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I have a few questions regarding PVP Holy Paladin (new to holy):
1. With hardly any instant casts or HoTs, how do you get heals off when you are being attacked by multiple targets? They interrupt and slow down the casting process..Ive noticed this to be a real pain.
2. Spirit, mastery, or haste?
3. My holy light has a long cast time and only heals for about 20-30hp..however this is supposed to be our main spell. How is a low healing spell with a long cast time our bread and butter?
5. Holy shock and holy radiance are the only spells that make holy power? Holy radiance has a long cast time and is expensive while holy shock has a 6 sec cooldown...any other (better) ways to generate holy power that I am overlooking?
4. General pvp strategies...?
Sorry for being a nub and thanks for the advice!
I'm not expert in Hpally, but I do know a little,
Your talents and glyphs are a bit, off but,
1. Practice fake casting, aura concentration to avoid interrupts, blinding light to cc a big crowd, try so position yourself so you dont get swarmed, repentence to cc one, HoJ to cc another, HoF to avoid snares, etc, you have a lot of tools to get out of some sticky situations
2. still early to decide, some people are going mastery, some going haste, others crit, try it out and pick what fits your playstyle more, faster casts? bigger heals? more bubbles-ish?
3. I rarely use holy light, flash of light, holy shock, wog, sacred shield, holy prism, are your main spells, divine light or holy radiance when you get the proc.
4. practice, don't get discouraged
5. You can glyph seal of insight, i think thats whats its called to have a 50% chance to generate hp when stuned and some other stuff, the 4pc pvp gear generates 1 hp when you spend 3 hp for wog, there may not be a "better" way, but we have multiple ways to generate hp, and its all about how you play too.
Don't forget to cast Beacon on someone, anyone near you. That way when you use Flash of Light, you get HP.
I tend to try to use instants only. SS, WoG, HS
If I have time and relatively safe, FoL. If you have time to cast HL, and it's enough to heal a target, they aren't getting beat on and you probably shouldn't worry about them. I only use HL after a fight and we are topping off ready for the next round (random BGs).
For stats, find what you like. Personally, I like crit for PVP. Big heals and bubbles.
Learn to hide, wait, etc. You do have a lot of tools to move around. Learn to not draw attention to yourself. If you are standing 30 yards away from the main fight, by yourself. You will be spotted and targetted. I like to be 10-15 yards away from the main action. Hell, I'll even go swing in the middle sometimes, just to avoid attention. Pop out instants and most people will think you are prot. With a sword and board, you can put up with a lot of melee hits. Don't stand in one place and spam.
Edited by Lindbergh on 10/3/2012 11:10 AM PDT
PvP is different element.
1 Spec in sancitified wrath for the 6 sec GCD on holy Shock, beacon yourself so when you flash of light you gain holy power. If the proc happens that reduces Divine Lights CD, use it over Flash of Light.
2 Never mastery, Haste = Spirit > mastery
3 Eliminate holy light from your mind. Think Flash of Light. Sure it costs you more mana, but whatever. This is PvP
4 Once again, always beacon yourself to gain holy power from flash of light.
5 Hand of Freedom when cleanse is on CD if you're trying to kite DPS attacking you, always Queue with a good DPS or two and make a little group to grab flag and kill enemies with.
Any other questions I'll keep an eye on the thread. Take care, bro
I have a few questions regarding PVP Holy Paladin (new to holy):
1. I'm confused. Eternal Flame (talent) is a HoT. Selfless healer alongisde Word of Glory and Holy Shock provides you with 3 instant-cast heals. You aren't a druid. The amount of instant casts paladins have is just fine. To stop people from interrupting you, read on juking (also known as fake casting).
2. I'd go spirit for more regen. More regen = more flash of lights.
3. Holy light is the main heal for PvE. For PvP you rely on beacon+flash of light to generate holy power, and then word of glory/eternal flame with holy shock as instant-cast heals.
4. CC their healers, try to stay out of sight/range. when you're alone, call for help and/or run towards other people. Even though you can survive against 1 dps (sometimes more than 1) attacking you, it's always best to be with your team.
