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Ugh, bumping this. I have a few day one characters, and Dragonmaw Clan is an '08 guild as well. Horde has always been the underdog, but for the past two years or so, it has been utterly ridiculous. I like this server, though. It has history. I'm trying to convince myself to stay, but upon trying to level and seeing literally dozens of times more Alliance than Horde out there, I've been asking myself - why am I still here? Why do I subject myself to this? If populations are even remotely balanced, I love PvP servers. But now? Even if one player out of a few dozen start something with me, and I fight back, the other two dozen or so jump in. It's pointless. And this problem can only be solved by Blizzard itself.
Blizzard either needs to start with server merges. There are servers out there with ridiculously imbalanced populations in the opposite direction. Simply merge them with us. However, since the "merge" word causes the suits to freak out, I'd be happy with faction-specific transfers with one or more of these servers - allow Horde to transfer here, and allow Alliance to transfer off. Blizzard is very obviously trying to merge servers without actually merging them as that is a very bad word for publicity. Cross-realm zones and such simply don't cut it, and I don't understand why Blizzard doesn't apply the technology it has used in the past.
And the worst part? The biggest part of the problem is that most Horde players and guilds worth two farts have since not transferred off-server, but to Alliance, contributing to the problem doubly.
This is the most important thing in the server right now if you are horde.
Its Saturday 12:36 CST and my main is till 85 (2 bubble away from DING). I get less and less interested in logging in every hour.
One census says 8.1:1 Alli/Horde ratio for 85-90 characters but multiple pics in Jade Forest show 40-60 Alli with only 2-3 Horde standing in the area.
37% of all characters are Humans. No Horde race makes up more than 5% of server make up.
3% are BE, every other race is 1-2%.....
People say <--- PVE that way but those numbers are undeniable proof that its gotten out of hand.
But no one cares.... we should just keep shelling money out.
I would concur that Sargeras has an alliance favored population, and at this point I think I'll have to transfer the characters I have to another server if I'm going to keep playing them. I suspect many others have because of this problem which is just making it worse and will continue to do so until the horde is nearly empty.
Of the people I know from the classic days that still play, maybe three are still on Sargeras Horde. A few transferred off, but most damning is that most simply went Alliance, compounding the problem twice over. The problem was exemplified with the release most seriously, and I know of a few instances in which people transferred off because they simply couldn't play the game.
Cross-realm zones aren't fixing this problem. World PvP, I can deal with that. A lot of people can. But the recruitment pool for both raiding and ranked PvP is absolutely abysmal. There simply isn't any new blood out there. Existing teams and guilds are stunted, and they leave the server out of frustration.
I have no idea how Blizzard allowed this to get so far out of control.
Indeed, we are outnumbered quite greatly. http://www.warcraftrealms.com/census.php?serverid=38 quite clearly shows, and while I'm sure these numbers aren't completely accurate, anyone whos been questing in Pandaria the last few days won't need convicing (horde or alliance). My friends and I in Hot Magic started on this server the week it came out, and from what I remember back in 04 and a few years after it was pretty fair numbers.
Because of this imbalance, I feel many Horde are playing with friends on other servers via Real ID, or leveling in instances, or just playing Monks/waiting, hoping that CRZ comes to Pandaria soon...making the influx out in Pandaria that much worse. Even if you do ever get into a 1v1 situation, other alliance are 50 yards away in every direction and they just end up running over there - looking like you're trying to gank them when you most likely never started the fight! :P
My fiance and I both have a handfull of characters that we are planning to level up, probably like most of us around here, and our temporary solution was just to transfer 1 toon each to a PVE realm and invite eachother's Sargeras characters onto it via Real ID. I struggled with doing it since I really hate to feed Blizzard money, ultimately rewarding them for letting stuff get so out of hand... but I felt I just wasn't going to enjoy the expansion otherwise. I realize its a pvp server, and I do enjoy the occasional skirmish out in the middle of a quest (rarely will I start a fight unless someones trying to pick up some mines that I had an interest in, or stealing quest items right from under me while I'm killing the mob necessary to reach it) but there really is no world PVP to enjoy on Sargeras Horde in Pandaria. It's just a bummer to see how far Sarg Horde has fallen, and as much as I don't want to completely transfer off of this server I've been seriosly milling it around in my mind. Are the daily areas as bad as it is leveling during peak hours on the server too? Kinda wanted to hit 90 before I made my decision to stay or leave on this once badass server :D
I will admit, I switched over to Horde for about a year after being on Sargeras Alliance for 4 years. I enjoyed it but even mid Cataclysm it was dead compared to Alliance side. When I switched back to alliance, one early morning, 7ish, midweek I actually walked into Orgrimmar and took a SS standing in front of Garrosh's building on a sandbox tiger and walked out.
