Carry that Flag Boy! Prot PVP FC Thread

90 Human Warrior
8205
The last one we had for Cata was really inspiring... anyone planning on building a pure FC?

I like how Mastery is actually on our gear now, no need to reforge as much.

What talents do you guys think will be good for FCing? Seems like Shockwave is the best choice due to stuns and Avatar due to.... its Avatar.
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100 Human Warrior
12555
I plan on writing a 5.0.4 Prot PvP guide once I'm less busy with hitting 90 and gearing up and have time to actually a) try out different setups and b) write the guide. I'll do a flag carrying/point defense one for sure, but since Prot may actually be viable as an offensive spec like it was in Wrath, I might also write a second one about offensive Prot PvP.
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90 Human Warrior
8205
Yeah be sure to post that, I know a lot of people enojoyed the one in Cata. I would really be interested in the offensive variation as well.

I have two prot specs, that is all I care to play, one has Shockwave, the other has Dragon's Roar. I like Dragon's Roar, it hits hard, but the cooldown is a minute and you just can't beat Shockwave's stunning ability.

I look forward to your guide.
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100 Human Warrior
12555
I'll try to make it as informative and useful as I can :)

I wonder if Blizzard realized that by putting in PvP Power to directly increase damage done to players, they indirectly recreated T10 Prot ArPen stacking. It's not quite as good now as it was then because we don't have the 2 piece Prot set that increased Shield Slam and Shockwave damage coupled with the 2 piece DPS set, but it should turn out interesting.
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90 Human Warrior
8205
Yeah, it won't be as good as the Wrath days when we stacked block (with Naxx gear no less) and ARP, but I agree it will be a big improvement for prot damage.

I just wish Vengeance still procced over players, but then we would be way too OP. Some of those Shield Slam crits were just insane.
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90 Human Warrior
8205
Also, with this new move, Shield Barrier, it seems the absorbtion increases with attack power. If +1 Strength still equals +2 Attack Power.... it may be worth it to use more Strength gems even for Flag Carrying due to that bonus. Then maybe we can have the same set, one for FCing and one for damage, with maybe only having to swap out trinkets...

That could be pretty cool, as stacking reslience and stamina is kind of boring.... not to mention it gimps you if you decide to do arenas.
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90 Human Warrior
8205
Well yeah you want to gear for survivability as an FC... but the in game text on Shield Barrier alludes to it increasing with attack power.

Once again, Blizz fails, you have to go onto a site to read what it actually does.

I was hoping I could stack strength and have one hell of an absorb shield for mitigation, but I guess not.

Back to Resilience and Stamina gems.
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100 Human Warrior
12555
I didn't mean gearing offensively as a flag carrier. I meant going in as Prot, geared for damage, with the intention to kill people. You'd trade some of your damage for survivability, as is always the case with tanking specs, and then work to get as much of that damage back as you can.
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90 Human Warrior
8205
Since you guys seem up on your math, what do you think we should be stacking?

In Cata, the FC PVP Guide on these forums made the case that:

At the start of the match, stacking resilience is the best, but as you get debuffed (if the other team is good and your dps can't down their tank/fc) your resilience gets more and more meaningless.

The guy was making his case for stacking Stamina instead, since at the start of the match it is ok, but is more and more effective as you get debuffed, at least your health pool is large.

Thoughts?
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100 Human Warrior
12555
No, I say resilience will come out on top of Stamina simply because ultimately, Stamina does nothing but increase your health pool. That may sound good, but resilience's direct reduction of ALL damage taken will be superior. For example:

I don't know how many blue sockets are on the PvP gear, but from memory I think there are something like 4.

If you're not a blacksmith, you're stuck with those four, and if you're not a JC, the best you can do are rare gems.

Four Solid River's Hearts = 960 Stamina = 15.8k health for a Prot Warrior.

Now let's assume the best-case scenario, that you're a BS (two extra any-color sockets) and a JC (Serpent's Eyes).

You now have 6 blue sockets, two of which can be filled with Solid Serpent's Eyes, 480 stamina each.

Two Solid Serpent's Eyes + Four Solid River's Hearts = 1920 Stamina = 31.6k health as a Prot Warrior. That's just not enough extra hp to justify the loss of flat damage reduction from resilience.

