Men v. Women - How socialization affects RP

85 Worgen Warrior
0
I thought we'd do a fun exercise today. Participate if you would like. Discuss or debate. But, please do not be hostile.

Required Reading:
http://i.imgur.com/0roOF.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/cx5Pn.jpg

Questions to answer:
  • How do you think our society and the socialization pertaining to gender is different from the races in Azeroth? How do you think they are similar?
  • Give an example of a lore character that is contrary to stereotypical gender role.
  • Give an example of a lore character that falls into a stereotypical gender role.
  • Why is this important?
  • How does gender socialization affect your ability to roleplay the opposite sex?
Edited by Systar on 10/3/2012 4:03 PM PDT
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90 Human Paladin
11665
10/03/2012 03:24 PMPosted by Systar
Give an example of a lore character that is contrary to stereotypical gender role.


Catherine Rogers.

10/03/2012 03:24 PMPosted by Systar
Give an example of a lore character that falls into a stereotypical gender role.


Garrosh Hellscream.
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90 Gnome Warlock
5965
Mely should be in here , possibly will be soon...
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90 Worgen Druid
10460
Night elf sentinels and wardens do pretty much spit in the face of most of these gender conventions, hah.
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1 Blood Elf Paladin
0
Awwww snap son, I like where this is going. >:)

Contribooting:

10/03/2012 03:24 PMPosted by Systar
Give an example of a lore character that is contrary to stereotypical gender role.


Sky Admiral Rogers. HELL YEAH.

10/03/2012 03:24 PMPosted by Systar
Give an example of a lore character that falls into a stereotypical gender role.


Hm, that's a tough one. Varian?
Edited by Iamgurvir on 10/3/2012 4:07 PM PDT
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85 Worgen Warrior
0
10/03/2012 03:55 PMPosted by Brutaria
Mely should be in here , possibly will be soon...


She would be welcome to join. I always enjoy her opinion on these subjects.

Gurvir, how is Tyrande contrary to a stereotypical woman?
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90 Gnome Warlock
5965
I'd suggest Mad in here too, but I have a sinking suspicion some people out there got him banned from forums again...
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85 Worgen Warrior
0
10/03/2012 03:56 PMPosted by Ferenold
Night elf sentinels and wardens do pretty much spit in the face of most of these gender conventions, hah.


Agreed. How do they differ from a society like Blood Elf?
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90 Worgen Druid
10460
10/03/2012 04:08 PMPosted by Systar
Night elf sentinels and wardens do pretty much spit in the face of most of these gender conventions, hah.


Agreed. How do they differ from a society like Blood Elf?


I don't think blood elves prescribe to conventional gender mores either, considering how hedonistic it is. I think the human nations most likely to have more traditional gender mores would be Gilneas, Arathor, and Lordaeron.
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85 Worgen Warrior
0
10/03/2012 04:20 PMPosted by Ferenold


Agreed. How do they differ from a society like Blood Elf?


I don't think blood elves prescribe to conventional gender mores either, considering how hedonistic it is. I think the human nations most likely to have more traditional gender mores would be Gilneas, Arathor, and Lordaeron.


Really? I haven't checked in a LONG while, but how many female Blood Elf leaders are there? How many female guards are there? This is all I can think of http://www.wowwiki.com/Ranger-General_of_Silvermoon Would really like to know these answers for science or reasons and stuff.
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90 Worgen Druid
10460


I don't think blood elves prescribe to conventional gender mores either, considering how hedonistic it is. I think the human nations most likely to have more traditional gender mores would be Gilneas, Arathor, and Lordaeron.


Really? I haven't checked in a LONG while, but how many female Blood Elf leaders are there? How many female guards are there? This is all I can think of http://www.wowwiki.com/Ranger-General_of_Silvermoon Would really like to know these answers for science or reasons and stuff.


That's true. But from what we've seen sin'dorei society seems to be one that is simultaneously authoritarian and hedonistic to some degree. Sort of like Brave New World. Remember that there are female blood elves we see out and about though, serving in the Argent Crusade and the like, being fighters.
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85 Worgen Warrior
0


Really? I haven't checked in a LONG while, but how many female Blood Elf leaders are there? How many female guards are there? This is all I can think of http://www.wowwiki.com/Ranger-General_of_Silvermoon Would really like to know these answers for science or reasons and stuff.


That's true. But from what we've seen sin'dorei society seems to be one that is simultaneously authoritarian and hedonistic to some degree. Sort of like Brave New World. Remember that there are female blood elves we see out and about though, serving in the Argent Crusade and the like, being fighters.


I don't think Argent Crusade would have any real specific ties to genuine blood elf culture.