I FULLY support Blizz offering Horde free xfer to Sargeras. I wish they would. I miss BC ratio days. That's why I started on a PVP server, for added excitement when questing and traveling. That doesn't exist anymore. Alliance really don't have any reason whatsoever to fear traveling or incentive to grp quest...horde simply do not pose a danger...a few start killing people and bam, 20 alliance show up.
And I'll be honest, to those horde that have stuck it out, good job guys. I was happy...HAPPY to see a couple Seraphim people jump me today and commented in GC that it was good to see those guys running around ganking like during the Shattered Sun dailies....they still are bads and didn't take me down, but they tried, and that is what matters.
Thanks to those that have stayed. Hopefully Blizz will make an attempt to reinstate some semblance of faction balance through some means soon.
Final thought...I don't think Blizz will address this issue anytime soon. Free transfers from here wouldn't help I'd think since I have a feeling a lot of horde would leave. I think if Sargeras wants to fix the problem, players may have to address it. Start recruiting on other boards, offer w/e benefits...some type of campaign to bring over horde players from elsewhere, maybe even whole guilds.
Edited by Ieyasu on 9/30/2012 11:32 PM PDT
i ended up xfering off when it took me 30 mins and 20 deaths to complete 1 quest and try to turn quest in i dont mind pvp and dying a few times it happens but when i cant even quest because i see 30 red name plates and no greens sitting in quest hubs
They should allow all Illidan alliance to go to Sargeras Alliance and All Sargeras Horde to go to Illidan Horde. Since they don't want to fix it they should at least offer some remedy. Then using CRZ its like having alliance vs horde on a fairly equal spectrum.
EDIT: I see a lot of alliance saying the horde need to fix it. I just thought of a great campaign. We could start National No Alliance Week. For one week every month alliance don't play at all so we can do some questions, some farming, and actually build up an economy and the required levels to have a chance to recruit other places.
It is hard to recruit when its impossible to quest.
"Hey join my server we can't quest, we can't farm mats, we can't go outside of capital cities, its a great server I promise"
So what do you say Sargeras alliance? The first week of every month starting Today every single Alliance on sargeras logs of the game and rests their eyes. Play a Horde alt or something?
Second Edit: We could sign a petition for Blizzard to LOCK the alliance side of the server? Yeah Alliance would hate it but they aren't helping the problem anyways (always welcoming newcomers). If they locked it there would be no more new alliance characters forcing them to make alts etc. This should be a feature automatically implemented into all wow servers. Once the ratio gets worse than X say 25/75 they should automatically lock the high side.
Wouldn't be that bad at all if people remember the vanilla days when whole entire servers were locked because they were full...
Edited by Stagnate on 10/1/2012 1:19 PM PDT
I love that you blame us for "welcoming newcomers" as if we were some kind or realm transfer border patrol that should have kicked out all the immigrants. This server isn't even remotely as overpopulated and skewed as Illidan or Mal'Ganis, and yet Blizzard has let them stay that way for years.
I sympathize with you guys and the problems you have recruiting and questing on this server, but you don't exactly make a good case when you come on the forums ranting and pointing fingers.
Edit: Also, Welcome Midwinter.
Edited by Boomkanye on 10/1/2012 2:06 PM PDT
I love that you blame us for "welcoming newcomers" as if we were some kind or realm transfer border patrol that should have kicked out all the immigrants. This server isn't even remotely as overpopulated and skewed as Illidan or Mal'Ganis, and yet Blizzard has let them stay that way for years.You are Alliance. You are in Seriously Casual. You cannot sympathize.
We finally made the decision to transfer off Sargeras and over to Thrall last week. It was a very difficult decision for me to make as GM. It was a difficult decision for many of us to make.
As I said earlier in this thread, we've been here since Day 1. Always Horde. We have many memories, and many close attachments to the Sargeras server. However, when we stopped and looked around, nearly all of the people we used to play with have either stopped playing, moved to other realms, or switched to Alliance (traitors). It was time for us to make OUR OWN decision and not be chained back to the past.
