As a rogue in PVP.

90 Worgen Hunter
5455


Do you have any stats to back up your claim to rogues being the worst class in PvP? This is a position that has always been held by hunters since arena was introduced, every season, every expansion. Sounds to me like rogues got too used to the gravy train that's existed for them since Vanilla and can't handle being brought down to size.


Cataclysm called, hunters haven't been bad since wrath nerd.


If you paid attention to statistics, hunters were still the bottom in Cata. Also, you calling me a nerd as an insult is supremely ironic.
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90 Goblin Rogue
14150
Well can't say I didn't see it coming and I don't even pvp. If you think rogues are going to be competitive at the start of a new expansion you're gonna have a bad time.

T7, T11, T14 all rogues worst tiers and it's not fun, not fun at all.
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90 Orc Warrior
10290
Rogues could use some survivability buffs, they had their CD's gutted


Surviabilty is what SHOULD have been nerfed.

The nerfs to their damage, control, and mobilty were excessive. Rogues should hit hard, use unfair tactics (hence why they should have the CC) and move quickly. What they shouldn't be able to do is facetank damage. That simply isn't very rogue like.
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6 Goblin Rogue
0
10/05/2012 05:40 AMPosted by Lochnar
Rogues could use some survivability buffs, they had their CD's gutted


Surviabilty is what SHOULD have been nerfed.

The nerfs to their damage, control, and mobilty were excessive. Rogues should hit hard, use unfair tactics (hence why they should have the CC) and move quickly. What they shouldn't be able to do is facetank damage. That simply isn't very rogue like.


Yeah, it's ridiculous that they've decided to make rogues more tanky than warriors and warriors get far more burst than rogues.
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90 Undead Rogue
13680
10/05/2012 05:40 AMPosted by Lochnar
Rogues could use some survivability buffs, they had their CD's gutted


Surviabilty is what SHOULD have been nerfed.

The nerfs to their damage, control, and mobilty were excessive. Rogues should hit hard, use unfair tactics (hence why they should have the CC) and move quickly. What they shouldn't be able to do is facetank damage. That simply isn't very rogue like.

I agree, but with the state that the game is in, it's impossible for a class to exist now without some defensive buffers. Though I personally think the following:
- make Recuperate a passive - same effect, but always on in Stealth. Not on when out of Stealth. Remove the glyph and make it 3.5% base.
- Subtlety: make Sinister Calling allow Recuperate to trigger out of stealth, but at 1.5%/sec
- Assassination: give Sin Deadened Nerves back
- Combat: give Combat the old Sub Setup talent (+1CP for any dodge/resist). Reward a weak-damage spec offensively for defenses.
- allow Combat Readiness to be used while CCed.
Edited by Kanoi on 10/5/2012 12:00 PM PDT
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64 Worgen Hunter
8150
Discussion is pretty futile at this point. They read these forums; they know rogues are lacking. But that doesn't mean they'll do anything for a long time to come.

It feels a lot like that scene from The Empire Strikes Back where Vader tells Lando, "I have altered the deal. Pray I do not alter it further"

But instead of altering the deal, they're nerfing rogues with careless abandon and with no intentions of listening to us on anything.

Just pray they don't nerf us further, I suppose.
Edited by Derpenstein on 10/5/2012 2:38 PM PDT
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6 Goblin Rogue
0
10/05/2012 02:37 PMPosted by Derpenstein
Discussion is pretty futile at this point. They read these forums; they know rogues are lacking. But that doesn't mean they'll do anything for a long time to come.


Discussion on these boards is always futile, unless the topic reaches critical mass and blizzard finally caves, like they did with the inception of rated battlegrounds. Although, that was a horrible idea from the great unwashed and even more horrible that blizzard decided to capitulate, so perhaps a bad analogy.
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90 Human Warrior
10675
Rogues are now balanced and require somewhat minimal skill and effort every other class needs to put in for a kill.

Welcome to balance it's fun down here.
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90 Undead Priest
8735
10/05/2012 05:40 AMPosted by Lochnar
Rogues could use some survivability buffs, they had their CD's gutted


Surviabilty is what SHOULD have been nerfed.

The nerfs to their damage, control, and mobilty were excessive. Rogues should hit hard, use unfair tactics (hence why they should have the CC) and move quickly. What they shouldn't be able to do is facetank damage. That simply isn't very rogue like.


I completely agree with this. When the game first released, I felt like rogues were the melee mages. Glass cannons, capable of huge damage, and slippery when pressured, but couldn't take a hit if you touched them. I don't want to see rogue tanky. I love my rogue, but it is pretty ridiculous to me.

Shadowstep should have a 15 second cooldown, and work while rooted, like in TBC. Not that I think that would fix the class, I am just putting it out there.
Edited by Brianjosel on 10/6/2012 5:40 AM PDT
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Rogues are still good, it just feels gimped because most players are still too accustomed to the "high" from Cataclysm.
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90 Human Rogue
10795
10/06/2012 05:50 AMPosted by Taunque
Rogues are still good, it just feels gimped because most players are still too accustomed to the "high" from Cataclysm.


Peel or CC the dance and the rogue is useless. Rogues are horrible right now, no problem admitting it.
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90 Undead Rogue
10365
Seeing warriors say "rogues require skill like the rest of us now" makes me giggle.
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86 Goblin Hunter
3145
Rogues are the new 3 minute "mages". Every 3 minute I can pop ShB, Dance and Vanish for another opener to finish off. Then blind/spint away.

I should race switch to Pandaren, then I literally would be a "Sad Panda".


That's the thing about cds, a level 10 mage with frost nova can make you blow a 3 min cd if you're specced prep instead of ss. So do we make ss baseline thereby making rogues less cd dependent? I'd say no since then they have both options of being tanky w/out cds and OP with cds like in cata.

Other than maybe poisons rogues are fine and I'm sure they'll be better as the season goes on. Happens at the beginning of every xpac.
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85 Undead Warlock
6345
Oh noze rogues dont have an auto answer for every hairy situation and just cant skate free anymore.

FYI learn to adapt to the vision that blizzard has planned for you.
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86 Goblin Hunter
3145


That's the thing about cds, a level 10 mage with frost nova can make you blow a 3 min cd if you're specced prep instead of ss. So do we make ss baseline thereby making rogues less cd dependent? I'd say no since then they have both options of being tanky w/out cds and OP with cds like in cata.

Other than maybe poisons rogues are fine and I'm sure they'll be better as the season goes on. Happens at the beginning of every xpac.


rogues being tanky? where?


Rogues were THE tankiest melee class in cata more so than warriors and dks who got gibbed instantly. Recoup, cheat death, clos + vanish. evasion. and combat readiness made rogues very tanky.
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90 Human Warlock
14290
Oh noze rogues dont have an auto answer for every hairy situation and just cant skate free anymore.

FYI learn to adapt to the vision that blizzard has planned for you.


What get kited to death, and explode the moment cloak of shadows is on cd?

State of rogues mobility and defense is non-existent, stop thinking other wise, you know nothing about the class as you demonstrated with an idiotic post, probably trolling; giving me the reason to flag your post.
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85 Undead Warlock
6345
10/06/2012 12:17 PMPosted by Ilyrria
probably trolling; giving me the reason to flag your post.
Oh, shut up!
Edited by Dochaelian on 10/6/2012 1:34 PM PDT
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