Rank 1 Frost Mage Streaming PVE

90 Troll Mage
12245
That's just for dailies, I use invocation for raids. Stream is up in 1080p

Working on heroic Elegon tonight:

http://www.twitch.tv/matto_eh
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90 Pandaren Mage
0
Hullo Audacity,

So I've been raiding as frost recently and it's been pretty fun. I like the tons of instant casts, especially with PoM and Alter Time. Concerning that combo, do you wait to pop AT until you have 2 FoF and BF up? Or do you just use it on cooldown? Most times I'll have a pet freeze or an orb coming off cooldown around the same time as PoM/AT/IV, but even if I use it, is it worth it to pop the CD at say only 1 FoF? My general rule of thumb is to get 2/3, whether just 2 FoF or an FoF and BF proc. To do this sometimes I'll pet freeze soon before AT/IV comes off CD and hope for a second proc of something before FoF wears off.

On another note, I think I'm not really performing at my maximum capacity (~60k DPS on 10m N Stone Guard), so I'm gonna spell out my rotation/priority list and hopefully you can comment :D

By the way my raiding glyphs/talents are PoM/NT/Invo and CoC/Ele/Ice Lance

I'll start off with a Frostbolt, then mage bomb (usually NT), then Frostboltx2 for the debuffs. On Stone Guard I'll pet nova right after for two FoF and then PoM/IV/AT, cast two ice lances (more if they proc, along with any BF procs) and then insta-frostbolt.

Somewhat related question here. Have you noticed the second PoM getting "clipped" by a currently casting frostbolt when AT expires? I'll see the buff go away, but I only see one frostbolt go out. I guess I could test this but I'm at work right now >.<

Anyway, once AT expires I'll cast another two ice lances and PoM frostbolt if it doesn't get clipped. At this point I'll send in the orb, get another couple of ice lances off, and start frostbolt spamming until I have to refresh Invocation or Nether Tempest, casting instants as they proc. I'll use pet nova and orb on CD (using up any procs beforehand and always making sure to hit at least two targets with each, if possible), and use PoM when it comes off CD (since its a perfect half CD of IV/AT). At this point it's rinse and repeat, the only real variation coming when PoM/IV/AT are coming off CD, so I'll start trying to stack procs.

I usually don't NT both targets. Should I? Also, should I keep 3 frostbolt stacks up on each of the two stone guards?

Also, for single target fights, such as on Feng, my DPS realllllly seems to lack. Like 50k to mid 40's, which is pretty dismal. Any pointers there?

Sorry if that's a lot to take in xD I just haven't raided seriously since vanilla (back when you needed to go frost for MC/BWL, seems like we've come full circle ;p )

Thanks for any advice!
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90 Pandaren Mage
0
Bamp.
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90 Troll Mage
12245
Your alter time usage sounds identical to mine. Off the pull pop everything, and get at least 2/3 or ideally 3/3 procs then pop AT, make sure you use any procs as they pop up in those 6 seconds because they'll disappear when it ends. Also make sure your trinkets proc before hitting AT, if they proc after you hit AT you'll get like 3 seconds of buff from them, then it'll disappear when AT finishes and they'll be on CD. Usually I'll orb before AT as well, to get FoF procs quicker on fights with only one target where I'd only get one charge from my pet freeze.

You definitely should be using NT on targets close enough to hit each other. Even when it's not cleaving, NT is higher dmg/cast than frostbolt, and when it is cleaving, it's our highest dmg/cast except for frozen orb. Also having it up on multiple targets procs more brain freezes.

