The Alliance Deserves Better than This

90 Orc Warrior
8710

I am retiring this belf toon. It's back to a blue tabard and corpse-camping those knuckle-dragging, child-murdering, devil-worshiping filthy mutants until the people who play them, who find playing evil a more escapist experience than playing good precisely because of how sheltered they are, depart in frustration.


Golly gosh. That sounds a lot like the opinions I've been hearing from a lot of Alliance NPCs lately. It's almost like the recent highly-aggressive tactics by the Horde have steeled the Alliance into a sudden and violent faction pride, causing them to want to fight for their place on Azeroth.

Look. I get the whole "Horde Bias" thing; I played Alliance up until halfway through Cata, and going through the same level zones as my orc and seeing the love and care put into a lot of the Horde areas that I never saw in the Alliance areas was very revealing. When WoW began, the Horde got Thrall, arguably the most popular hero of War3; the Alliance got a little boy. That sucks on toast. There were a lot of things like that, some subtle, some not-so-subtle, that showed that Blizzard definitely had more love for the Horde.

But here's my thing; they get it now. They're trying to do better. When people complain about Southshore and Theramore being this huge "Horde bias" issue, I have to roll my eyes - because Theramore and Southshore are about the Alliance.

The Alliance has always been, and will always be, the goody good guys; it's their identity. If the Horde is a sword, the Alliance is a shield; they have no desire to conquer, they just want to protect their homes, their families, their people. So what does it take for the Blues to take up arms - to say enough is enough? Well...eviscerating two of their cities is a good start.

Jaina is the brilliantly-selected avatar for this. She wanted peace and harmony between the Horde and Alliance for a long time; it took Garrosh turning her home into a crater for her to say "No more. I want peace, but I will not stand idly by and allow you to butcher innocents. I will stand up for what's right." Southshore and Theramore exist to put the fighting spirit into Alliance players and to resolve faction hatred on both sides. As evidenced in the statement quoted above, the blues are ready for a fight, and they're the underdog. People root for the underdog.

I guess what I'm saying is Blizzard is trying; I'm fine with criticism if it seems like they have no idea what's going on, but by now they know, and from what I've seen, they're trying to fix it. It's not there yet, but they're making their way there.

If it's any consolation, I've been going through Pandaria as my orc and my draenei, and on the Horde side I feel...bad. I feel like my warrior should be in a big black cloak and a mustache, tying people to railroad tracks. On the Alliance side? Taran Zhu is judgmental, but he at least talks to you. On the Horde, all of his lines involve him not wanting you there. One of them is, literally, "Leave." The worst thing I've seen the Alliance do so far(MOP spoilers incoming) is keep some Pandaren as indentured servants, and this is mostly because the Ally leader is infested with Sha. The Horde offers trade with a city, and when they refuse, the Horde kidnaps their children and says "Soooo....we're keeping them until you trade with us." The scary thing is, that doesn't even seem out of character for the Horde nowadays. It's like Garrosh took a dump on the floor, and now Blizzard is sticking Horde players' noses in it. Feels bad, man.

I'm not trying to say "wah wah, pity the Horde!" at all, as I said, we've had it good for a while. I'm saying that I think they're trying to make the Blues the heroes of this expansion, and heroes need something big and mean to overcome to have an interesting arc. In the past expansions, it's been Illidan, Arthas, Deathwing...in this expansion, I think it's the Horde.
Edited by Grenesh on 9/26/2012 9:06 AM PDT
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100 Tauren Druid
11055
I am retiring this belf toon. It's back to a blue tabard and corpse-camping those knuckle-dragging, child-murdering, devil-worshiping filthy mutants until the people who play them, who find playing evil a more escapist experience than playing good precisely because of how sheltered they are, depart in frustration.


You sound like a well-rounded, thoughtful individual. I'm so glad to be judged by someone as perspicacious as you.

Gimme a break. Go roleplay elsewhere, please. So sick of people taking this game so seriously that they begin judging the people that play the other faction. Perhaps My Little Pony is more your speed, hoss.
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100 Human Mage
9210
That was a little out of character for you, Bull. Bad day at work? *Offers hot chocolate with a big heaping spoonful of fluff on top.*
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100 Tauren Druid
11055
Out of character? Not in the slightest! That quote contained a blatant insult to players who enjoy playing the gray guy. The OP was little more than a childish rant - a glorified "I'm quitting" sort of post and I'm getting so sick of people resorting to insults to make their points.

