Dark apotheosis? (Demon Hunting Glyph)

86 Worgen Druid
7350
You cant drop corruption or Hand of Guldan with dark apotheosis on, you have to turn it off and then apply it but you lose all of your stored demonic power in the process, although Demonic Slash extends corruption, i'm not entirely sure the purpose behind dark apotheosis, when seemingly you pull more dps without it and just using metamorphosis when demonic Fury is full, it seems a bit of a pointless glyph to me yet I've seen a lot of warlocks making use of it. If you're killing mobs you probably have voidwalker out tanking them anyways, and warlocks aren't exactly tanks, so the 500% threat genration was just confusing... to be fair i am fairly new to warlocks but I've been playing WoW for some time, and was just hoping someone out there could shed some light on the purpose behind Dark apotheosis.
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86 Worgen Druid
7350
one small amendment, the wings you get from having it on almost justify having it on when you aren't doing anything of purpose
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90 Worgen Warlock
5255
It's situational. When questing you will not use it at all.

In Dungeons and such it allows you to be able to off tank if need be. For example if the tank died you could turn it on and tank the mobs for a bit. It's not mean to be as effective as an actual tank but maybe close to a Fury Warrior or something tanking.

In PvP it's main use damage protection if you are heavily focused on. However like you said, your demonic fury does not transfer over and you will end up crippling your damage although you gain survivability.
Edited by Calissto on 10/9/2012 5:54 AM PDT
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90 Gnome Death Knight
4855
But don't you get that survivability almost the same in the form of the extra armour from Nether Armor in Meta form? From a PvP perspective, the extra magic resist and shield absorb doesn't seem worth screwing up your entire dps rotation and hard-earned Fury...

WTF is the point of this glyph?
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86 Worgen Druid
7350
But don't you get that survivability almost the same in the form of the extra armour from Nether Armor in Meta form? From a PvP perspective, the extra magic resist and shield absorb doesn't seem worth screwing up your entire dps rotation and hard-earned Fury...

WTF is the point of this glyph?


my thoughts exactly
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86 Worgen Druid
7350
with the exception of some extra utility in a situation you shouldn't be in to begin with... even if your tank were to die, a Warlock might (with a healer still active) buy a 5 man group an extra 30 seconds at the cost of being able to do any real damage, for raiders this glyph seems pointless, to serious RBG/Arena players it seems redundant... so with the exception of a 5 man dungeon mishap this glyph is literally only useful for the wings?
Edited by Holdsworth on 10/9/2012 6:08 AM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Warlock
0
I quest almost exclusively in DA form. It also saves lives when the tank dies.

That's what it's for.

Edit: Oh, I almost forgot. You get big, awesome demon wings.
Edited by Cross on 10/9/2012 6:08 AM PDT
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86 Worgen Druid
7350
I quest almost exclusively in DA form. It also saves lives when the tank dies.

That's what it's for.
.


If your tank dies a warlock with 15% more damage resistance from whatever the mobs you're facing can throw at you, and massive threat gen, doesn't seem a fantastic idea, tier 2 warlock talents have 2 option for aoe cc, one being a stun, the other a fear, i personally feel that it'd be more use popping either of those two options than sitting there getting my face wupped in 3 shots by a bunch of stuff i cant really damage,

10/09/2012 06:07 AMPosted by Cross
Edit: Oh, I almost forgot. You get big, awesome demon wings.


Yeah thats the good stuff lol
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90 Worgen Warlock
5255
10/09/2012 05:59 AMPosted by Dismalia
But don't you get that survivability almost the same in the form of the extra armour from Nether Armor in Meta form?


You do, but you can't stay in meta for long. Especially in PvP where it can be very tough to build any fury at all. You can stay in DA indefinitely. You also get the extra armor in DA as well so they stack. + the magic reduction which you mentioned.

Don't get me wrong though, I don't like/have the talent myself. It could be reworked.


