DK's Voted Most Unpopular Class Due to Lore

90 Blood Elf Death Knight
9260
The Ebon Blade was made to stop the horrors of Undeath be visited on others.

I would love a Judge Dredd-esqe Death Knight character for the Alliance.

The shadow does not forgive, The Shadow does not forgive, The shadow does not show mercy.

Death Knights as a foil to Paladins can be just as a equal untiring weapon of justice.
Pretty much how I see DK's being used. If Paladins are Captain America, DK's are The Punisher. Granted I'd also personally see some DK's trying to take up their old lives and whether they succeed or not. WoW certainly could have some Friendly Neighborhood Vampires. Or in this case Death Knights.


I completely agree. I actually prefer the idea that DKs feel a little bit lost, it gives room to come up with your own story, For Ecrulis, after the Northrend campaign he almost immediately took up arms with the forsaken, seeing them more as kin than the Blood Elves, but more recently I had him accidentally reunite with his wife, a Paladin from Silvermoon, and she has made a mission out of trying to balance the darkness in him and point him in a direction that is predominantly good.

My point is I like that we this freedom to come up with almost anything in terms of DKs own personal story not everything has to be defined point by point by blizzard, this is an RPG after all.
Edited by Ecrulis on 10/12/2012 12:45 PM PDT
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
10080

Pretty much how I see DK's being used. If Paladins are Captain America, DK's are The Punisher. Granted I'd also personally see some DK's trying to take up their old lives and whether they succeed or not. WoW certainly could have some Friendly Neighborhood Vampires. Or in this case Death Knights.


I completely agree. I actually prefer the idea that DKs feel a little bit lost, it gives room to come up with your own story, For Ecrulis, after the Northrend campaign he almost immediately took up arms with the forsaken, seeing them more as kin than the Blood Elves, but more recently I had him accidentally reunite with his wife, a Paladin from Silvermoon, and she has made a mission out of trying to balance the darkness in him and point him in a direction that is predominantly good.

(I mean there is a reason Paladins in DnD tend to be horribly boring, and WoW paladins are way more open, in no way are they restricted to being lawful good. Let's allow DK's that same freedom is all.)

My point is I like that we this freedom to come up with almost anything in terms of DKs own personal story not everything has to be defined point by point by blizzard, this is an RPG after all.
I suppose I mean I guess I would personally like to see some of the serious restrictions on DK roleplaying kinda lifted. The whole DK 'curse' thing in particular. Granted that is a lot focused on my own hatred of the idea and how it would force all DK's to be super grimdark. I'd rather that thread forgotten and other threads followed, like DK's torn between the Ebon Blade and their faction, or that dark shadowy power Arthas's hinted at in The Power to Destroy. Just see some canonical lifting rather than my own willful ignorance of them, allowing DK's to be more open.
Edited by Kailiì on 10/12/2012 1:09 PM PDT
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100 Draenei Death Knight
12345


I completely agree. I actually prefer the idea that DKs feel a little bit lost, it gives room to come up with your own story, For Ecrulis, after the Northrend campaign he almost immediately took up arms with the forsaken, seeing them more as kin than the Blood Elves, but more recently I had him accidentally reunite with his wife, a Paladin from Silvermoon, and she has made a mission out of trying to balance the darkness in him and point him in a direction that is predominantly good.

(I mean there is a reason Paladins in DnD tend to be horribly boring, and WoW paladins are way more open, in no way are they restricted to being lawful good. Let's allow DK's that same freedom is all.)

My point is I like that we this freedom to come up with almost anything in terms of DKs own personal story not everything has to be defined point by point by blizzard, this is an RPG after all.
I suppose I mean I guess I would personally like to see some of the serious restrictions on DK roleplaying kinda lifted. The whole DK 'curse' thing in particular. Granted that is a lot focused on my own hatred of the idea and how it would force all DK's to be super grimdark. I'd rather that thread forgotten and other threads followed, like DK's torn between the Ebon Blade and their faction, or that dark shadowy power Arthas's hinted at in The Power to Destroy. Just see some canonical lifting rather than my own willful ignorance of them, allowing DK's to be more open.


Maybe roll a warrior?
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1 Blood Elf Rogue
0
I'm confused as to why there's a need for a "purpose" in the first place?

I mean, most classes don't really have a defined "purpose" outside some very vague idea of where they fit into the structure of the alliance and horde respectively. Why do Death Knights need to be different?
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90 Blood Elf Death Knight
7190
Need a purpose, death knights? Join the Forsaken.

And don't let that little incident with Koltira turn you off because everyone knows he deserved what he got.

Forsaken need more undead orc.
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90 Draenei Death Knight
8690
I had a particular setup for my DK which, happily enough, can be summed up by Doctor Who.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Town_Called_Mercy

Innocent victim turned into weapon of war, check.
Obsessed with vengeance, check.
Achieves vengeance, left bereft of purpose, check.
Sets self up as guardian, check.
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90 Dwarf Paladin
14910
I'm confused as to why there's a need for a "purpose" in the first place?

