Windwalker mastery needs a change

The mechanics behind Combo Breaker are pretty... iffy. It sounds good on paper to have a Chi ability become free to use, but in practice, it actually promotes wasting resources. When we get a Combo Breaker proc, we need to use it immediately. When we use a Combo Breaker proc, that's a GCD we aren't using jab, and are therefore not using our energy on anything. This diminishes the value of Haste greatly as well, making two secondary stats on our gear undesirable in the long run.

I don't think a spec mastery that ends up being a DPS loss to have is a good mechanic by any stretch of the imagination, and definitely needs to be revisited. This problem is only going to get worse as gear levels increase, after all.
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90 Pandaren Monk
9520
I'm certainly no numbers expert, but how could a resource-free Chi attack account for a dps loss?
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100 Blood Elf Monk
11225
I would like to have enough energy for things other than jab. (Expel Harm, interrupt)
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100 Night Elf Monk
15300
If your doing rotation right you should not have a problem keeping energy down and still spending mastery procs. I agree the mastery feels just thrown together but it helps thin out your rotation and prevent free gcds.
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10/03/2012 11:47 PMPosted by Mayliene
I'm certainly no numbers expert, but how could a resource-free Chi attack account for a dps loss?


It "is" a good thing, as Tiger Palm and Blackout Kick are both more damage than a single Jab would have been.

The problem is, using these free abilities causes you to continue generating energy within that GCD, and it also causes you to sit on your current level of Chi. So you're not spending either of your resources, and that's making the generate-spend-spend-generate "rotation" really off. It's the same reason that there are haste thresholds for Rogues.

This is more of a problem during any sort of haste proc from enchants, trinkets, etc and cooldowns such as Bloodlust/Heroism and Energizing brew than anything. A single proc of Combo Breaker during either one can - and probably will - cap your energy, which is wasted resources.
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10/04/2012 12:04 AMPosted by Wrongfu
If your doing rotation right you should not have a problem keeping energy down and still spending mastery procs. I agree the mastery feels just thrown together but it helps thin out your rotation and prevent free gcds.


I am doing my rotation properly. Even then, with my gear not even being that good, I'm still energy capping constantly, and it gets even worse when I get back-to-back Combo Breaker procs. I should feel rewarded - excited even - when I get a mastery proc. I should never see a button light up and think to myself, "Well crap, how am I going to fit this in?"
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90 Pandaren Monk
8380
10/04/2012 12:04 AMPosted by Wrongfu
If your doing rotation right you should not have a problem keeping energy down and still spending mastery procs. I agree the mastery feels just thrown together but it helps thin out your rotation and prevent free gcds.


Keeping low energy is generally bad practice and you should try to float around 50-70 at all times unless you are about to use fists of fury. Also, keeping chi high is good practice as well so that you can use procs like the mastery and work in RSK or Fists of Fury as they come off cd.
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100 Human Monk
9215
10/04/2012 12:04 AMPosted by Wrongfu
If your doing rotation right you should not have a problem keeping energy down and still spending mastery procs.


Plus, the mastery is fun! No accounting for taste I suppose.
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90 Night Elf Monk
14435
Makes me wonder why they don't make the mastery give us a free no CD Touch of Death that deals 50% of our health bar instead or something. That would be more interesting imo.
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I see more PvP value for this mastery than PvE. Since in PvP you want to go more single-target, and when you're playing single target it's harder to keep up with the GCD, at least that's what I'v e noticed.
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100 Pandaren Monk
20775
Mastery would be nice if it would just fire off the free one on top of a normal casted TP or BoK that way it consumes less GCDs and we're more open. We're going to face serious GCD issues with energy capping next tier and the last without change.
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90 Pandaren Monk
10085
Windwalker mastery is unique in that it is the only mastery that does not directly contribute damage in some way. Blizzard already made a mastery like this at one point, with ret paladins, but then about 2 years ago they completely redesigned it because it was all sorts of garbage.