10/09/2012 06:07 AMPosted by Holdsworth
even if your tank were to die, a Warlock might (with a healer still active) buy a 5 man group an extra 30 seconds


This is an exaggeration. We have very good defensive/healing talents and abilities. If a boss is halfway dead and a DA lock picks it up with a healer, in most cases the healer should be able to keep the lock up without having to spam flash heals.
Edited by Calissto on 10/9/2012 6:23 AM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Warlock
0
10/09/2012 06:13 AMPosted by Holdsworth
If your tank dies a warlock with 15% more damage resistance from whatever the mobs you're facing can throw at you, and massive threat gen, doesn't seem a fantastic idea, tier 2 warlock talents have 2 option for aoe cc, one being a stun, the other a fear, i personally feel that it'd be more use popping either of those two options than sitting there getting my face wupped in 3 shots by a bunch of stuff i cant really damage


I would hope that, upon tank death, your group is good enough to employ their respective class' crowd control abilities in the interest of staying alive. At that point, one or two heroic mobs aren't going to be a problem if you still have a healer and any of your long defensive CDs up, such as Dark Bargain/SacPact or Unending Resolve. That, coupled with the burst DF generating abilities of Felstorm/Harvest Life/Imp Swarm and Fury Ward, make a warlock in Dark Apothesosis nothing to scoff at for a quick save-the-day function.

This obviously won't work on boss fights with any significant amount of heath left on the boss, but what are you gunna do, right?
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90 Human Warlock
0
You cant drop corruption or Hand of Guldan with dark apotheosis on, you have to turn it off and then apply it but you lose all of your stored demonic power in the process, although Demonic Slash extends corruption, i'm not entirely sure the purpose behind dark apotheosis, when seemingly you pull more dps without it and just using metamorphosis when demonic Fury is full, it seems a bit of a pointless glyph to me yet I've seen a lot of warlocks making use of it. If you're killing mobs you probably have voidwalker out tanking them anyways, and warlocks aren't exactly tanks, so the 500% threat genration was just confusing... to be fair i am fairly new to warlocks but I've been playing WoW for some time, and was just hoping someone out there could shed some light on the purpose behind Dark apotheosis.


Hmm? You can use Corruption and Hand of Guldan while in DA form..

You do lose all your Demonic Fury going from DA to Meta form though... which sucks (it drops you down to 20%).

DA is useful because you get the damage absorbing shield, you get a knockback/interrupt on a 12 second CD, you get reduced damage taken (13%~ from magic and physical), you get to use Hellfire AoE and continue casting other spells (while in normal form, you have to channel), Shadowbolt becomes Demonic Slash which is instant cast (though the spell is bugged and only does 1/2 the damage listed... e.g. mine said 20,000 dmg and it hits for 9,000).

DA form is pretty good in my opinion for Pvp and leveling, less so for boss fights because you have to work around losing Demonic Fury when you go Meta.
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90 Blood Elf Warlock
7105
Many Locks will probably rage when i say this, but you probably wont see any experienced lock, that knows what he/she is doing using DA.

I understand using it for questing, this makes sense. Tank a ton of mobs and aoe them down.

For PvP, I have tinkered with different builds for DA, and the only decent one i could find was a flag carrying build. Otherwise if you are using it for "survivability" its a waste of a glyph IMO. Yes you can pop into DA, but you lose all of your DF, and when u pop back out, You lose all your DF again. This cripples you, and you are dead before you know it.

For PvE, It's just a waste. If your tank dies, then you either need new healers or a new tank. Locks shouldn't need to OT ever.

These are just MY opinions.
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91 Undead Warlock
12105
blizzard is obviously experimenting with the idea of legitimate warlock tanks.
DO WANT!

