you can to down a new encounter. If anything the evidence provided here today shows that the leaders of Last Word are willing to go anywhere they need to in order to help them progress. Shows at least some humility in my opinion.
I don't really understand the purpose of your post.
It appears that it's some silly attempt to disparage Last Word. Or maybe pat yourself on the back. Either way it's ridiculous.
Both Chosen and Last Word are fine guilds and should be complemented on their raiding achievements. Any guild depends on input from other guilds about what works and what doesn't work in raid encounters. If every guild had to find another strategy to progress that would just be silly.
Not sure why you would write volumous posts in a realm forum to attempt to make someone look bad or yourself look good. Instead you just make yourself look like someone that has only had success in a video game to measure the importance in the meaning of your life....Congrats.
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