MoP 5.4 Elemental Guide: Zap that Orc!

90 Troll Shaman
9095
I'd like to quote a post from MMO-Champion to get some more possible info.

Hey folks,

So I know in the guide troll is listed as slightly above orc which is above panda in terms of the top racials, however I'm looking for a little more in depth analysis. I'm looking at race changing out of Panda for the theoretical dps increase, but i'm having trouble justifying the benefits of troll and orc when looking at this in a more practical manner.

For troll, the optimal time to pop berserking would be with ascendance, but on fights where my guild uses lust on the start i would have to waste berserking (because i'm already hitting the haste cap on LvB) in order to keep it timed with ascendance. Waiting to pop berserking after lust would push back my ascendance by the duration of lust.

For orc, having blood fury on a 2 minute CD would mean delaying its use by 1 minute in order to time it with my second ascendance at the 3 minute mark of the fight, and then again to hit ascendance at the 6 minute mark. alternately I use it on CD and don't have it up for the second ascendance.

The only drawback for Panda is that if you die and ank/get a brez, you lose the food buff altogether and waste the racial completely.

Does anyone have an opinion on this? Any considerations to swing my vote in a specific direction? Thanks.
Reply Quote
90 Draenei Shaman
16690
11/28/2012 03:20 PMPosted by Sypie
I'd like to quote a post from MMO-Champion to get some more possible info.


You repost it in the one on totemspot? Binkenstein (who resides primarily at totemspot and is a co-author of the guide) is the one who did the math on it and I don't see that he left it out anywhere (even on the admin boards sadly) for me to reference here.

So far as your argument for Orc specifically goes though, we had this same argument but about Elemental Mastery instead 3-4 pages back (read from post #198 onwards.) It'll be better dps to use it on cd and have it up for every other Ascendance than it would to save it and have it up for each Ascendance.
Reply Quote
90 Draenei Shaman
10185
hey, just wondering if there is a mastery "cap" point?
Reply Quote
90 Draenei Shaman
16690
12/01/2012 11:12 PMPosted by Retrosia
hey, just wondering if there is a mastery "cap" point?


It's possible that mastery *caps* at 100%, but nobody really knows for sure as we haven't had that kind of stat inflation yet.
Reply Quote
100 Troll Shaman
3630
Hey folks,

So I know in the guide troll is listed as slightly above orc which is above panda in terms of the top racials, however I'm looking for a little more in depth analysis. I'm looking at race changing out of Panda for the theoretical dps increase, but i'm having trouble justifying the benefits of troll and orc when looking at this in a more practical manner.

For troll, the optimal time to pop berserking would be with ascendance, but on fights where my guild uses lust on the start i would have to waste berserking (because i'm already hitting the haste cap on LvB) in order to keep it timed with ascendance. Waiting to pop berserking after lust would push back my ascendance by the duration of lust.


Hi there, just to give you another perspective on the matter. From personal experience, I only use ascendance around 3 times per fight because most of the boss encounters are less than 9 minutes. If that is the case, it is perfectly fine to delay your 2nd ascendance by 45 seconds! As long as you have 3 hasted ascendance cds, you will be fine!


For orc, having blood fury on a 2 minute CD would mean delaying its use by 1 minute in order to time it with my second ascendance at the 3 minute mark of the fight, and then again to hit ascendance at the 6 minute mark. alternately I use it on CD and don't have it up for the second ascendance.

If you're taking elemental mastery, its better to stack Blood Fury with Elemental Mastery and Ascendance. The reason is because you'll get so much more lava burst casts(around 4 more lava bursts compared to an Ascendance without Elemental Mastery), and with crits doing 250% dmg combined with the 10% from elemental mastery and the 120% lava burst spellpower coefficient compared to Lightning Bolt's ~75% coefficient.

Alternativly, you can run a scenario where you pop blood fury at minutes 0, 3, 5, 7 and pop Ascendance at 0,3,7.


Does anyone have an opinion on this? Any considerations to swing my vote in a specific direction? Thanks.

Go troll. You can take berserking and talent into echo of elements.
Edited by Hacpe on 12/2/2012 6:20 PM PST
Reply Quote
90 Troll Shaman
12580
Since I decided to show off my UI again I might as well relink my PAs for anyone who wants them since apparently that was in demand, although the searing totem placement probably has to be redone since I imagine it'd be in an odd spot for most.

http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/6017/wowscrnshot120512233749.jpg