From the crab with the nerfbat himself:
"Mastery is a new stat for us, and there are a few specs that don’t value it enough. In some cases (e.g. Combat rogues), the design for mastery is fine and we just need to buff the effects to make it more desirable. In others, we don’t think it’s possible to buff mastery enough in its current form. For example, the Retribution mastery, Hand of Light, is fun, but it doesn’t contribute enough damage. To make it contribute enough damage, the proc would need a very high chance, which then can cause paladins to devalue other sources of Holy Power. Instead, we are redesigning Retribution mastery to add a percentage of the damage of Templar’s Verdict, Crusader Strike, and Divine Storm as Holy damage (which also plays better with Inqusition). Because Hand of Light is fun, however, we are going to change Divine Purpose as a chance to proc Hand of Light instead of a chance for extra Holy Power (which will also remove a little of the randomness from the rotation). Unholy DKs are another spec for whom mastery just isn’t working out. Our current intent is to redesign their mastery so that their attacks cause more damage to diseased targets (in a similar manner to the Restoration druid mastery)."

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/1829962
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85 Blood Elf Warlock
2570
I love Combo Breaker, however I feel like its something that should have been made a naturally learned trait by ww at a lower level and something else should be our mastery. It feels sort of like Divine purpose, but would want a mastery that was really more of a mastery.
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90 Pandaren Monk
10085
I would actually like them to do what they did with paladins. Give us something else as a mastery, and put combo breaker into our talents or something. It wouldn't be nearly as bad if it was a talent instead of mastery.
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90 Human Monk
7815
We really do need a new mastery. This type of mastery didn't work on Paladins why would it work on Monks?
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90 Pandaren Monk
10085
10/07/2012 07:00 PMPosted by Moine
We really do need a new mastery. This type of mastery didn't work on Paladins why would it work on Monks?


One really good question I think is why did they try it again when it was such an obvious failure before?
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90 Pandaren Monk
8850
The mechanics behind Combo Breaker are pretty... iffy. It sounds good on paper to have a Chi ability become free to use, but in practice, it actually promotes wasting resources. When we get a Combo Breaker proc, we need to use it immediately. When we use a Combo Breaker proc, that's a GCD we aren't using jab, and are therefore not using our energy on anything. This diminishes the value of Haste greatly as well, making two secondary stats on our gear undesirable in the long run.

I don't think a spec mastery that ends up being a DPS loss to have is a good mechanic by any stretch of the imagination, and definitely needs to be revisited. This problem is only going to get worse as gear levels increase, after all.


"When we get a Combo Breaker proc, we need to use it immediately. "

Not true. The buff lasts for a long enough time for you to Jab, or RSK, or do whatever else you need. Combo Breaker is also nice for situations where you are energy starved. They act as filler until your next jab to keep your DPS up.

Although, in the long run, it's still a fairly bland mastery. I'd prefer if it gave us a chance to reset the cooldown of RSK.
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90 Pandaren Monk
10085
So wait you're saying that even when it's procced, you're going to wait until you've jabbed again and consequently you've probably missed another proc in some situations? Essentially you're saying that the mastery is not going to be used 100% of the time.
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90 Human Monk
5685
The mechanics behind Combo Breaker are pretty... iffy. It sounds good on paper to have a Chi ability become free to use, but in practice, it actually promotes wasting resources. When we get a Combo Breaker proc, we need to use it immediately. When we use a Combo Breaker proc, that's a GCD we aren't using jab, and are therefore not using our energy on anything. This diminishes the value of Haste greatly as well, making two secondary stats on our gear undesirable in the long run.

I don't think a spec mastery that ends up being a DPS loss to have is a good mechanic by any stretch of the imagination, and definitely needs to be revisited. This problem is only going to get worse as gear levels increase, after all.


"When we get a Combo Breaker proc, we need to use it immediately. "

Not true. The buff lasts for a long enough time for you to Jab, or RSK, or do whatever else you need. Combo Breaker is also nice for situations where you are energy starved. They act as filler until your next jab to keep your DPS up.

Although, in the long run, it's still a fairly bland mastery. I'd prefer if it gave us a chance to reset the cooldown of RSK.


Reset cooldown is really not a very good mechanic, just ask Elemental shaman and boomies. its sporadic and frequently occurs when the cooldown is almost finished anyways. Its both a loss to cancel your current cast to make use of it, and to not do so, because then it is off CD and you aren't using it.

It would be good if the proc made it so that your next Rising Tiger kick costs no Chi and does not incur a cooldown, but then its the same thing as what we have now but for RTK instead of BoK.
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12 Pandaren Monk
8000
WW monks are horrible at higher levels they can't even tank well and I think blizzards only use was to make monks e healer fill in class. Nobody wants to play a clunky class that only leaves you with 1 spec option..
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