Pet BreedingId explained with formulas :-)

(Locked)

90 Tauren Druid
10285
Now to figure out performance vs stat allotment. >.<


I'd imagine that comes down mostly to paper, rock, scissors...

Something like Speed > Power > Health > Speed
100 Gnome Warlock
16390
On top of breed Ids im also collecting now the rarity per species.... its on the page now where the breed per specie info is
100 Night Elf Druid
13260
I'm surprised from your data no one has found a rare Wanderer's Festival Hatchling yet. I assume they do exist.

The festival hatchling, a Garden moth, and the 3 dragon hatchlings from the cloud serpent faction are the only rare battle pets capturable in the wild that I'm missing.
100 Gnome Warlock
16390
The data is not a lot... its since yesterday evening... havent recorded rarities before that. So it'll take a week or something for more reliable data. Looks quite ok so far though
100 Blood Elf Paladin
20990
Now to figure out performance vs stat allotment. >.<


I'd imagine that comes down mostly to paper, rock, scissors...

Something like Speed > Power > Health > Speed


It's actually very dependent on the moveset (and therefore species). It turns out that CCs and buffs gain an extra "effective turn" if you move first because the buff and debuff timers do not decrease on the same turn they were cast.

That makes Speed very powerful for species that have certain moves. Of course, there are also the moves that hit for more (or hit more times) if you go first.

And then again, if your pet has moves that hit last, or has moves that always hit first regardless of Speed, then Speed is a waste of your points. Additionally, Flying species gain 50% Speed above half HP and this typically lowers the value of Speed for those type of pets (which ironically almost all have high Speed).
Edited by Simca on 10/20/2012 8:25 AM PDT
90 Human Hunter
5880
So we can effectively say that unless you're battling a similar pet, raw stats have very little importance, as countering the pet type and/or move set trumps a slight advantage in a given stat. So, having a 300+ (+50%)-speed flier is completely irrelevant against a 260-speed caster (assuming a full caster move set). Which would actually make the more balanced pets better in the long run, despite those 4/5/6s having a slight stat allotment advantage.
90 Goblin Death Knight
11925
10/20/2012 08:34 AMPosted by Jusi
So we can effectively say that unless you're battling a similar pet, raw stats have very little importance, as countering the pet type and/or move set trumps a slight advantage in a given stat. So, having a 300+ (+50%)-speed flier is completely irrelevant against a 260-speed caster (assuming a full caster move set). Which would actually make the more balanced pets better in the long run, despite those 4/5/6s having a slight stat allotment advantage.


But if said flyer has a dragonkin move, then it does matter. Getting the 1st turn (unless your undead) is a huge advantage. If the pet has low base speed, then yeah, I wouldn't want to waste stat points on speed. BUT, if it has good base speed, then yes, I would want +2 speed on just about any pet (good base speed being somewhere around 7+)
100 Gnome Warlock
16390
Jungle Grub indeed only exists as uncommon.... and ONLY uncommon :-/
100 Draenei Death Knight
5965
I may be wrong but I am going with "He who hit biggest wins the most." Speed does seem to me to be a waste of stats if it only decides that you go first and not your dodge or miss chance or something like that.

And with some of these one shot kill combos people are using it's seems again you have to hit really big and kill it. I feel they nerfed alot of shields and the heals are not big enough.

I am not doing the math on this. I am spending more time dueling. I see more big hit nerfs in the future.

Feel free to extrapolate or a word like that one.

Duel me!
100 Worgen Hunter
10000
Thanks so much for everyone's hard work on this. Now not only can I farm rares, I can farm specific breeds too... you guys have ruined my life! How can I do my dailies when there's so much pet farming to do now?

I'm not sure that the duplicates feature is working properly. It's showing that I have duplicate Fel Flames, Breed 6. However one is rare and one is poor quality. Is this how it's supposed to work, ignoring rarity?

I'm finding that 4/6/7 are my favorites to use :)
100 Gnome Warlock
16390
Yes the rarity i'm ingoring due to the fact you soon can pimp them to rares using stones...

BreedId and Species are the only values i'm using for duplicates... i'm also flagging gender differences still as duplicates... so a breed 6 rat and a breed 16 rat is a duplicate since they end up the same at 25.
90 Goblin Death Knight
11925
I may be wrong but I am going with "He who hit biggest wins the most." Speed does seem to me to be a waste of stats if it only decides that you go first and not your dodge or miss chance or something like that.

And with some of these one shot kill combos people are using it's seems again you have to hit really big and kill it. I feel they nerfed alot of shields and the heals are not big enough.

I am not doing the math on this. I am spending more time dueling. I see more big hit nerfs in the future.

Feel free to extrapolate or a word like that one.

Duel me!


