Feral PvP

90 Night Elf Druid
6080
Hi Everyone,

How is feral PVP going for everyone now that some of us are at max level 90?

Are you experiencing all the survivability issues I heard talked about before MoP release? Also, hows the damage output?
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90 Night Elf Druid
10325
My damage output feels rather nice. It could be better, it still feels slow without berserk up, but the burst is pretty insane.

As for survivability.... It does feel kinda squishy solo. Nature's Swiftness and Predatory Swiftness making things castable in shapeshift form REALLY helps with survivability for the much needed healing touch, or a quick root or cyclone to get ppl off of you. Also nature's guardian is a lovely damage boost while berserk is up, and you benefit from the heal so it kinda helps too. But you can only live so long, even popping bear form and might of ursoc isn't as

However, if you have a healer that knows what he's doing, and you can keep people peeled properly, survivability is fine. Seems the game is still trying to get you to work as a team, pshaw! (/sarcasm)

I also find that I'm -super- reliant on symbiosis, however. For survivability, getting bubble off a pally or disperse off a priest helps a ton, and nothing beats 2 wolves from a shaman to support my burst.

I'm really comfortable pvping as Feral again, all in all, and I'd say it's in a pretty decent place right now. Just gotta get used to dieing if you try to take things on alone, but otherwise, really fun burst dps. This is just my opinion though, I could be playing it wrong and way off.
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90 Night Elf Druid
6080
Thanks for the input. I'm trying to decide which toon to focus on as my main this season. I've always loved my druid but am still considering either my SP or DK. Your post does make me want to start leveling my druid.
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30 Night Elf Rogue
5845
Yzara couldnt be more far off. We have some of the worst dmg out side of our 3 min cds in the game atm. Like feeling like a ret hitting like a wet rag when not using cds?Survivability dont even get me started a caster can kill a feral easier than any other melee in game end of story.As for symbiosis worst level 90 talent in game.

10/06/2012 06:10 AMPosted by Yzara
, and nothing beats 2 wolves from a shaman to support my burst.
lol ur joking right wolves hit for about 800 a hit lol.
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90 Night Elf Druid
7095
It's been said a few times, and by better druids than me, but ferals are decent right now once you get your feet under you. This generally includes:

1) Gear, gear, and gear. As I work towards my 4pc bonus, I feel like I'm lasting longer in fights with every piece I collect.

2) Pick your battles. You're not a dps/tank hybrid anymore. You've chosen to give up your huge armor multiplier in favor of burst cooldowns. Don't run into a 3v1 and expect to bleed 'n tank anymore. If you see a healer on the outside of a scrum, prowl around the scuffle and apply pressure on him.

3) Know your place. This kinda goes with #2 and it's sort of humbling, but hey, we're a hybrid class. You have massive self heals (NS+HT crits have been around 150-180k for me), a shield wall, and a couple OHSHI- buttons. Use your defenses early and often.

I'm sure there are more points to make, however, they'd take away from my fantasy football team that I'm already barely paying attention to this morning. Don't listen to the nay-sayers... at least not yet. Playing feral is like going to an AA meeting: "it works, if you work it."

Good luck.
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90 Troll Druid
11965
Ferals have some painful sustained DPS. Burst is only during Berserk, so, if they CC you during that, you've got none. However, you do have both sustained DPS and sustained healing support, even some ranged burst or healing during HoTW, and a well timed Cyclone is golden.

You just have to pick fights carefully (1v1 I don't fear anyone, I rarely lose to anyone but a BM hunter with cooldowns, just takes a sec to kill people with no burst and a good amount of setup for bleeds, so you have to be sure you'll have them to yourself for a minute), making sure you either get a true 1v1, or have the support of your team in BG's.

I haven't done Arena yet, but sustained heavy DPS with some well timed CC, and some Symbiosis emergency survivability should do the trick.
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96 Tauren Druid
Woe
19385
They are ok- some other melee is just too strong in general. Warriors outshine all other melee now significantly, and DK damage is probably too high by a bit.

Feral is nasty with cd stacking, but outside of those cooldowns the damage is not comparable to what warriors, dks, rets (although much less so), and bm hunter pets (heh) can do.

Having useful supportive heals is a nice change, though, although it's nothing compared to what ever other hybrid spec can do in offhealing outside of nature's swiftness. DoC helps with the healing, but you really need Nature's Vigil to consistently go after high armor targets. Trying to blow up a holy pally or even a shaman can be a very miserable experience.

Feral is fine, but they'll be more fine when some of the other melee gets brought back to earth.

I like the new 4set a lot.
Edited by Antipodus on 10/7/2012 11:32 AM PDT
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90 Night Elf Druid
7095
10/07/2012 11:30 AMPosted by Antipodus
Trying to blow up a holy pally or even a shaman can be a very miserable experience.


I was with you until this. No one class should be able to kill an equally geared healer without it being a "miserable experience." As it should be. If you were a healer and getting solo'd by a feral, you'd run to the forums and complain about us as if we were warriors, or something ;) While I was super stoked on killing a holy priest in AV last night, in my heart of hearts, I knew he was bad.

10/07/2012 11:30 AMPosted by Antipodus
Feral is fine, but they'll be more fine when some of the other melee gets brought back to earth.