Elemental auras

Set=Elemental@
Aura[1]=Version:4.23.11; b:0.0196; icon:Spell_Nature_LightningShield; buffname:Lightning Shield; r:0; stacks:5; owntex:true; stacksOperator:=; combat:true; size:0.3; y:-140@
Aura[2]=Version:4.23.11; b:0; g:0.9333; icon:Spell_Nature_LightningShield; buffname:Lightning Shield; stacks:6; owntex:true; stacksOperator:=; combat:true; size:0.3; y:-140@
Aura[3]=Version:4.23.11; b:0; g:0.0627; icon:Spell_Nature_LightningShield; buffname:Lightning Shield; stacks:7; owntex:true; stacksOperator:=; combat:true; size:0.3; y:-140@
Aura[4]=Version:4.23.11; icon:shaman_talent_elementalblast; buffname:Elemental Blast; x:-90; bufftype:15; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; combat:true; size:0.3; y:-140; texmode:2; ismounted:0@
Aura[5]=Version:4.23.11; icon:Spell_Shaman_LavaBurst; buffname:Lava Burst; x:90; bufftype:15; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; combat:true; size:0.3; y:-140; ismounted:0@
Aura[6]=Version:4.23.11; icon:Spell_Fire_ElementalDevastation; buffname:Ascendance; texture:45; alpha:0.1; owntex:true; size:0.75; y:970; timer.h:1.98; timer.enabled:true; timer.y:-140; timer.x:75@
Aura[7]=Version:4.23.11; target:true; icon:Spell_Fire_FlameShock; buffname:Flame shock; x:160; isAlive:0; bufftype:2; owntex:true; mine:true; inVehicle:0; size:0.2; y:-203; ismounted:0; targetfriend:true; timer.h:1.1; timer.enabled:true; timer.y:-205; timer.x:152@
Aura[8]=Version:4.23.11; icon:Spell_Fire_SearingTotem; buffname:Searing/Magma/Fire; x:330; bufftype:19; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; size:0.5; y:-477; ismounted:0; timer.h:2; timer.enabled:true; timer.y:-480; timer.x:318@
Aura[9]=Version:4.23.11; icon:spell_shaman_lavasurge; buffname:Lava Surge; alpha:0.45; owntex:true; duration:0.5; size:0.65; y:0@

Buffs

Set=Buffs@
Aura[49]=Version:4.23.11; icon:Spell_Shaman_SpiritLink; buffname:Jade Spirit; x:-434; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; size:0.2; y:-203; ismounted:0; timer.h:1.1; timer.enabled:true; timer.y:-205; timer.x:-442@
Aura[50]=Version:4.23.11; icon:trade_alchemy_potiond4; buffname:Potion of the Jade Serpent; x:-379; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; size:0.2; y:-203; ismounted:0; timer.h:1.1; timer.enabled:true; timer.y:-205; timer.x:-387@
Aura[51]=Version:4.23.11; icon:Spell_Shaman_ElementalOath; buffname:Synapse Springs; x:-324; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; size:0.2; y:-203; ismounted:0; timer.h:1.1; timer.enabled:true; timer.y:-205; timer.x:-332@
Aura[52]=Version:4.23.11; icon:inv_misc_pvp_trinket; buffname:Quickened tongues; x:-269; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; size:0.2; y:-203; ismounted:0; timer.h:1.1; timer.enabled:true; timer.y:-205; timer.x:-277@
Aura[53]=Version:4.23.11; icon:ability_mage_timewarp; buffname:Bloodlust/Time Warp/Hysteria; x:-214; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; size:0.2; y:-203; ismounted:0; timer.h:1.1; timer.enabled:true; timer.y:-205; timer.x:-222@
Aura[54]=Version:4.23.11; icon:ability_shaman_tranquilmindtotem; buffname:Stormlash; x:-159; owntex:true; inVehicle:0; size:0.2; y:-203; ismounted:0@
Reply Quote
90 Troll Shaman
10510
Thanks. I like your auras way better than Endus'
Reply Quote
90 Troll Shaman
12580
I'll relink them again when I update them. I've been running without a skull banner one like a baddy, but I'm anal with a clean UI and haven't decided how to fit it in yet, and just gone off when guildies say they're placing it >.>
Reply Quote
90 Draenei Shaman
16690
Added 5.1 rep gear to the BiS lists. Should be all that's needed for 5.1
Reply Quote
1 Tauren Shaman
0
Hey Gist, not sure how about or where to go to get this info but is there a way to check weapon rankings?

Like I know empress mace is top of the list b/c the sha touched gem slot equating to an extra 500 int, but how do the other weapons rank in comparison for normal and heroic versions i.e Amber-Shapers dagger, Protector's dagger, MSV mace, etc...?
Reply Quote
90 Draenei Shaman
16690
Could run a simcraft swapping in the different weapons on the heroic bis set.