Oh, also would like to hear from some trolls. I do not know anything about troll lore, but I have never seen any female troll figures.
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90 Worgen Druid
10460
To add unto my above point, I think that Arathor, Gilneas, and Lordaeron would have the most strict/traditional gender mores for the following reasons:

Arathor: Arathor is the first of the human nations, and hence is likely to have a tie to tradition as the other nation-states break off. Thus things like gender mores will not be quite as malleable.

Gilneas: Gilneas was described as having an ancestral bond to Arathor, and being a strong ally of Arathor. It's likely that Gilneas' had some Arathorian values. Additionally, the relative isolation of Gilneas already led to them preserving the old ways, it could very well lead to them preserving more traditional gender mores as well.

Lordaeron: This might be a bit of a stretch, but as the Light is somewhat representative of Christianity, I think it's fair to say a Christian that exemplifies the Light so strongly would have gender mores that are more conventional as well.
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90 Human Death Knight
13720
As far as blood elf female leaders go, Lady Liadrin, the matriarch of the Blood Knights, is one. She was also one of the major leaders of the Shattered Sun.

Interestingly enough, blood elves are the only Azerothian race with all male guards, though I say that's more developer laziness than anything. They're the "beta" blood elf models, too which are a sort of missing link between the older High/Blood Elf models from Vanilla and ones we know from BC on. Female sin'dorei are in otherwise fairly prominent positions as Blood Knights, Farstrider commanders, and Magistrixes. And Sylvanas, at very least, would be in position to stay as Ranger General or even Regent Lord if she was still alive. Lor'themar was her second in command after all.
Edited by Ceriseth on 10/3/2012 4:47 PM PDT
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90 Troll Warlock
12330
10/03/2012 04:27 PMPosted by Systar
Oh, also would like to hear from some trolls. I do not know anything about troll lore, but I have never seen any female troll figures.


Had to get on my big boy computer to type this out.

As far as we can tell, Troll culture is generally based off two real life cultures.

1) Ancient Mesoamerica (Aztecs and Mayans)
2) Various tribal cultures throughout Africa, mostly Sub-Saharan.

These cultures for the most part are incredibly patriarchal, as societies that make war typically are. However, the spiritualistic practices of the Trolls are not nearly as rigid as modern Western religions, which means -anyone- has the potential to be blessed by the Loa. In game, we find priestesses of the Loa, and as the Loa dominate the majority of Troll society, one can assume they hold positions of great importance. Hell, the High Priestess of Bethekk in Zul'Gurub is female.

Elders also appear to hold some importance, regardless of gender, which is typical of more ancient tribal societies.

There is a significant lack of female Troll leaders mainly because there is a significant lack of Troll leaders in general. We basically have:

Vol'jin
Zul'jin (loldead)
Rastakhan/Zul (which we know near nothing about)
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69 Worgen Hunter
1455
Lorna Crowley. Dat shotgun.

Let's GET'EM BOYS!!!
Edited by Shennae on 10/3/2012 5:45 PM PDT
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85 Worgen Warrior
0
Volkuza, thank you for your contribution, I feel like I am much more knowledgeable about troll society now.

What is interesting to me is that there are many examples of non-traditional women, but few really non-traditional male examples.

Can anyone come up with a few?
Edited by Systar on 10/3/2012 5:55 PM PDT
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87 Blood Elf Hunter
2870
10/03/2012 04:05 PMPosted by Brutaria
I'd suggest Mad in here too, but I have a sinking suspicion some people out there got him banned from forums again...


They are.

Anyways...

How do you think our society and the socialization pertaining to gender is different from the races in Azeroth? How do you think they are similar?
It depends on what race you play. Kaldorei seem to lean heavily on female empowerment, while Sin'dorei lean heavily on male empowerment. By that I mean most jobs/high positions are given to that gender.

Give an example of a lore character that is contrary to stereotypical gender role.

Tyrande? Perhaps.

Give an example of a lore character that falls into a stereotypical gender role.
Garrosh or Varian.

Why is this important?
You're able to add more information/traits to your character.

How does gender socialization affect your ability to roleplay the opposite sex?
I could never play a male believably. I'd make him too manly or too feminine.
Edited by Elivina on 10/3/2012 6:35 PM PDT
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90 Troll Warlock
12330
Volkuza, thank you for your contribution, I feel like I am much more knowledgeable about troll society now.

What is interesting to me is that there are many examples of non-traditional women, but few really non-traditional male examples.

Can anyone come up with a few?


Oh man, I'd have to go through piles of quest text to find a male Troll that didn't fit the stereotype of crazy powerhungry witch doctor, aspiring warrior, or grand warlord.

What I think is curious is how the Dark Troll tribe that became the Kaldorei transitioned into a female dominant society when they emerged from a society that was largely patriarchal. Was there something different about this tribe fundamentally? Or did Elune just decide to favor the females over the males. Perhaps a fertility/life Loa?
Edited by Volkuza on 10/3/2012 5:57 PM PDT
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