I mean, most classes don't really have a defined "purpose" outside some very vague idea of where they fit into the structure of the alliance and horde respectively. Why do Death Knights need to be different?


Other classes can enjoy personal pursuits. They can live outside of class-defined box. They're free to find things cute, funny, or sexy as they see fit.

Basically other classes don't need to be violent all of the time, while Death Knights do. There's this unbreakable mold for Death Knights, where they can't really seem to enjoy themselves, unless they're physically tormenting others and even then there's a sense that they'd be wracked with guilt.

They're undead without the liberating sense of ammorality the Forsaken have.
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90 Orc Death Knight
13010
I honestly feel a lot of it is due to the fact that the Death Knight class itself almost seems to overshadow any sort of racial identity of the character.

The character is a Death Knight; it's really not the same as being an Orc Warrior or Human Paladin. You see those archetypes in game represented by NPCs, you don't really see any major NPC Death Knights. Death Knights are more or less "leftovers" from a previous expansion's story line.

I had issues when I dusted off my Blood Elf DK and started to play her more in the Firelands patch; she was just a left over from WotLK days in her black spikey armor and rune sword. But through the magic of a race change and transmog I have reclaimed a place in the current story line and lore! I have reclaimed a racial identity, one that can not be overshadowed by the Death Knight class!

rawr Troll.

A Troll Blood Drinker to be exact; you might remember me from such instances as ZF or ZG :)

In all seriousness, you really can't sit around and hope that Blizzard rolls out with new DK lore; you have to find some way of making your character fit in the current story in a way that makes sense to you. But I highly recommend a Troll makeover if you are a Horde Death Knight, it works wonders.
Edited by Zumbi on 10/13/2012 5:58 PM PDT
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90 Human Warrior
11900
Don't Death Knights need to cause suffering and pain to maintain their sanity?

Shouldn't they be sweating tiny Sha on a hot day in Pandaria?
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
10080
Don't Death Knights need to cause suffering and pain to maintain their sanity?

Shouldn't they be sweating tiny Sha on a hot day in Pandaria?
Pretty much a bit of what I was getting into when I said that DK's are very boxed in as characters. That need for suffering, which isn't expressed in game, just a cdev (>.>), demands you play a certain way, even more so than the very structured backstory and just being undead do. I deeply wish they'd get rid of that whole curse idea and just let DK's have to deal with the immense trauma of doing so pretty horrible things and being forcibly raised and controlled. Would help in making them just one more class, as it seems to be their idea, moving away from hero classes and all that.

@Cbredbeard: Yeah exactly that. It's as bad as say paladins in DnD, you box a class in so much, you do nothing but produce lame and one dimensional characters. You can easily keep the best elements of the class without making them these emo murder machines. That's what /Arthas/ wanted us to be, the DK story should be about them moving away from that to be more, rather than remaining the grimDark Knight.
Edited by Kailiì on 10/13/2012 10:59 PM PDT
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100 Blood Elf Warlock
10735
Don't Death Knights need to cause suffering and pain to maintain their sanity?

Shouldn't they be sweating tiny Sha on a hot day in Pandaria?


naw, the PC is "special" that is why forsaken and DKs can enter the green dragon shire, they can be the biggest mass murders on the planet while NPCs talk down to them/not know who they are, they can consort with dragon aspects/kings/titan wather and are all immune to sha for some reason that is never fully explained.
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100 Draenei Death Knight
12345
I think we are getting a little off track here from the original point. The problem wasn't that the DK's players had issues role playing themselves, it was the other classes didn't like us because THEY didn't see a reason why we should be here.
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
10080
10/13/2012 11:15 PMPosted by Amathyst
I think we are getting a little off track here from the original point. The problem wasn't that the DK's players had issues role playing themselves, it was the other classes didn't like us because THEY didn't see a reason why we should be here.
The issues are certainly related. I don't see any other class get as much hate on RP realms as DK's do. They are pretty much constantly mocked as being bad roleplayers. Now I am sure a great deal of it is huntard syndrome, but still I think there is some truth to that. Because of how narrow DK focus is, you can only make certain characters canon. This really limits DK roleplayers. If you expand on DK lore, either giving them a new purpose or lifting some of the restrictions upon roleplayers you get more varied characters and thus a lessened negative image.

I mean why is a death knight that is trying to deal with this trauma that happened to them and rejoin society so horrible, when you can have a paladin who finds those they believe are evil, captures them, and tortures and mutilates them in the name of justice?
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100 Blood Elf Warlock
10735
you could deal with a DK character in the Wheel of Time Dragon method.

in the book series, male wizzards for a lack of better term go mad and develope a leporacy like ailment if they use their powers, but if they dont use their powers they suffer and if cut off from their powers they become suicidal but safe from the bad things. they are feared and hunted because of this.