I'll be streaming our raid tonight where we'll clear the first 3 on heroic then be working on Spirit Kings heroic if you want to see more.
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90 Troll Mage
12245
Stream on now, clearing first 3 heroic then working on Spirit Kings. Come watch people eat flanks etc

http://www.twitch.tv/matto_eh
Edited by Audacity on 10/24/2012 5:53 PM PDT
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90 Tauren Druid
0
Do you think its worth removing glyph of combust n use FFB > fb for fire? or with new nerfs to fire comming up just ditch it and start gettin use to frost. I've always been a fire mage (unless needed for certain bosses) so I'm kinda reluctant to go frost but I will if its a certain increase in dmg.
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90 Gnome Mage
8000
Audacity,

Did you used to be human, on Anetheron? Or have you always played on Mal'Ganis?
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100 Human Mage
7710
Very impressive, watched you on the first two bosses. Your UI is clean and crisp, could you go into your set up and add ons?

I salute your mastery of invocation, you had almost perfect uptime on that, only saw it fall down for a few seconds during the two boss fights I watched, and you found windows to get it cast despite all the raid damage going on, and being chained and whatnot. That can't be easy.
Edited by Deerde on 10/24/2012 9:30 PM PDT
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90 Pandaren Mage
0
Yeah I was duly impressed, Audacity, and thanks for the pointers! Keep it chilly bro.
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90 Troll Mage
12245
Thanks for the comments, much appreciated. I definitely find invocation usage (ie planning when to use it, or even moreso when not to use it) one of the most important parts of mage play right now.

10/24/2012 07:18 PMPosted by Pillarhumpin
Do you think its worth removing glyph of combust n use FFB > fb for fire? or with new nerfs to fire comming up just ditch it and start gettin use to frost. I've always been a fire mage (unless needed for certain bosses) so I'm kinda reluctant to go frost but I will if its a certain increase in dmg.

The glyph doesn't do anything for fire, it just lets you use that as your filler instead of fireball if you think it looks cooler (at the expense of a major glyph spot). I'd definitely recommend people give frost a shot, it does amazing damage, and much more consistently than fire.

Audacity, Did you used to be human, on Anetheron? Or have you always played on Mal'Ganis?

Never played on that server sorry. I've played on Shattered Hand for a while, and Stormscale back at 60/70.

10/24/2012 09:28 PMPosted by Deerde
Very impressive, watched you on the first two bosses. Your UI is clean and crisp, could you go into your set up and add ons?

My UI is composed of pretty basic addons, shadowed unit frames, bartender then TONS of weakauras. I use weak auras for tracking all my dps buffs/icds (very important for good alter time management), as well as many other things like some spell cooldowns, invocation etc. If more people are interested in them I could post them.
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90 Troll Mage
12245
Here's a Youtube video for our Heroic Feng kill last night. Got rank 1 as frost at 105k dps, and I think it's one of the highest parses of any dps specs on the fight.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=amrry7TfH1Q&feature=plcp
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100 Human Mage
7710
Waiting for your vid to load.

According to raidbots highest dps on Feng for any class is 114k. (A feral druid did it.) Best fire mage parse is 109k. Top frost mage parse is 105k, that must be yours. So far as I am concerned, your parse proves that frost can compete at the highest levels.

Are you using nether tempest exclusively as your bomb? How do you keep track of it on multiple targets? Is it really that much better than frost bomb?

I would like to hear more about your UI setup. IMO the stock UI is completely inadequate for dealing with stuff like invocation, and your superb setup goes a long ways towards minimizing information overload while at the same time telling you what you need to know. I love what you're doing here from an ergonomic standpoint, it is so efficient.

Edit: an EU frost mage named Sash just posted a 109k dps parse for this.
Edited by Deerde on 10/25/2012 1:21 PM PDT
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90 Human Mage
3710
10/15/2012 08:21 PMPosted by Audacity
Yeah feel free to ask questions in stream. Frost is very good right now, but fire will outscale it eventually :(


At what point does Fire overtake Frost?
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90 Tauren Shaman
9485
10/25/2012 04:01 PMPosted by Faqiha
Yeah feel free to ask questions in stream. Frost is very good right now, but fire will outscale it eventually :(


At what point does Fire overtake Frost?