If I had to guess it'd run something like this:

Protectors Elite dagger > Amber Shaper dagger >= Protectors Normal dagger > MSV mace

Amber Shaper dagger has slightly more secondary stats and a slightly better itemization, but Protectors normal dagger could win out for certain reforging circumstances like the trash drop bracers could beat out the Tayak bracers. Extra SP/Int on Protectors Elite dagger will win out over the Amber Shaper dagger.
Edited by Gistwiki on 12/13/2012 7:02 PM PST
Reply Quote
1 Tauren Shaman
0
12/13/2012 07:01 PMPosted by Gistwiki
Could run a simcraft swapping in the different weapons on the heroic bis set.
*shudder*

Alrighty, thank you for the info dude.
Reply Quote
90 Pandaren Shaman
9875
has anyone done any kind of simulations with the unleash fury talent and 2 piece set bonus? i imagine with a spec like that i could get every orb during the sha of fear encounter under the gazibos. pushing heroic progression im finding that if i dont find tricks as ele to be able to handle more mechanics or make up for the lack of utility i have my ele spec is easily replaced by a shadow priest. not complaining since i just go resto and do fine, just wondering if anyone has little tricks/ combos to help me pew pew, such as maybe using the unleash fury talent with more haste procs or something along those lines.
Reply Quote
90 Draenei Shaman
16690
12/19/2012 10:54 AMPosted by Rëflex
has anyone done any kind of simulations with the unleash fury talent and 2 piece set bonus?


So far as I can remember Binkenstein had done some with each possible talent setup in T14H BiS back when simcraft was in the 505 versions showing it was a good 3% or so behind the other two talents. If you want to go and repost this in the totemspot.com version of this guide you could probably get a direct answer from him.

At the same time, if you'd like to run said sims yourself there's a pretty good guide over there - http://www.totemspot.com/vb/showthread.php?t=6338

Is damage on the platforms specifically an issue or is orb-gathering the only thing screwing you guys up there?
Reply Quote
90 Troll Shaman
6660
To previous posts: Racials make little difference right now, so if you want a theoretical increase in DPS from race changing it's best you look elsewhere.

If your concern is that .03% (hehe) then I suggest you go troll.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Shaman
12710
To previous posts: Racials make little difference right now, so if you want a theoretical increase in DPS from race changing it's best you look elsewhere.

If your concern is that .03% (hehe) then I suggest you go troll.


Racials have always been like that.
Reply Quote
90 Goblin Shaman
12600
I usually dont ask this because im pretty good with elemental dps but wouldnt mind squeezing a few extra points out what should i be doing for talents (mainly 4th tier) and trinkets for my gear level. Keep in mind i do have access to Relic of Yu'lon and the Dominance Offensive caster trinket with my current gear level

Reason i ask is i wanna double upgrade my trinkets just need to know which ones i should really be using.
Reply Quote
90 Pandaren Shaman
6625
I usually dont ask this because im pretty good with elemental dps but wouldnt mind squeezing a few extra points out what should i be doing for talents (mainly 4th tier) and trinkets for my gear level. Keep in mind i do have access to Relic of Yu'lon and the Dominance Offensive caster trinket with my current gear level

Reason i ask is i wanna double upgrade my trinkets just need to know which ones i should really be using.


Talents are fine.

Relic of Yu'lon + Essence of Terror..

However, I would only upgrade Relic at this point, and wait til you approach points cap before upgrading the Essence, unless you don't think you'll get a normal version any time soon of course..
Reply Quote
90 Draenei Shaman
16690
12/24/2012 02:53 AMPosted by Blightah
However, I would only upgrade Relic at this point, and wait til you approach points cap before upgrading the Essence, unless you don't think you'll get a normal version any time soon of course..


Pretty much right on with this. For your other question the 4th tier is fine. AG should be stronger than HTT in Tier 5 in any situation where you can maintain dps while using AG. Projection overall tends to be more useful than CoTE.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Shaman
10510
12/24/2012 03:29 AMPosted by Gistwiki
AG should be stronger than HTT in Tier 5 in any situation where you can maintain dps while using AG.


This is something that I'm actually interested to discuss.

From a pure throughput perspective, AG is better. I can do about 1.1 million healing if I just macro it to Ascendance, and about 500k if just normal DPSing, and it's on a 2 min cooldown.

However, from a utility perspective, I'm slowly starting to move back towards thinking about taking HTT. A controlled healing cooldown sometimes can really help the healers pick up the raid. For example, dropping it while running on blade lord Tayak tornadoes or helping the healers recover from a double crush mistake on Garalon. HTT does about 950k healing, which is similar to AG, but as with DPS cooldowns, the fact that I can pop it when needed and it does more than AG is where the value of HTT comes in.

Right now, I have AG macroed to Ascendance, and basically it's either overpowered as heck (it lined up with massive AoE damage and I single handedly pick up the entire raid), or completely overheal (85% of the time).

Any input/experience from other raiders on this?
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]