For you guys that haven't noticed, mastery increases the effect of damage reduction while in DA. This makes tank gear itemization possible. Trinkets for example that have mastery, and Use:dodge would be viable.
Remember also that in Demo spec, Dark Soul grants mastery, making it an additional defensive cd. Meanwhile we already have shield wall in Unending Resolve.

make sure you check your entire spellbook in DA, a lot of spells convert.
soul shatter -> taunt
twilight ward -> absorbs all damage
fear -> sleep, i think works on any creature type
curses -> auras with the same effects
Most spells that require Demon Form also work in DA, a few do not however

Pop Aura of Enfeeblement, dot up your targets, HoG, immolation aura, harvest soul, and bubble when you need to... profit
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90 Worgen Warlock
4450
Advocate for DA here...

1. Hand guldan does not use Demonic fury in DA stance. It still uses mana and so does corruption. The only thing that uses your fury is Hellfire and Soulfire. It does not use much mind you.

2. The reason we use DA is that with DA you can Main tank. Not off tank... Main... People who say you can't do not know what they talking about and are ignorant of what the skill does. I was one of them till I tried.

3. The other purpose for DA is that in PVP, the defenses that it gives are on TOP of what resilience gives you. So it is a very useful def glyph.
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90 Worgen Warlock
4450
blizzard is obviously experimenting with the idea of legitimate warlock tanks.
DO WANT!

For you guys that haven't noticed, mastery increases the effect of damage reduction while in DA. This makes tank gear itemization possible. Trinkets for example that have mastery, and Use:dodge would be viable.
Remember also that in Demo spec, Dark Soul grants mastery, making it an additional defensive cd. Meanwhile we already have shield wall in Unending Resolve.

make sure you check your entire spellbook in DA, a lot of spells convert.
soul shatter -> taunt
twilight ward -> absorbs all damage
fear -> sleep, i think works on any creature type
curses -> auras with the same effects
Most spells that require Demon Form also work in DA, a few do not however

Pop Aura of Enfeeblement, dot up your targets, HoG, immolation aura, harvest soul, and bubble when you need to... profit


Deleted comment because of Fail...
Edited by Mourgrim on 10/9/2012 9:43 AM PDT
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90 Worgen Warlock
4450
blizzard is obviously experimenting with the idea of legitimate warlock tanks.
DO WANT!

For you guys that haven't noticed, mastery increases the effect of damage reduction while in DA. This makes tank gear itemization possible. Trinkets for example that have mastery, and Use:dodge would be viable.
Remember also that in Demo spec, Dark Soul grants mastery, making it an additional defensive cd. Meanwhile we already have shield wall in Unending Resolve.

make sure you check your entire spellbook in DA, a lot of spells convert.
soul shatter -> taunt
twilight ward -> absorbs all damage
fear -> sleep, i think works on any creature type
curses -> auras with the same effects
Most spells that require Demon Form also work in DA, a few do not however

Pop Aura of Enfeeblement, dot up your targets, HoG, immolation aura, harvest soul, and bubble when you need to... profit


NOTE DA will not change your Fear if you have blood fear.
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100 Blood Elf Warlock
11235
10/09/2012 09:07 AMPosted by Mourgrim
NOTE twilight ward only absorbs all schools of magic.... NOT physical damage.


Fury Ward: All damage.
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90 Worgen Warlock
4450
10/09/2012 09:33 AMPosted by Baalsamael
NOTE twilight ward only absorbs all schools of magic.... NOT physical damage.


Fury Ward: All damage.


Correction taken and post fixed!
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100 Undead Warlock
6960
I've saved enough groups through tank deaths that i've lost count now. I've seen locks tank every normal Panda dungeon. I've tanked heroic bosses for the last half of their HP myself, and i'm not even specced/geared towards DA tanking. I have a second action bar set to the altered abilities for DA.

Questing: I tank while Wrathguard DPS's, was able to pull every mob in sight without fear all the way through 90.

You can HoG. You can cast corruption. Many abilities you may have never used become valuable tools.

Calling it useless when you (and i'm talking to all the haters here) have no idea about it because you've never used/researched it is just blind ignorance.
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90 Worgen Warlock
4450
I used the Void lord and he could tank elites with no issues...
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