It's true in theory that holding the flag and acquiring multiple stacks of the debuff would cancel out your resilience, but if you stack Stamina, you have less to cancel out. Meaning, since the Focused Assault buff doesn't cancel out resilience, it increases damage taken, if you have 70% reduction from resilience and +20% damage taken from the flag carrying debuff, you'll have about 50% overall damage taken reduction, before armor and Mastery (which are not affected by the debuff). However, if you stack Stamina and forgo resilience, and have only 55% damage reduction in exchange for 25k more health, you'll now have effectively 35% damage reduction, and your bonus hp will be mashed down faster than the lesser amount of hp from the resilience-stacking FC.

Resilience stacking is also better for non-flag maps where you're defending a point, as you can increase your own health easily via Last Stand, Rallying Cry, and the Battlemaster's trinket, and the trinket plus one CD can even be macroed together. Get to below 35%hp, pop that macro and Shield Barrier to absorb incoming damage, and watch and laugh as you take no damage and your Second Wind ticks for 20k. Or do the same thing, with Enraged Regen or Impending Victory. It's all good.
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90 Pandaren Warrior
9230
im sorry but 200k crits on chaos bolts form locks makes me feel like stacking stam until im at a high enough hp to survive 1 fear...

also mastery will get you owned in bgs. everyone shoots fireballs nowadays or stabs you in the back
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I'll probably gem for resilience and/or stamina.

What would we reforge to? Mastery is nearly useless. I suppose we could forge for expertise to deal with the high parry rates against melee? I don't see any clear choices here.
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90 Human Warrior
8205
Awesome responses! Thanks, looks like Resilience is still the way to go.
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90 Human Warrior
3975
10/06/2012 09:04 AMPosted by Jorion
No, I say resilience will come out on top of Stamina simply because ultimately, Stamina does nothing but increase your health pool. That may sound good, but resilience's direct reduction of ALL damage taken will be superior.


I usually just have two stamina trinkets and the rest resilience if I'm going prot for FC, works perfectly. You WILL want to get some extra health simply because your a protection warrior and your job is to stay alive long enough for a heal to get on you and for 2nd wind.

There is a balance of course but lets say two 1300+ stamina trinkets giving you a huge increase in health is always going to be better than getting two other pieces of resil gear only netting you 5% more resilience reduction.
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90 Human Warrior
8205
So far, I have to say that FCing as Prot is still a lot of fun. I haven't been killed on a FC map yet in RBGS, the spec is just that good.

Between reslilience and our new Shield Barrier move, not to mention all our self healing, we will be damn near impossible to kill until the PVP weapons are available.

I am really thankful for this Heroic Leap glyph, anything that lets you get across the field faster is a good thing (just don't outrun your healers). I am also looking forward to getting my 4 PC Glad set for the speed boost following Heroic Leap.

Good times.
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85 Dwarf Shaman
1450
So far, I have to say that FCing as Prot is still a lot of fun. I haven't been killed on a FC map yet in RBGS, the spec is just that good.

Between reslilience and our new Shield Barrier move, not to mention all our self healing, we will be damn near impossible to kill until the PVP weapons are available.

I am really thankful for this Heroic Leap glyph, anything that lets you get across the field faster is a good thing (just don't outrun your healers). I am also looking forward to getting my 4 PC Glad set for the speed boost following Heroic Leap.

Good times.


Do you still spec protection on maps where no flag carrier is needed? or do you sit out the match, spec arms, or just stay protection and defend nodes?
Edited by Iwïn on 10/12/2012 9:43 AM PDT
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90 Human Warrior
8205
[quote]

Do you still spec protection on maps where no flag carrier is needed? or do you sit out the match, spec arms, or just stay protection and defend nodes?


Since MoP started I have had two Prot Specs and have yet found it necessary to make an Arms Spec. You can use any move in any stance now, so just stance dance to Battle Stance and your damage should be fine. I love Prot way too much to play anything else at this point. (NOTE: Speccing for FCIng is stacking reslience, stamina and other mitigation stats. Even if you do have an arms spec, it won't make a difference because you will not have hardly any damage increasing stats stacked to get the benefit of the offensive spec)

When it is not a Flag Carrier map, yep I lock down nodes like its my job. If you send a Prot Warrior and a Healer to any node, it isn't going anywhere. Just too much utility.

In AB I usually go BS with a healer to lock it down, in EOS I either go mid or DR, in the Minecart Map I usually go to the mid card with a dps.

I may make an arms spec, or just turn a Prot spec into a more offensive based one. Maybe put in Dragons Roar instead of Shockwave, but IDK, I love the 20 second cooldown of Shockwave... rather than the 1 minute CD on Dragons Roar...
Edited by Klaq on 10/12/2012 10:06 AM PDT
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