This. This. And... you guess it, this. Comparing your feral damage to a DK or warrior right now just isn't apples to apples. Everyone is complaining about warriors, and there's just no way they don't get a late-night knock at the door from the nerf gestapo.
Edited by Nokooks on 10/7/2012 11:40 AM PDT
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96 Tauren Druid
Woe
19385
Trying to blow up a holy pally or even a shaman can be a very miserable experience.


I was with you until this. No one class should be able to kill an equally geared healer without it being a "miserable experience." As it should be. If you were a healer and getting solo'd by a feral, you'd run to the forums and complain about us as if we were warriors, or something ;) While I was super stoked on killing a holy priest in AV last night, in my heart of hearts, I knew he was bad.



There is a difference between "miserable experience" and "impossible 1v1 through any sort of competency". Bleeds comprise a significantly lower amount of our damage in PVP than they have in the recent past, and as such we are more bound to our direct physical damage. Rogues, Rets, DKs, Warriors (through CS) either ignore or mitigate a significant degree of a target's armor. As such, compared to those classes we are at a disadvantage to the higher armor classes. Although you can hardly complain too much about rogues as they are, the point stands.

Feral has the tools to dismantle most healers when they are forced to cast, however, with heals being bigger than ever and with more and more instants, hots, and instant ccs being added to healers, being able to kill a healer becomes more and more difficult.

On a side note, the priest you killed may not have been awful. Both healing priest specs are just terrible at the moment, in no small part due to blizzard for no real reason just removing the near-constant 20% damage reduction they used to get in pvp... on top of many other issues. Playing a priest in pvp at the moment at 90 is just intolerable.

The biggest problem right now is that dots aren't killing people because of massive and often instant heals... you have to have the burst to kill somebody. Even as feral it's no problem to land 120k+ ht crits on myself or even higher with NS. When your damage vs a high armor target is baked entirely into your 3 3 minute cooldowns, it is very frustrating. Playing against a good warrior and pushing him to low health means nothing when he sword and boards in dstance and his second wind starts ticking for 12k vs your 5-6k rakes and rips.

Is this good pvp design that burst overrides good cc, control, and gradual damage? Probably not, but stepping into arenas will find you surrounded with little more than BM hunters that can literally kill you through shield wall during a double deterence, and warriors who can do the same in a charge-shockwave stun.

Removal of burst damage also means burst healing and instant cc (or instant cc without windup, as we all love pred swiftness) can be toned down gradually, which would better increase the quality of play throughout the game.
Edited by Antipodus on 10/7/2012 12:01 PM PDT
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90 Night Elf Druid
10130
What Nokoots said is right. We're nerfed since 4.3 and now you have to re-learn how your class is played. We've been forced to have to play with a LOT more skill to be as effective.

We are a lot more squishy. Learn to run away and re-stealth a lot. Use defensive cooldowns early.

Our burst is good only during cooldowns like Berserk/Incarnation. Unlike other classes' awesome CD's, we are very CC'able during our burst periods, so yeah it can be frustrating to get stunned/slept/cycloned for more than half the time berserk lasts for. Then spend the next three minutes energy starved and tickling your target. I sometimes find it useful to flee, stealth, and try to get a little burst with a full bar of energy.

We still have a lot of skills from our hybrid nature that can be really nice in certain situations, but none of them are really damage related. But even still, learn to use everything your druid has, not just the Feral skills.

Other melee classes (except rogues) need considerably less skill to play and usually will be more effective in more situations. Avoid your feral for now. Play a Death Knight. Even when they get nerfed, it usually just brings them down from ridiculously OP to slightly OP.
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90 Night Elf Druid
7470
10/06/2012 11:53 PMPosted by Tisrael
We have some of the worst dmg out side of our 3 min cds in the game atm. Like feeling like a ret hitting like a wet rag when not using cds?Survivability dont even get me started a caster can kill a feral easier than any other melee in game end of story.


I agree completely... and before anyone decides to use the "wait until you're geared" comment, I'm full pvp gear with a pretty decent amount of experience in arenas/bgs.
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90 Night Elf Druid
7095
10/07/2012 11:52 AMPosted by Antipodus
The biggest problem right now is that dots aren't killing people because of massive and often instant heals.


Rather than quote your entire post, I'll just click like and tell you I completely agree. And the quote above is exactly what I've been thinking since my first PvP experience at 90. I can only hope we get better with gear, as we have (slightly?) thus far.
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96 Tauren Druid
Woe
19385
On a side note, has anyone actually been able to make symbiosis clash work? Either in PVE or PVP it's more buggy than even heroic leap has ever been.
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90 Night Elf Druid
6550
Feral damage atm is decent at best the burst is really strong, but any good team cc's your zerk+incarn and your damage is low again for another 3 minutes. Problem could be fixxed by making cd's shorter or making energy regen better. But Feral is still viable and an average class just like every other expansion.
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90 Tauren Druid
7095
here is a little clip, i know i know, im not glad so im not good, aside from that pish posh here is a little something, hope you like, if you want add me in game, tbouma516@yahoo.com. im making more videos too, of dif comps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFWCCrG2Xw8
Edited by Giveashift on 10/8/2012 6:52 AM PDT
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