While your progressing through HM's. In full Heroic tier fire comes out on top. But they are so close why would you care. Play what you like.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
12660
Waiting for your vid to load.

According to raidbots highest dps on Feng for any class is 114k. (A feral druid did it.) Best fire mage parse is 109k. Top frost mage parse is 105k, that must be yours. So far as I am concerned, your parse proves that frost can compete at the highest levels.

Are you using nether tempest exclusively as your bomb? How do you keep track of it on multiple targets? Is it really that much better than frost bomb?

I would like to hear more about your UI setup. IMO the stock UI is completely inadequate for dealing with stuff like invocation, and your superb setup goes a long ways towards minimizing information overload while at the same time telling you what you need to know. I love what you're doing here from an ergonomic standpoint, it is so efficient.

Edit: an EU frost mage named Sash just posted a 109k dps parse for this.

I raid with the default Blizzard UI and getting somewhat decent parses (top 30-100 depending on the fight). The only add-ons I really need are DBM and ForeXorcist. FX shows trinket ICDs in addition to its spell timer to more easily plan ahead for Alter Time casts. It's easily configurable, too.

Nether Tempest is much easier to use and do well with than Frost Bomb, especially with Invocation and multi-dotting potential. It also has the added bonus of being able to activate Light of the Cosmos.
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100 Human Mage
7710
The problem I'm having with nether tempest is telling when it has expired and needs to be refreshed. Especially on a mob that's got a bazillion debuffs. Not sure how you do this without an addon. With frost bomb you know when it has run its course as it will automatically give you a brain freeze proc.

This becomes even more complicated when dropping on multiple targets. What am I missing here?

Yuki, you have my respect for being able to post competitive parses with invocation without any addon tracking the buff. I flatly couldn't do this. It seems difficult enough to manage even with something like weakauras. I rapidly run into information overload if the buff information isn't being conveniently tracked. I suspect this is happening with many more average mages (and I am an average mage.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUwd737mioM
Edited by Deerde on 10/25/2012 5:30 PM PDT
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90 Troll Mage
12245
I use scorchio to track my bomb spells, I really like how you can have a stack of bars with the duration of the bomb, with your target being darker and non-targets being faded out. I also have weakauras set up to display flashing text that says "missing bomb" when in combat with a target selected that doesnt have a bomb spell (only for NT and LB obviously). Weakauras is great for setting up reminders like that for buffs/pets/spells coming off CD etc.

Will probably set up my stream in a bit, doing some gold challenge modes.
Edited by Audacity on 10/25/2012 5:45 PM PDT
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100 Human Mage
7710
Yeah, I used scorchio myself back when I raided as a fire mage in Wrath. Glad to see that one is still around and upgraded for the other bomb spells.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
12660
The problem I'm having with nether tempest is telling when it has expired and needs to be refreshed. Especially on a mob that's got a bazillion debuffs. Not sure how you do this without an addon. With frost bomb you know when it has run its course as it will automatically give you a brain freeze proc.

This becomes even more complicated when dropping on multiple targets. What am I missing here?

Yuki, you have my respect for being able to post competitive parses with invocation without any addon tracking the buff. I flatly couldn't do this. It seems difficult enough to manage even with something like weakauras. I rapidly run into information overload if the buff information isn't being conveniently tracked. I suspect this is happening with many more average mages (and I am an average mage.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUwd737mioM

No, no, I do use an add-on to track my buffs and debuffs for all my characters: ForteXorcist. I have it configured to show trinket procs, Invocation, Lightweave, etc. for Alter Time. It also shows debuffs on mobs, including DoT ticks for Living Bomb and Nether Tempest and whatnot.

Here's a screenshot of FX in action:
http://i.imgur.com/CEg5Z.jpg
Edited by Yukiatsuruko on 10/25/2012 6:27 PM PDT
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100 Human Mage
7710
Thanks for the clarification, Yuki, I misunderstood your first post.
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