5. If you're being attacked and holy shock is on cooldown, you can use crusader strike to generate holy power. Also, beacon+flash of light works great too.
Good this answers some of the questions I had.
So really right now there is no set standard for reforging except stay the **** away from reforging into Mastery? So essentially, always reforge out of Mastery?
Are there any goals I need to reach for Haste or Crit to make sure I am not going too far?
As far as Talents: I really like Prism as it is really another instant heal. Any reason to not use it over Final Execution?
As far as Glyphs: What do you feel are the top 3 and why over the other OBVIOUS decent choices?
90 Blood Elf Paladin
Good this answers some of the questions I had.
idk about stats, at the moment I think im leaning towards haste or spirit (probably spirit) just because we already get a base 25% crit on holy shock.
talent wise prism is king (for holy and ret), execution takes WAY too long to be relevant (the dot and hot is a joke) and light's hammer obviously isn't good in pvp, prism also does pretty sick damage for a healer as well as being incredibly mana efficient.
for glyphs I think turn evil is the only one thats necessary, keeping lock pets off of you is always a good thing, otherwise its just preference imo i like using denounce and flash of light but we really don't have that many good choices in the first place.
1. If you're being targeted by multiple people then my strategy is to run to the nearest helpful player. If other players aren't helping then you're kinda screwed.
2. For me personally, and I don't recommend this to anyone, but crit is more important - I like big heals regularly. That's my playstyle though.
3. I only use Holy Light if I'm not being attacked, and to top others off after fights.
5. I cast Beacon of Light on myself, and if you cast Divine Light on a beaconed target you get Holy Power - I find that increases my survival rates along with crit.
4. Work through a bunch of playstyles til you find one you like. I tried the pocket healer style (in that one you beacon your chosen monster instead of yourself), and group healer, then there's the "position" healer - find somewhere you like and learn how to defend it like a boss. Depends on the battleground too - now that we have no AoE we can't defend flags solo so you'll want to always be in a group.
A neat trick I have liked is to beacon someone who is or will be targeted. If nobody is following you get behind something you can then pop a CD or two and spam HL on yourself and get full heals on the beacon for awhile.
So let me get this straight (being new to Paladin, and not being able to get in the game in the past 24 hours), if you have Beacon of Light on yourself and cast Holy Light you get one Holy Power because of the heal hitting you while you have Beacon? So if you have a target that you gave Beacon of Light to and you decide to heal them directly instead of someone else (giving the Beacon'd target a 'free' heal) then you still get one?
I am sure it is in the passive talents or something, I just haven't had a chance to check it out.
I'd like to see the math on that one. I was under the impression it was more like 2:1 pvp power to int (basically, the hybrid gems). I've been trying to find some solid PVP info and I've been failing miserably.
Edited by Eisenhorne on 10/4/2012 10:19 AM PDT
Keep crusader strike on your bar. It still generates 1HP and gets you into the habit of being near enough to an enemy healer to get a clutch rebuke. Also, seal of insight gives you mana back when you melee.
Selfless healer is invaluable right now as it gives you a FREE and JUICED UP Flash of Light after 3 judgements.
In PvP, I only EVER cast Divine Light, and when I do - I go through a couple checks before I do so.
1) Do I have the proc from critting with holy shock?
2) Is my target below 50% health
3) Are my other instant spells on cooldown?
Word of glory tends to be my most used spell. In between the 4piece granting 1 holy power after you consume a 3 point word of glory, crusader striking people, and holy shocking someone - I generally always have 3 holy power.
Edit: I can't count lul D:
Edited by Ëve on 10/4/2012 10:29 AM PDT
Well, only been 90 since today, but a few general tips:
1. fake cast to eat interrupts. Once interrupts are outta the way, THEN you can hard cast. (Or if you wanna force a stun, you can Aura mastery and hardcast. They stun you, you trink, and then they have nothing to stop you from casting during and after Aura mastery.)
Don't forget you're own CC. You have blinding light, AoE silence, HoJ, repent, and rebuke. You can easily keep a healer controlled for the whole fight, or at least put enough pressure to force him/her to pop CDs or risk hardcasting.