We're a community here and we should be pushing back against these sorts of posts and recently I've resolved to start giving back as good as I've gotten.

I do appreciate the hot chocolate though - and no, no work today! Yay, I get to go and play some more MoP!
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85 Human Death Knight
9145
Life continues to be busy for me, but I managed to play through several quests on my NE priest main, and....

Wow, that was satisfying. I've joked in guild chat and elsewhere the past few weeks about murderizing some Horde, but I didn't expect it to be so fulfilling, inasmuch as playing a MMO can be so. Especially when it was in order to rescue wee pandaren cubs taken hostage.

And the sniping. Oh, the sniping. Hee hee hee. This is fun.
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100 Tauren Druid
11055
09/26/2012 09:22 AMPosted by Götz
Wow, that was satisfying. I've joked in guild chat and elsewhere the past few weeks about murderizing some Horde, but I didn't expect it to be so fulfilling, inasmuch as playing a MMO can be so. Especially when it was in order to rescue wee pandaren cubs taken hostage.


I felt similarly as I was freeing indentured pandaren slaves. One of them said to me "I'm so thirsty...."

I felt bad and took it out on the nearest Alliance soldier :/
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
11915
And the sniping. Oh, the sniping. Hee hee hee. This is fun.


best quest ever, with the exception of the gnome one where you run them over with a gigantic ball of fire.
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100 Human Warrior
6370

Guild Wars 2 has been quite fun though.


Elenie plays GW2? yay!

As for the OP, I seriously wonder if people that write these posts ever played Vanilla WoW.
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85 Human Death Knight
9145
09/26/2012 09:26 AMPosted by Bullcowsby
Wow, that was satisfying. I've joked in guild chat and elsewhere the past few weeks about murderizing some Horde, but I didn't expect it to be so fulfilling, inasmuch as playing a MMO can be so. Especially when it was in order to rescue wee pandaren cubs taken hostage.


I felt similarly as I was freeing indentured pandaren slaves. One of them said to me "I'm so thirsty...."

I felt bad and took it out on the nearest Alliance soldier :/

I'll see your soldier and raise you three warlocks!

09/26/2012 09:27 AMPosted by Shaithiss
And the sniping. Oh, the sniping. Hee hee hee. This is fun.


best quest ever, with the exception of the gnome one where you run them over with a gigantic ball of fire.

I wish that one had been a daily quest back in Cata. I would have done it all the time.
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90 Dwarf Warrior
14765
Southshore (is) about the Alliance


Oh, right. That's why the Alliance has 0 quests dealing with Southshore, right?
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100 Tauren Druid
11055
09/26/2012 09:38 AMPosted by Götz
I'll see your soldier and raise you three warlocks!


Haha, you win :/
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100 Human Mage
9210
Out of character? Not in the slightest! That quote contained a blatant insult to players who enjoy playing the gray guy. The OP was little more than a childish rant - a glorified "I'm quitting" sort of post and I'm getting so sick of people resorting to insults to make their points.

We're a community here and we should be pushing back against these sorts of posts and recently I've resolved to start giving back as good as I've gotten.

I do appreciate the hot chocolate though - and no, no work today! Yay, I get to go and play some more MoP!


Ah, fair enough.

Anyways, despite the tone or insults in the first post, I don't see a reason why this thread can't be more productive. The Alliance needs a story that is independent of the Horde, even if the Horde becomes entangled in that story, much as the Horde had a story of needing resources, despite the Alliance becoming entangled in that story in the form of the war.
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90 Human Paladin
8315
At the end of the day, the main problem I have is that, as stated many times, the Alliance seems to have little going on rather than being a foil for the Horde. It seems that anyone wearing blue is more or less standing around for a Horde NPC to show how truly and wonderfully epic they are by not only single handedly defeating them in combat, but probably seducing their husband/wife and having a better car.

While I understand that sometimes you just have to bite the bullet and take a loss, it seems like Blizzard has been serving the Alliance a multi-course feast of ammo surprise, complete with gunpowder ice cream lately. Look at it like this: The Alliance has pretty much not won a single meaningful victory since... well... warcraft II. And whenever the Alliance wins something, its not because the Might of the Alliance prevails over the horde, its because the Horde were too busy doing something else to care, or the victory was insignificant/hollow.

Basically, Im tired of Horde lore being thoughtfully developed while the Alliance lore stagnates, with major themes being ripped from it and made neutral so the Horde can enjoy it. That doesnt mean I don't want Horde lore to develop, but it means I want Alliance lore to actually go somewhere and standalone without acting as the straightman to the Horde's antics. Oh, and winning an actual victory here and there would be good.