Going first not only lets you get that first hit in (lets face it, even if you have more power I doubt you have enough to kill in 1 less hit), it lets you counter your opponent more effectively. Take a flayer youngling for example who has more speed as his raw stat. You can basically now reflect any charge up move you want, or counter those annoying burrow/lift off/dive/sons of flame moves, simply because you go first. If you had went second, you wouldn't see the move till it was too late. You'd be eating that charged uped panderan monk attack in other words instead of reflecting it in his face. Also, dodge becomes a lot more effective with going first. Not only do you dodge their attack that turn, but you'll also get to dodge the next attack as well. If you went 2nd, well, dodge is almost completely useless in those situations. You can't attempt to counter any charge up move and your just trading a turn for nothing at that point.

If I know a pet can get +2 speed and can outspeed most common threats with that, believe me, thats the choice I'm making, especially if it has a dodge/reflect/burrow/etc move. For undead pets, you could argue that it doesn't really matter as much because of their passive, but for everyone else it really is that much better.
100 Night Elf Death Knight
13015
I may be wrong but I am going with "He who hit biggest wins the most." Speed does seem to me to be a waste of stats if it only decides that you go first and not your dodge or miss chance or something like that.

And with some of these one shot kill combos people are using it's seems again you have to hit really big and kill it. I feel they nerfed alot of shields and the heals are not big enough.

I am not doing the math on this. I am spending more time dueling. I see more big hit nerfs in the future.

Feel free to extrapolate or a word like that one.

Duel me!


Going first not only lets you get that first hit in (lets face it, even if you have more power I doubt you have enough to kill in 1 less hit), it lets you counter your opponent more effectively. Take a flayer youngling for example who has more speed as his raw stat. You can basically now reflect any charge up move you want, or counter those annoying burrow/lift off/dive/sons of flame moves, simply because you go first. If you had went second, you wouldn't see the move till it was too late. You'd be eating that charged uped panderan monk attack in other words instead of reflecting it in his face. Also, dodge becomes a lot more effective with going first. Not only do you dodge their attack that turn, but you'll also get to dodge the next attack as well. If you went 2nd, well, dodge is almost completely useless in those situations. You can't attempt to counter any charge up move and your just trading a turn for nothing at that point.

If I know a pet can get +2 speed and can outspeed most common threats with that, believe me, thats the choice I'm making, especially if it has a dodge/reflect/burrow/etc move. For undead pets, you could argue that it doesn't really matter as much because of their passive, but for everyone else it really is that much better.


Reflect always goes second. Rather the effect goes second, but the animation always goes first. Speed does not affect reflect, because it does not have a round duration.

On the topic of speed you should only go for a speed breed when the pet has moves to abuse it like dodge or block, and if the pet is even capable of getting good speed. Like don't go for a speed breed turtle. A health based breed would be much better. Otherwise 4/14 and 6/16 are great breeds for the majority of the pets.

Oh and you better believe pets can kill with one less hit with enough power. My 4 breed Nether Fearie Dragon has 341 power and I get HUGE hits out of it consistently.
Edited by Oppressed on 10/22/2012 4:40 AM PDT
100 Gnome Warlock
16390
I've added the possible rarities to the Breeds per Specie page. So you have now in the overview what kind of rarities a pet can have.

Surprisingly.....
Clouded Hedgehog
Silent Hedgehog
Jungle Grub

seems to have ONLY uncommon versions

Looks like a bug on Blizzards side
90 Goblin Death Knight
11925

Reflect always goes second. Rather the effect goes second, but the animation always goes first. Speed does not affect reflect, because it does not have a round duration.

On the topic of speed you should only go for a speed breed when the pet has moves to abuse it like dodge or block, and if the pet is even capable of getting good speed. Like don't go for a speed breed turtle. A health based breed would be much better. Otherwise 4/14 and 6/16 are great breeds for the majority of the pets.

Oh and you better believe pets can kill with one less hit with enough power. My 4 breed Nether Fearie Dragon has 341 power and I get HUGE hits out of it consistently.


Your simply wrong about reflect. It can be used to stop a move in the same turn its cast, which is a huge advantage if you can go first. Not to mention that high speed allows basically 2 turns useage out of moves like dodge/phase shift.
Edited by Surrender on 10/22/2012 10:06 AM PDT
100 Troll Shaman
Hax
20395
Hey Warla, thanks for your amazing work on this.

Just wanted to let you know that breed 568 (Silkbead Snail) seems to be missing from your index of pets :)
100 Gnome Warlock
16390
Theres a bug with the armory... some pets like Wharf Rat etc arent showing up
24 Dwarf Hunter
6810
Is there any actual difference in appearance between male and female breeds with the same stats or is it just something in the code?
100 Draenei Death Knight
5965
10/22/2012 09:06 PMPosted by Ungorojoe
Is there any actual difference in appearance between male and female breeds with the same stats or is it just something in the code?


No, difference in breed ID's types from male to female like 4 and 14. one is male and one is female.
Now whether a pet has the corresponding female type is another story.
100 Gnome Warlock
16390
Dont know if you noticed.. i've speeded up the fetching of the pet list a little :-)
This topic is locked.

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]