2. Crit is my fave stat wise, followed by spirit and haste battleing it out. Mastery will never be as good as crit, seeing as how crit gives biger heals AND bigger mastery bubbles due to said heal.
3. Holy light only if it's a ridiculously easy fight (and if it is so laughably easy, why even bother healing? always needed somewhere else!) Divine light, HS, Fol, WoG should be what you use along with proper CD management.
5.(why number them out of order?) HS, crusader strike, bacon healing all provide for HoPo.
4. You get 2 mins before every fight...USE IT! look over your teammates / enemies. How many heals do they have? how many you have? adjust accordingly.
Also, use terrain to your advantage. Take WSG. If I am flag carrying and solo, I'll hole up on the roof. With Pursuit of Justice and repent/HoJ, I can kite allies around on the roof all day without ever having to heal. Conversely, if I'm healing the FC or offense team, I'll most of the time head to the small doorway everyone runs out of at the begining. Hardly anyone looks for heals there and even if targeted, it's a quick run around the wall to LoS. Find those places that help your healing and use them!
Finally, stay with 3 HoPo whenever possible. That should just be standard for PvP and PvE. Bad things happen. FC gets caught by allies popping CDs. Stealthies pop up and burst peeps down. (and keep your damn mastery bubble maxed out on the FC at all times!! Still in cata gear and it maxs out at 70k hp. Why would you NOT have a 70k+ bubble up whenever possible??)
Also, no one else has brought this up but with glyph of beacon of light (beacon of light off the global cooldown) you can easily switch to a target cast beacon then cast FoL or DL (with hs crit proc) to generate holy power. Only time I don't do this is if i need more spread healing.
But yeah as far as stats go
int=pvp power > spirit > crit/haste (not sure between these two yet) > mastery
and for glyphs I think the best for pvp are
glyph of beacon of light
glyph of harsh words
and the third is really not as big of a deal
I picked glyph of flash of light for extra throughput
Wow, first of all...thank you everyone for the awesome advice so far. I have read everything and have started to learn paladin healing (forgot to mention that I am a former resto druid, so the transition from instant cast hots to single hitting spells was very difficult). However, after having more experience..I have ran into some more questions :P
1. Sacred shield or Eternal flame? Which should be used in bg's and which is preferred in arena? Is it a strict play style decision or is there a clear option?
2. I have decided to reforge mastery and crit into spirit and haste. However, I have realized that this I still face mana problems and am thinking that maybe the lack of crit outweighs the increase in spirit (as i frequently go oom). Should I get my crit back and take the hit on spirit? ...Im assuming this is a play style decision, huh?
Again, thank you to everyone that has responded and I hope that this thread is helping more people other than myself
I found that mana in PvP will always be an issue. Fights are short and intense and you can't just sit back and be mana effecient. Part of it is healing strategy. Don't bother topping people off. Avoid overhealing at all costs during the fight. I aim to keep people between 70-80% if there are multiple targets I'm trying to keep up. Bottom line, keep everyone in range out of the execute range. If mana is an issue, you need to use HP and free heals more. Selfless Healer, Crusader strike, etc. Gotta keep those in the arsenal and mix it up. You have the armor and shield to stand up for a little while to most melee classes.
1) For me, I go with Selfless Healer. 3 judgements (18 seconds) and you can get a free, instant cast FoL that essentially is an autocrit due to the stacking mechanics. even at 1 or 2 judgements, you are getting a FoL at 35 or 70% cheaper with more power. Thats a lot of mana savings. Couple that with casting it on a beacon and you get a HP out of it at the same time.
2) It's playstyle. For PvE, spirit until you don't run out of mana and are comfortable, then I'm a mastery !@#$%. for PVP, crit. Since I'm not trying to keep people 100% and I'm usually hitting people who are at 50%, the crit is very rarely wasted, and results in a huge bubble regardless of mastery. Yes, I may run out of mana, but if I'm out of mana and my team (temp or regular) hasn't manage to better the odds, it isn't likely 1-2 more heals would have mattered.
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