A level 1 version of Obsidian Spur remains on Sargeras, but it will become empty as time passes. I'm slowly shutting it down and have cut off recruitment on Sargeras. However, it will remain as an epitaph of our love for Sargeras. My alt warrior Akumas is the current GM of the level 1 shell.
All of our core members decisively and successfully made the tranfer to Thrall. It was a big success for all of us, and we are very happy to finally be on a Horde-healthy server. Hell, a bunch of non-core members made the move, too. People wanted to get the hell off Sargeras. On Thrall there are lots of guilds, auction house goods, crafters, raids groups, and socializing. There's NO ganking. I can't tell you how amazing it is to work on pets, quests, raids, archeology, fishing, farming, whatever the hell you want, without getting ganked and/or swarmed by two, three, four Alliance at a time. After playing on Sargeras PvP for 7-8 years, this is a very, very nice change for all of us now on Thrall. We are REALLY enjoying the game again.
For reference, Thrall is the second-largest PvE server in terms of Horde population, with Area 52 coming in ahead at #1. We decided on Thrall due to this "not so ridiculously packed" environment. Lots of turnover, queues, and kids on Area 52. In the long-haul, we believe that Thrall will be a safe bet since it's #2 Horde for a PvE realm. And yes, we ARE able to consistently clear world bosses on Horde side, something that will be nearly impossible on Sargeras due to massive server imbalance and low Horde population.
I want to offer all you Horde a place to move to if you decide to come to Thrall. All are welcome in our gaming community, and if you want to have a special tie back to Sargeras, you can do that with us. If you're willing to take the same step we did, we'll be waiting for you. Once you do it, you'll gasp a sigh of relief, just like we all did.
If you want our Mumble or website info, just let me know. I would like to talk to you, as well as get to know you, as fellow Horde from Sargeras.
GM of Obsidian Spur
Edited by Wretchedmist on 10/6/2012 2:19 PM PDT
I was telling the few people that I still play with that horde had no future on this server. I played very little in Cata and I was horde for a while and our small group had trouble filling 10 mans with Pugs because there just weren't people around and once we transferred again to alliance, we could fill it up in no time.
Back in MM's prime in The end of vanilla and BC, we recruited from other servers. The reason for this was because there were a lot of horde guilds that were so close knit VoS, The Turks, Obsidian Spur, Bunny Slayers. That brought attention to horde on Sargeras. I must admit that the downfall of MM, TMO ( although still around), The Turks. Was the creation of Verge and later Invalid. Having such close Horde guilds on Sargeras in turn led to tension between former MM and TMO/Turks members. Which in turn led to the downfall of Horde guilds with Faction Change option opening up. In the Middle of WOTLK we started having some recruitment problems. By the time ToGC came out it was getting worse. When a core group is us transferred and joined SC, raiding became extremely difficult for horde. But I think it started to get worse when I proposed the idea of guild merger back in sun well, as there was a lot of tension that eventually unfolded from merging guilds.
I don't really see a future at all for horde on this server and I doubt blizzard will do anything about it, but I really wish that I was dead wrong.
I will continue to do as I have always done; slay the Horde mercilessly whenever I see them.
I will do this because I refuse to coddle those who cry over the imbalance. I want to embody the spirit of Sargeras and continue the tradition of a PvP server... which is something that may very well aid in the eventual and complete downfall of Sargeras Horde.
So be it. It's how anything in the real world would have happened. Someone starts to get a leg up against their competition, and suddenly everyone flocks to the winner's group. That grows exponentially. Think of adding more and more weight to one side of a scale; the one side will fall faster and faster until it hits the desk. This is what happened on Sargeras.
What we really need is to take servers and mash them together. Blizzard should really invest some time into making servers able to carry a double load so they can combine servers with high/low alliance/horde populations. Whether or not that is possible/feasible is beyond me. But I miss when ganking one horde caused those chain reactions we all came to love.
"Gank me, will you. Let me get on my main."
/g plz come help horde ganking STV
Dailies are already overcrowded and miserable. World bosses have zero challenge because people camp them all day with 100+ people. Right now we basically have a server infested with scumbags and we don't even have the option to kill them. The last thing we need is more people.
I still think servers like Illidan and Sargeras will eventually need to be split, unless Blizzard figures out how to use CRZ to split up overcrowded zones like they originally said they would.
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