And next time you have a blizzard event, pay me (or hell, I'll volunteer) to stand there and shout Alliance slogans at Horde players.
Edited by Arieus on 9/26/2012 10:23 AM PDT
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100 Tauren Druid
11055
09/26/2012 10:04 AMPosted by Elenie
Anyways, despite the tone or insults in the first post, I don't see a reason why this thread can't be more productive. The Alliance needs a story that is independent of the Horde, even if the Horde becomes entangled in that story, much as the Horde had a story of needing resources, despite the Alliance becoming entangled in that story in the form of the war.


Except I disagree with the premise that the Horde has an independent story. The Horde story in MoP is being driven by the Alliance, at least in Jade Forest so far.
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100 Human Mage
9210
09/26/2012 10:22 AMPosted by Arieus
Basically, Im tired of Horde lore being thoughtfully developed while the Alliance lore stagnates, with major themes being ripped from it and made neutral so the Horde can enjoy it.


The amusing thing is, many Horde players have voiced the opinion they really don't care to work with these neutral organizations at all, that they're, 'Too Alliancey.' I can't fault them for that either. Why can't the Horde handle situations in the Horde way? Northrend could have had the Alliance holding a major theme of the Light while the Horde fought fire with fire through the Forsaken.
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100 Human Mage
9210
09/26/2012 10:27 AMPosted by Bullcowsby
Anyways, despite the tone or insults in the first post, I don't see a reason why this thread can't be more productive. The Alliance needs a story that is independent of the Horde, even if the Horde becomes entangled in that story, much as the Horde had a story of needing resources, despite the Alliance becoming entangled in that story in the form of the war.


Except I disagree with the premise that the Horde has an independent story. The Horde story in MoP is being driven by the Alliance, at least in Jade Forest so far.


The Horde -does- have an independent story. Several if you want to get technical. The need for resources, a desire to find their place in the world and form an identify for themselves, etc... it has several independent stories. However, as often happens, those stories became intertwined with the stories of those around them.
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100 Tauren Druid
11055
09/26/2012 10:30 AMPosted by Elenie
The amusing thing is, many Horde players have voiced the opinion they really don't care to work with these neutral organizations at all, that they're, 'Too Alliancey.'


?

I don't really recall ever seeing this argument and especially in large numbers. I know I've said quite the opposite - that I enjoyed working with the neutral organizations.

09/26/2012 10:30 AMPosted by Elenie
Why can't the Horde handle situations in the Horde way?


Working with neutral organizations IS the "Horde way", depending on the Warchief at the time.
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100 Tauren Druid
11055
09/26/2012 10:31 AMPosted by Elenie
The Horde -does- have an independent story. Several if you want to get technical. The need for resources, a desire to find their place in the world and form an identify for themselves, etc


The need for resources is a superficial, undeveloped story. It's a background blurb that was used to initiate conflict between the Horde and the Alliance.

Their desire to find their place in the world isn't independent as the reason they can't is because of the Alliance.
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90 Night Elf Rogue
11450
09/26/2012 10:36 AMPosted by Bullcowsby
The need for resources is a superficial, undeveloped story. It's a background blurb that was used to initiate conflict between the Horde and the Alliance.


This is actually true. It's why "defending" the Horde is hard against those who see the Horde as pure evil. All of the reasons why Ogrimmar sucks are explained in books. Never in game.
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100 Human Mage
9210
The need for resources is a superficial, undeveloped story. It's a background blurb that was used to initiate conflict between the Horde and the Alliance.


Not necessarily, it was a major storyline for the Blood Elves in the Horde during Burning Crusade (the need for more magical resources to sate their addiction), it's been a massive storyline for the Forsaken in the creation and perfection of their Blight all the way through Vanilla to Wrath of the Lich King. The Horde has needed resources since it formed; to build Orgrimmar, to form, to complete their endeavors, etc... It existed well before the Cataclysm, and all that did was sharpen the need for resources due to drought, famine, and apocalypse.

Their desire to find their place in the world isn't independent as the reason they can't is because of the Alliance.


It was quite independent until they wanted the Alliance's place in the world. The Orc's did a great job setting up Orgrimmar in Durotar. The Tauren did well, establishing a home in Mulgore. The Dark Spear even did well with the Echo Isles. The issue comes with the Forsaken, and it went downhill from there.
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