DKs work kind of the opposite, if they dont use their powers they suffer and go mad and death is the only certain cure. they are feared and employed because of this. and even with no direct goal they still exist and have potential to do good or evil as they choose.
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100 Draenei Death Knight
12345
you could deal with a DK character in the Wheel of Time Dragon method.

in the book series, male wizzards for a lack of better term go mad and develope a leporacy like ailment if they use their powers, but if they dont use their powers they suffer and if cut off from their powers they become suicidal but safe from the bad things. they are feared and hunted because of this.

DKs work kind of the opposite, if they dont use their powers they suffer and go mad and death is the only certain cure. they are feared and employed because of this. and even with no direct goal they still exist and have potential to do good or evil as they choose.


I don't think it should just be us to deal with it. Don't get me wrong I have nothing against role players but they are a small minority (one that shouldn't be ignored mind you). They need to give us more of a post wrath story. They've shed a bit of light on the non KotEB DK's but I would like to know what morgraine is up to other than sending a dk to go and do pet battles.
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90 Human Warlock
11180
10/09/2012 07:19 AMPosted by Tevinter
on the other hand I would like to see the Knight of the Ebon Blade canonically removed. The only thriving DK’s should be Horde DKs in which we should see attempts at reproduction.


Why is that? The Ebon Blade was one of the main forces that defeated the Lich King.


Yet Darion and his Ebon Blade barely showed up behind the paladins in ICC... DK's became irrelevant as soon as Wrath became "Tirion Fordrings Variety Hour!"
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100 Draenei Death Knight
12345
10/18/2012 08:37 AMPosted by Kythsara


Why is that? The Ebon Blade was one of the main forces that defeated the Lich King.


Yet Darion and his Ebon Blade barely showed up behind the paladins in ICC... DK's became irrelevant as soon as Wrath became "Tirion Fordrings Variety Hour!"


Yeah, I always thought that Morgraine should have gotten more spot light in hte citadel considering it was supposed to be a partner ship and the Death Knights were really the ones responsible for making head way towards the citadel. From What I remember the Paladins just kinda got air dropped and scattered by frostwyrms. KotEB,Killed those scourge lords towards the start of the zone, captured the shadow vault etc
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
10080


Yet Darion and his Ebon Blade barely showed up behind the paladins in ICC... DK's became irrelevant as soon as Wrath became "Tirion Fordrings Variety Hour!"


Yeah, I always thought that Morgraine should have gotten more spot light in hte citadel considering it was supposed to be a partner ship and the Death Knights were really the ones responsible for making head way towards the citadel. From What I remember the Paladins just kinda got air dropped and scattered by frostwyrms. KotEB,Killed those scourge lords towards the start of the zone, captured the shadow vault etc
Well to be frank I thought the entire Citadel was mishandled. Why did Tirion have the biggest claim to be there beyond being the most lawful goodest? Where was Sylvanas, where was Lor'themar, where was Muradin, where was Jaina? Where are all the people whose lives Arthas personally ruined, who knew him, who had a connection to him? They did the stupidity of bringing back Muradin, or erasing Ner'zhul, just leaving Arthas. They did nothing appropriate with it. Darion and the DK's getting shafted is just another checkmark on the wasted opportunities ICC created.
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Death Knights are ancient. They are as old as Paladins lorewise, dating back to Warcraft 2.

The only older classes are Warriors, Mages, Warlocks, and Priests.
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100 Human Paladin
17815
10/20/2012 06:37 PMPosted by Kailiì
Why did Tirion have the biggest claim to be there beyond being the most lawful goodest? Where was Sylvanas, where was Lor'themar, where was Muradin, where was Jaina?


Jaina and Sylvanas already challenged King Arthas and were completely outmatched. They knew facing him again would be tantamount to suicide.

Muradin was nearly killed by Deathbringer Saurfang. He, too, was out of his league.

Darion and the Ebon Blade had valuable knowledge about the Scourge, but they had little to contribute in an actual fight against the Lich King. Anything they could do, Arthas could do better.

You don't fight a fire with other, smaller fires... you fight it with water. That's where Tirion came in. The Lich King's only weakness was the Light, and Tirion (with the Ashbringer) was its greatest champion.

10/20/2012 06:37 PMPosted by Kailiì
Where are all the people whose lives Arthas personally ruined, who knew him, who had a connection to him?


Many of the characters who knew Arthas (Jaina, Muradin, Uther, Darion and Sylvanas) had something to say when he died... but that dialogue only played when someone finished the Shadowmourne questline.

10/20/2012 06:37 PMPosted by Kailiì
They did the stupidity of bringing back Muradin, or erasing Ner'zhul, just leaving Arthas.


Arthas's arrogance was the only reason he lost the war. Ner'zhul demonstrated more wisdom and foresight: had he remained part of the Lich King, victory against the Scourge would have been impossible.

Focusing on Arthas also made the conflict more personal. Almost everyone had a bone to pick with Arthas. Not many people knew that Ner'zhul was the original Lich King, and most who of those who knew Ner'zhul as a living orc were either dead or in Outland.
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